What did FF14 have right, at launch?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mirage

And they're not afraid to show some nipples either, it seems.

---

Honestly, XIV is already quite risque ('pillowhouses', miqo'te NPCs offering questionable services, leve quests involving creating jewelry for genital piercing, and of course my NPC companion talking about spontaneous orgies and sex with beastmen), and with Japan's lax outlook on nudity, I'm surprised XIV hasn't already crossed that line

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Elexia

Hmm...

Graphics...

Monsters actually were living breathing creatures unlike other MMOs where they're just kinda plopped down and have no "emotion".

....

---

What really hooked me, and how i hooked a friend, was the graphics engine. the game looked stunning. very few could come close, or had very ridiculous armor and obvious korean-grinder influences (Aion). the armor was realistic for the most part. how it looks is extremely important. but i think they focused a little too much on that, as gameplay suffered terribly.

I liked how it was unique as well. granted it was a little too unique. there was nothing familiar at all really. you had to create your own classes by essentially leveling everything.

I both liked and hated the fact you could use any ability on any character for the most part. I really didn't like the fact the traditional jobs were not present.

As some other people mentioned. they generated the right amount of hype.
---------------------------

Having played in Beta, i can say this is where things really really went south. A lot of stuff needed fixed.

The game was broken at that point. it was all over the forums. there was 'feed back' sections but for the most part they were only looking at hardware compatibility. having looked on both the JP and NA sides of the forums it was just sad how much was ignored by the devs at that time.

I think they have learned their lesson this time, but for the most part I saw the beta as an alpha. and the first 6 months were what the beta should have been.

My biggest worry right now is when beta starts for 2.0. The game is a lot more mature, but if they aren't taking all feedback seriously right from the beginning it's going to fail again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jocko

Honestly, XIV is already quite risque ('pillowhouses', miqo'te NPCs offering questionable services, leve quests involving creating jewelry for genital piercing, and of course my NPC companion talking about spontaneous orgies and sex with beastmen), and with Japan's lax outlook on nudity, I'm surprised XIV hasn't already crossed that line

---

Game would be ahit regardless of bugs and lag if it was x rated.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eekiki

I know I posted this in another thread, but another thing SE did right at launch was pre-release hype.

Whatever game SE was advertising in this trailer, this was the game I wanted to play.

---

It was a flat-out lie.

"Gods-decreed sacrifice" -> I haven't seen anyone be sacrificed yet. I saw a guy get run over by a Goobbue and Ifrit steal some crystal energy.

"War rages unchecked, with no sign of surcease." -> None of the NPCs except the Ala Mhigans were thinking Garlemald was going to go to war, nor was there any war actually going on until the GC Quests came about and now we have random Imperials all over and Beastmen trying to kill our hamlets.

Also most of the footage is the CGI or the opening cutscene or a player walking in an area you don't go to very often at all.

• MONSTER BEHAVIOURS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (Bring it back in 2.0! It's ridiculous to have monsters act like robots -- please!!!)

• Physical and class levels were split (give me back my physical level! ;_; ).

• More cross-class abilities (but I prefer the ability-scaling-to-your-level feature we have now -- stronger!).

• Disciplines of the Hand and Land were seen as a true adventurer classes, not complements (but with Hamlet defence, we are slowly seeing it come back -- I still maintain having basic fighting abilities and party bonus skills would have been more awesome).

• Stamina and SP, but they were poorly implemented (they definitively could have been better, but Yoshi-P decided to go with the standard exp path and timers -- he did the change well though!)

There are probably more, or not. Don't be mistaken though, I much prefer the current version than what we had overall (and where it was headed). These are just specific things that I believe could have been kept to make it even more awesome.

Graphics. Shiny shiny graphics.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jocko

and of course my NPC companion talking about spontaneous orgies and sex with beastmen)

---

...why do I not remember this? XD; Just what companion did you choose, anyway? Nothing of the sort coming from mine (female Duskwight Elezen).

