Why the +/- Enmity stat needs to be abolished

Main hand materia lol. Look at you go

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Originally Posted by Aceofspades

Other then hate resets (wich are a pain in the padded ass, no doubt)

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That's weird. I've never had an issue with them. Maybe you should try using enmity gear.

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Originally Posted by Aceofspades

soo are you just trolling at this point? If you go with DLH armor, you dont get to stack ANYTHING, much less mind, and that gear lacks good numbers in that realm. Also, Mind can be put on main hand as well as enmity, soo knowing wich stat better suits that class is important when faced with the decision, " do I put gear on that gimps one stat completly just to op in another" or "when I stack materia, wich slotable stat is best for this job?" There is no truth in anything you said other then making a point that I have yet to clear two dungeons, if they were soloable, you could certainly call me out for such , but as you cant even enter without a party of 8 placing that solely on me is retarded. Any event that can be soloed, any boss that can be done defeated w/o a party, I have already beaten, soo whats your point exactly? "Ace cant get into a winning party or doesn't even try" ? How dose that make anything I have posted wrong and anything you have posted factual? IT DOESN'T lol, and you call me a joke? at least I know how to hold hate on a mob without taking a hit like bitch. grats on all that enmity, /sadface everytime you die and wipe the party because of it.

Wich brings me to my next point. Other then hate resets (wich are a pain in the padded ass, no doubt) why on earth would a pld need an ability to give them instant hate back after they raise from dieing? If your dieing, your failing at your job. Hate control is important but is only as good as your survivability and of those two aspects of tanking only one can be supported by the party and I will even give you a hint, its not survivability. soo before you try to "call me out" it helps to know wtf your talking about.

I can accept that there are many ways to tank, but reguardless of how you tank, the goal is the same (or at least it should be). Two main priorities, Stay alive and Keep hate. Both are equally important but only one can your party help you with. WHMS can buff you and heal you but that dosent support survivability, survivability is what makes your whms jobs easier, if you lack it you increase the chance of dieing and wipeing your party because of it.

As far as fighting dungeon main bosses go, I have fought both miser and chimera, I can do my job just fine. Its important to know that the success of both those fights lay heavly on the ENTIRE party not just the tank, soo to that point , you have no case. Any other flames can be directed to my "you dont know wtf your talking about" box, ty

and to adress the whole "my dark light has more stats" comment, this is further proof you are delusional, if you compair heavy darklight top to just the chest peice, then you are correct, but if you compair to both chest and head (wich is what the heavy darlight replaces, you are incorrect, and if your just compairing darklight plate , you are still incorrect and further proves you dont know wth your talking about when it comes to stats that help a tank. you honestly think the reason tanks no longer wear dlh armor is because they cant get em? what kind of snubby elitest bs is that? no one wears it because the stats dont help nearly as much as what can be stacked with materia. again, your dolusional, and/or are seeking some excuse as to why you can snub people who dont have dlh armor, maybe it makes you feel better bout yourself, i honestly dont know, and frankly I dont care, save your flames for someone who heeds anything you say as more then just another troll.

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Mr. Aceofspades, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

He probably should, but he won't.

I don't get what you're saying Ace. First you say you can't beat the dungeons, but you do your job right. You also say that you can hold hate just fine, but clearly you're not really being challenged by anyone...

What you neglect to understand/mention/ignore/whatever is that when you CAN hold enmity strongly, your DPS can zerg shit, and the fight is much shorter. Let's presume for a moment that you actually negate 20% more damage than a HDL Paladin (this is a gross exaggeration but I want you to understand my point, although somehow I think it will be ignored like everything else). Let's then presume that Chimera fights take about 4mins in a zerg (I've done it in less than that, but we'll round up for good measure). Then let's say your Chimera fights take 8minutes (the time it took before people maximized for 17 minutes runs. Lastly let us presume that the HDL paladin takes 2000 damage per minute, and the DEF-stacking paladin takes 20% less, or 1600 damage (these are just thrown out there numbers made large enough for example's sake).

HDL Paladin: 4minutes * 2000 dmg = 8000 damage.
DEF Paladin: 8minutes * 1600 dmg = 12,800 damage. (over 50% more for only take exactly 50% more time).