On-topic, Jinko said it pretty well. I really can't think of a single thing the game had right at launch personally. Whatever may have been there was probably blocked out by how absolutely horrible every single other aspect of the game was.

Aside from Monster AI and maybe the graphics ? nothing else, everything else was really horrible....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tricksy

I think there are alot of things. Im just going to say one though.

The idea of SP, and how it was accumulated by using abilities.

Yes I know there was issues with it. But instead of dealing with those issues they removed it altogether and tacked on a generic XP system. Unfortunate in my eyes. An innovative, or at least uncommon, feature removed instead of ironed out.

EDIT:
I don't give a rats behind how messed up something was at launch. Im asking what concepts or features they had that you were a fan of, regardless of the issues that plagued them.

In my opinion it was bugs and lack of effort and quality that ruined FF14 at launch, not the ideas and features in the game. Its just that almost everything was laggy and half baked. Instead of fixing these interesting features, most were just axed and common MMO features were slapped on.

---

With the OP's edits in mind, this is my list -

• Lack of auto-attack (as someone that used to hate voicechat, I hate auto-attack even more; I'd rather use voicechat 100% of the time than ever see auto-attack again)
• Character Models
• Realistic Aesthetics & Terrain (Thanalan actually looks like a savannah; Coerthas actually looks like a north mountainous region; La Noscea looks like an islands plain; only place that is screwed up is The Black Shroud - but that's because even in RL, even the best natural forests/jungles suck big)
• PLvl/CRank/SP System
• NPC Companions ('specially my Miqo'te NPC companion!)
• Mob AI
• Technocracy (Garlemaid is likely a technocratic republic, making them instantly awesome)
• Feeling of being more like a mercenary instead of a simpleminded adventurer.
• Optimal Level/Class Gear
• THM-Healer
• Conj-DD
• Stamina
• Self-Respect
• Artistic Integrity
• Artistic Vision
• Collision Detection

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bobbygunz

Of course it's worth asking, because otherwise the wholesale destruction/change of FFXIV could be for the worse if SE are set upon removing features which don't need changing in the first place.

---

And never mind the fact we're talking opinions here. No one is being forced to respond to the OP.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jocko

Honestly, XIV is already quite risque ('pillowhouses', miqo'te NPCs offering questionable services, leve quests involving creating jewelry for genital piercing, and of course my NPC companion talking about spontaneous orgies and sex with beastmen), and with Japan's lax outlook on nudity, I'm surprised XIV hasn't already crossed that line

---

It's because SE appeals to the western world just as much, y'know? The same western world that believes anything with a nude human must hereby be sexual in nature, the same group of people that believe that because they think of women's breasts as sexual toys, so too must everyone else.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Amherst

...why do I not remember this? XD; Just what companion did you choose, anyway? Nothing of the sort coming from mine (female Duskwight Elezen).

On-topic, Jinko said it pretty well. I really can't think of a single thing the game had right at launch personally. Whatever may have been there was probably blocked out by how absolutely horrible every single other aspect of the game was.

---

It's the Miqo'te companion.

I'd say the design and coloring of the gear was much more realistic/historical and gave the world a concrete feel.

Things are getting a bit too outrageous now with Ul'dah looking more and more like a mardi-gras parade every day.

Me: *cooking*
(Aldgoats breathing down my neck curiously watching)
Me: "Guys I have the strangest feeling that I'm being watched... I'm scurrred."

What strikes me about the issues this thread brings up is that most of the complaints we had about the game are now pretty much nixed, aside from the UI/game/server engines.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Denmo

What strikes me about the issues this thread brings up is that most of the complaints we had about the game are now pretty much nixed, aside from the UI/game/server engines.

---

Thats because all those people stopped playing.

Whiteknights are going to ruin this game.

"Oh Yoshi! You have fixed everything! You are so amazing! Want a beer! "

2 months after 2.0

"Where'd Denmo go?"

"Oh he left FF14 and went back playing WoW and whiteknighting other shitty games"

It was bugs, lag and broken mechanics that people complained about for the most part. Sure there was some stupidity on the devs parts such as Fatigue, but I have yet to see one person in this thread say "I loved Fatigue!"

So when you say people have stopped complaining, (which they have not, I think you probably cherry pick the threads and posts you read) what you are really seeing is

a. people who were turned off by the bug, lag and general brokenness no longer playing, therefore no longer able to use this forum and

b. 1.5 year long attempt by first Tanaka and then Yoshi to remove bugs, lag and brokenness from the game, which

c. usually came at the expense of the interesting features we are talking about and with some generic mmo feature tacked on in its place

The only thing I thought it had right at launch was combat. I thought it was pretty fun. I would say the graphics, but the engine is so unstable it's hard to say they got that right.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tricksy

Thats because all those people stopped playing.

Whiteknights are going to ruin this game.

"Oh Yoshi! You have fixed everything! You are so amazing! Want a beer! "

2 months after 2.0

"Where'd Denmo go?"

"Oh he left FF14 and went back playing WoW and whiteknighting other shitty games"

---

Why is having a positive opinion immediately brand someone a white knight? Everyone here has a clear understanding that the game has a lot of flaws. But that doesn't mean "everything" was bad, there are things people like, there are some that people don't. Denmo is right, most of the complaints do revolve around the UI, game, and server engines. If all of those were okay from the beginning, FFXIV wouldn't have gotten as harsh of treatment as it did.

Could the guildleve system work out? We won't ever know now, but besides the technical aspects, the worst thing about FFXIV was lack of content and the EXP/SP/Fatigue system.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Velhart

Why is having a positive opinion immediately brand someone a white knight? Everyone here has a clear understanding that the game has a lot of flaws. But that doesn't mean "everything" was bad, there are things people like, there are some that people don't. Denmo is right, most of the complaints do revolve around the UI, game, and server engines. If all of those were okay from the beginning, FFXIV wouldn't have gotten as harsh of treatment as it did.

Could the guildleve system work out? We won't ever know now, but besides the technical aspects, the worst thing about FFXIV was lack of content and the EXP/SP/Fatigue system.

---

I dont think you understand what he was getting at.

He was stating that by removing all the features SE removed, they successfully stopped complaints. My opinion is that they could have stuck with alot of the things they had but actually fixed them and people would have been even more happy then they are now having received some generic MMO features in place of what was there before. It seems you also believe that the game wasn't all that bad besides being rushed.

Furthermore, its mostly due to the game having nearly no population besides whiteknights and fanbois that complaints are less common.

And from what empirical evidence do you two pull the theory that "most people just didnt like the UI, game and engine"? Think you need to remember that this is all just opinions back and forth. Also, please explain what "UI, game and engine" even means?

UI I understand, and from people I have spoken to its either due to actual lag that they did not enjoy the use of the UI or due to its being dissimilar to WoW. Lag is lag and thats SE's fault. But if the UI was not laggy and unresponsive many people would not have been so turned off by it. And people who cannot play a video game because its UI is different from another video game they have played are the epitome of spoiled brats who cannot be bothered to give a game a few hours to get themselves acquainted with it.

"Game and engine" Engine I understand and agree with. What does game mean? Im at a loss. Do you mean the whole game? A specific feature of the game? Or are you just throwing the word "game" into your sentence as filler to make it look more full.

There were tonnes of complaints because almost every feature was broken in some way. This thread is to point out the features we liked, that were either removed, altered or still in the game. I agree that if the game released with no lag, better servers and a better optimized engine that it would have done well.

Personally I have no problem with a menu based video game UI. But as long as SE puts in options so WoW players can have their mouse "point and click" playing, while others can still have their menus and screens clear of buttons and junk, well its win win for everybody.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tricksy

It was bugs, lag and broken mechanics that people complained about for the most part. Sure there was some stupidity on the devs parts such as Fatigue, but I have yet to see one person in this thread say "I loved Fatigue!"