You can hash these numbers out all you want, but I think giving your argument a 20% defense modifier is a pretty big gimme for you. That said, going back to the base discussion of this thread, enmity in the current environment is required in order to allow for the other 7 players in your party to play at peak performance. The amount of enmity you wear should be scaled up as your party improves their gear through drops, melds, what-have-you.

If you are a Paladin claiming, like Ace does often, that enmity is not required to be stacked and that using DEF is "better", then chances are you are not playing with players that can or will push the envelope on damage. Feeling that the enmity stat needs to be abolished is all well and good, but get all the facts before making a decision like that. The game environment itself will be required to change, as well as inherent enmity calculations from damage, healing, etc. in order for this "stat" to be removed. That is a huge undertaking, and seeing as how SE carried this over from XI, I can't really see it going anywhere in the near future (and if not by then, then never).

i think emnity property in item//skills should be replaced by MP regen / DPS//LVL
and monsters aggresivity based more on regenerative skills
by adding a universal skill for either attack//defend//heal that use both MP and TP for DoW and only MP for DoM
and materias for absorbing elements
see my Crystal skill post if you think that can make sense

*bump*where skills to add MP wasnt meant to be.. but materia yes

soo , still not stacking enmity in every slot i can and managed to hold hate well enough to down garuda to 5% in less then 5mins, we wiped but thats because the dds where holding back , i think maybe worried that i wouldnt be able to hold hate well enough. dose that poke any holes in your theorys yet?

Oh and, enmity is officially second class enmity building stat on pld. Mind dose way better and when I can no longer stack that I will start stacking healing magic pot. grats on all the enmity again. things may change in 2.0 curious to see how things change, but as it sits, mind> healing pot > enmity for hate stacking. you can go with a dps set up but thats a diffrent tank then myself and all I can say is it apearntly takes alot of acc , damge, str and even some crit stacking to make it worth while. Think I will stick to just stacking mind and healing pot, leave space for not getting hit like a bitch :D

And we've come full circle. You've heard nothing said, ever, in all those threads.

Update us when you get Garuda down, or don't since we did that months ago. Catching up there Ace!

Hey ace, what's your hit rate on garuda with 352 melee accuracy?

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Originally Posted by GreyJorildyn

And we've come full circle. You've heard nothing said, ever, in all those threads.

Update us when you get Garuda down, or don't since we did that months ago. Catching up there Ace!

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Hello again, and yes I have seen and fully understood what you were saying, I just completely disagree with you. It is YOU who cannot come to terms with this fact. Like I have always told you, if it works for you , great, but enmity is NOT the best, much less the only way to keep hate even in elitest groups. Stacking HP is also not the only way, much less the best way to add survivabilty to your tank. We can argue back and forth all day brother. Fact is, When my DDs are ready, and up to snuff, we can zurg as good as any other group. Our issue is not skill or understanding of the game, its time. None in my static have the time to spam dungeons/boss fights, spend countless hours crafting and gathering to make triple, quad melded gear. once we figure out a strat that works for us and are geared properly, we get the win. Nothing more to be said realy.

You could just say you're terrible. That would be really satisfying.

Put the game's most amazing tank, the most amazing DD and a mob to hit in a room - If the DD doesn't hold back, and uses no hate management tools, they are going to pull hate.. Regardless of the tank's gear / skill.

Enmity gear is nice to buffer those situations (especially on fights such as Chimera where melee damage is useless, ie the tank is relying on Enmity tools + ENM gear)...

Not to mention, every well geared job has multiple gear sets with a heavier weight on certain stats in certain situations - not just a tank..

A DD needs heavier accuracy for Garuda / IE, they can choose to go for a full stat cap / attack build or a crit hit rate/power build.

A WHM can go for a VIT / HP set, MND/HPot, or a nuke set..

BLM can build an AMP, INT or ACC set - and have all those to take into account most fights anyway.


Each job has certain situations where weighing in on a certain stat is more effective, and anyone with decent gear / player skill will know this.. As said previously it's all about~ Balance.

You are also basically removing the player's ability/choice to customize their stats to their play style..

On a final note - if you are wearing PVE gear in PVP then I would love to go woop your butt in the PVP arena.