So when you say people have stopped complaining, (which they have not, I think you probably cherry pick the threads and posts you read) what you are really seeing is

a. people who were turned off by the bug, lag and general brokenness no longer playing, therefore no longer able to use this forum and

b. 1.5 year long attempt by first Tanaka and then Yoshi to remove bugs, lag and brokenness from the game, which

c. usually came at the expense of the interesting features we are talking about and with some generic mmo feature tacked on in its place

---

And don't forget that people either don't understand the difference between a broken engine and features used in a broken engine or refuse to just to push their own agenda (AKA the auction house supporters).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dragon

It's the Miqo'te companion.

---

Actually it happened with the female Hyur companion too.

A lot of the ideas at launch had potential but were unfinished and poorly implemented. Some of them could be good if tweaked or actually finished but the game was pushed out in the state we got it in. They made some incredibly stupid decisions in how to implement the half-finished systems though and a lot of them were made even worse because of it.

Fortunately or unfortunately this is now Yoshida's game and he's going to do with it mostly as he sees fit. 2.0 is going to be where we all have to decide if it's the game we want to play.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tricksy

I dont think you understand what he was getting at.

He was stating that by removing all the features SE removed, they successfully stopped complaints. My opinion is that they could have stuck with alot of the things they had but actually fixed them and people would have been even more happy then they are now having received some generic MMO features in place of what was there before. It seems you also believe that the game wasn't all that bad besides being rushed.

---

Some things were just necessary to remove and should of never existed in the first place. Primarily the Fatigue system, which almost no one was for. How did they fix this? They remove it and put common sense EXP mechanics in. Not to mention, they made it even better with the rested EXP bonus system. Instead of being punished for playing too much, you were rewarded if you rested from the game for a period of time. This is how the system should of worked before then.

You also have to acknowledge for 2.0, it is a whole new approach to the game and some features currently in the game right now just simply won't work for it and has to be removed, rather people agree with it or not. Just how it is.

Quote:

---

Furthermore, its mostly due to the game having nearly no population besides whiteknights and fanbois that complaints are less common.

---

A large amount of threads in this forums are all based around complaints towards the current version. The only people complaining are the fan boys, because the people who don't care about the game just quit and went to something else.

Quote:

---

And from what empirical evidence do you two pull the theory that "most people just didnt like the UI, game and engine"? Think you need to remember that this is all just opinions back and forth. Also, please explain what "UI, game and engine" even means?

---

UI as in your basic menu interface and "go to" buttons. Game mechanics such as battle flow and abilities. Engine as in server engines that are keeping the game up and latency.

Quote:

---

UI I understand, and from people I have spoken to its either due to actual lag that they did not enjoy the use of the UI or due to its being dissimilar to WoW. Lag is lag and thats SE's fault. But if the UI was not laggy and unresponsive many people would not have been so turned off by it. And people who cannot play a video game because its UI is different from another video game they have played are the epitome of spoiled brats who cannot be bothered to give a game a few hours to get themselves acquainted with it.

---

Its a matter of opinion here, but I like quick drag and dropping more than the current system. I don't like to take a long time to sell my items, I would just like to right click on it and it sells to the vendor. This is a standard today. FFXI, that is just how the standard was then, especially working with a controller based interface.

While the controller interface isn't that bad, the keyboard+mouse setup is not that great, and it will be a big turn off for newer players, since a lot like using the mouse+keyboard interface, and it was a big turn off for players at FFXIV's original launch. So I believe the new interface will help more than hurt. Not to mention, 2.0 has two completely different interfaces. One based on controller mechanics, and one for keyboard+mouse mechanics. You might like the new setups better, so lets see what happens in the coming months.

Quote:

---

There were tonnes of complaints because almost every feature was broken in some way. This thread is to point out the features we liked, that were either removed, altered or still in the game. I agree that if the game released with no lag, better servers and a better optimized engine that it would have done well.

---

It may as well worked out in the end, who knows. SE believes this is the better route, and I have faith in them.

Quote:

---

Personally I have no problem with a menu based video game UI. But as long as SE puts in options so WoW players can have their mouse "point and click" playing, while others can still have their menus and screens clear of buttons and junk, well its win win for everybody.

---

Yep, that is what he aims for. He put it in a great way in comparing it to FPS's. When people play an FPS, they expect a certain familiarity with it, and once you get comfortable with that, then you bring along the unique features to that familiarity that spices things up. That is the approach for 2.0 it seems like, and so far, it is looking well. People can say "WoW clone", but it is just following a standard like FPS's have been using since the early 90's. It is just how I look at it, and why I welcome it.

I was gonna say graphics, but after thinking about it better and realizing the problem with the server structure, I re-thought it. So, my answer is NOTHING.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mirage

FF14 has good character models/textures and animations, but the game's graphics as a whole aren't really cutting edge.

First, there's the poort LOD blending going from background to foreground that looks terrible no matter how high you set your settings, and then there's a distinct lack of dynamic shadows. Additionally, the graphics engine is really inefficient. To be quite honest, the original Crysis has better (or at least just as good) graphics than FF14, and doesn't need as powerful a computer to deliver them. That game is also like 4 years old, and the only thing FF14 does better is character models. Better character models are however a sign of 3D modellers doing a good job, not engine programmers.

-edit-
Oh, right. I guess that is something that they did right. FF14 did have very good character models, I'll give them that. Now you can't accuse me of being a complete negative nancy.

---

Nobody is arguing with you about how bad Crystal Tools is.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tricksy

Thats because all those people stopped playing.

Whiteknights are going to ruin this game.

"Oh Yoshi! You have fixed everything! You are so amazing! Want a beer! "

2 months after 2.0

"Where'd Denmo go?"

"Oh he left FF14 and went back playing WoW and whiteknighting other shitty games"

---

I don't know what I did to you, but whatever.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Yucie

Nobody is arguing with you about how bad Crystal Tools is.

---

CT is a great engine actually. For MMOs? Nope.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

let's see i'll not only go on release, but go up til january after release.

1. armory system. i loved being able to customize my character to be able to maximize its usefulness in party or solo. being able to equip my character differently with abilities that were situational i absolutely loved the freedom.

2. the stamina gauge. i know alot of people hated it, but i much preferred the fast pace of combat to the slow pace that's set now. i enjoyed having complete control of my character so i could either regular attack or build up tp(as a mage) to use a special move.

3. incaps mobs. the visual incaps on the mobs i absolutely loved. from knocking the head off a skeleton, to flipping a toad upside down, to visually seeing the horn break off the great buffalo. i really wish they had expanded upon that allowing additional drops when they were done.

4. material drops. the fighting nm's that had material drops where you had to farm additional parts to make that best piece in the game. it kept the crafters, gatherers, and fighting classes needing each other to get a final piece of gear.

5. the original thm/con. the lore of both classes really seemed like they fit to me. i know the old ff's had each of them as a different set of abilities, but each ff has always added a twist to the classes. i liked the elements on con and light/dark of thm. i thought they were really well put together even though i do feel they had too many spells too early in the games lifetime. i loved the dot's and status effects from them.

6. the speed of leveling. after they got rid of the proc of sp i felt like the speed to rank up a class was close to my ideal speed. i feel it was much better than it is now.

7. crafting. i really loved the way to make gear you had to make individual parts and then assemble them. the realism i loved. there was alot of fixes needed(r40 hammerhead for a r19 hammer) to correct issues to make it great, but loved the idea behind it.

8. the mobs. mobs special actions. sneaking by a mob and it would look your way because it was looking to see what disturbed it. that went to get near it and even though it has no clue what it is that was insta attack.

i'm sure there are other things that i feel they did right on release, but it's too late to think at this time.

edit: 9. battle regimens. his was probably one of my favorite parts of the battle system. if you took the time and was with a good group you could just destroy mobs using them. it also told you really quickly if you were playing with a good and experienced player or a not so good player.

---

So right sir. Alas, how good the game used to be. I wish you were on my server so we could run Darkhold wishing it was like the good old days of Battle Regimens on Batraal. lol