Tomestones.. Again.. for a relic..

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

lmao "all their ressources into the graphic overhaul"

you mean what modders have been doing for literally years ?



Because you find it boring doesnt mean it should be dumbed down to 1500 tomestones, some people want to have a little bit of work to and not just a turn in

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Relic steps are always "just a turn in". Why does it matter if the thing I turn in is 15 memories of the chungus, 15 books of whatever they were called or 1.5k tomes?

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Let’s not pretend that it takes development effort to ask us to do 15 variant dungeons, all EW normal mode trials and leveling dungeons, or farm the new deep dungeon 15 times for the relic. They just decided not to.

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How would that be any more interesting than just 1.5k tomes? You could just get your tomes doing that way?

My guess using Tomestones for the relic is cutbacks do to working on 7.0 and covid. Saves time for them to do other stuff needed.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

It’s the people attacking eureka as a concept that got us here so I hope they enjoy it.

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I do, thanks :)

Sooo, what are we supposed to do for the next 2 months? Play other games again?

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Originally Posted by LianaThorne

Maybe I'm just the hot opinion person here but I get that they're busy on 16 but at the same time, it's not an excuse to lower the quality of another game. If SE is denying them the ability to hire more people to make the game better, then the issue is with SE and that's where the fingers should be pointed. It's just not okay when people are paying for a live service game to basically tell us to screw ourselves and wait it out. If I wasn't tied down to a house I really don't want to lose, I would cancel my sub until 6.4.

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I mean when has SE been smart about allocating it's resources and money..I mean just look at last year so many failed projects just for 14 to hold the company up profitable. I think Yoshi said in a interview most anything extra money they get for development SE will not help it has to come from mog station. Just a SE thing.

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Originally Posted by Novae

Sooo, what are we supposed to do for the next 2 months? Play other games again?

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Lucky for me I started this game very late so I have several jobs to level several professions to level I still need to get into savage and extreme so I guess this is my catch-up time

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Originally Posted by Novae

Sooo, what are we supposed to do for the next 2 months? Play other games again?

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I mean that's just battle relics I don't know the step for crafter gather relics, then deep dungeon and tribe quests, and still the weekly customs and weekly raid for the coin. Its still stuff just not a lot of stuff but I'm glad this is happening now while I have a backlog I want to blitz through. CoDs battle pass for instance is a slog of match after match like elongated grinds are not fun...I think perhaps they just overturned it this relic.

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Originally Posted by Mcg55ss

I mean when has SE been smart about allocating it's resources and money..I mean just look at last year so many failed projects just for 14 to hold the company up profitable. I think Yoshi said in a interview most anything extra money they get for development SE will not help it has to come from mog station. Just a SE thing.

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It's still not an excuse. They're a company that's expected to provide a service that caters to all of their players, especially when it comes to paying monthly to play the game. You pay once to play a solo RPG of theirs and can even return it if it doesn't satisfy you for a refund. You can't do that with 14.

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Originally Posted by Mcg55ss

I mean when has SE been smart about allocating it's resources and money..I mean just look at last year so many failed projects just for 14 to hold the company up profitable. I think Yoshi said in a interview most anything extra money they get for development SE will not help it has to come from mog station. Just a SE thing.

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Well to be fair money goes in different avenues..its not all to dev. Them doing new data centers and worlds is money spent too, its just not going directly into content. They are always hiring they just seem to have a high standard that sort of kicks them in the foot at the same time granted I've heard they are a bit more lenient now on their criteria for recruitment. I can imagine the people in charge of the graphics overhaul take away from them making assets for current content when they can be upscaling or making new stuff for 7.0. Also 16 isn't just their team...you could go back to Yoshi Ps twitter message on like December 2021 where they said covid delayed assets or outright canceled asset delivery schedules from outsourced contractors...they have outside help more than just their team plus he is heavily scripted in his workflow so I'm sure he's micromanaging his team more efficiently then other studios. Heck he's done 2 expansions and content with 14 and made 16 in the same time its taken business division 1 to make FF7 remake part 1 and not even part 2... like that is nuts when you think about it.

Im actually glad its not a painful 2nd job feeling grind. That said, a _little bit_ more wouldnt have been bad.

I kinda expected at least an alliance raid grind, even one time only.

I won't be calling out now though because I still am afraid they will put some absurd grind at the end, do a reverse victory lap compared to the other relics in past.
It seems just suspiciously too easy, I do not buy this lol

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Originally Posted by Jettinson

I kinda expected at least an alliance raid grind, even one time only.

I won't be calling out now though because I still am afraid they will put some absurd grind at the end, do a reverse victory lap compared to the other relics in past.
It seems just suspiciously too easy, I do not buy this lol

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If there is going to be an ARaid grind, it'll probably be next .5 patch, if the ShB relic is anything to go by.

By no means guaranteed mind. 5.35 had two steps, so we've already diverged from last expansion in terms of quest pattern.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Remember when we had 4 eureka zones for relic steps and everyone complained and hated it and said they wanted the old tomestone grinds back from Heavensward?

Remember when we had to do 15 DR and people just wanted their old content crystal tower farms back?

So now SE is letting people do whatever content they want as long as it gives the tomestones.

Tbh people asked for boring old content and they got it. It’s the people attacking eureka as a concept that got us here so I hope they enjoy it.

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Who the BEEP is "we" exactly? You don't speak for me. I enjoyed the past relics (except ShB to be honest), animus included, a lot more than this garbage. And so did most of the three XIV discord groups I'm still on.

Woop dee doo. More content NOT to grind for! But it's OK, XIV is not a "main" game. This single game costs a monthly subscription, which you could put towards an entire catalog of games in other services. But it's OK! Pay up and don't play the game longer than 5 or 10 hours a month if that. -> This is what people like you sound like right now.

LMAO. Time for another hiatus. This has gotten incredibly ridiculous.

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

- They complained about books in ARR
- They complained about FATEs in HW
- They complained about Eureka in SB, granted it was mostly a you have to do Eureka, and Eureka alone if you wanted it.
- They complained about needing to do CLL, DR, and Dalriada, and complain you needed to do them especially to progress relic. They also complained that we had FATEs still, and complained about the one-time only 24-man raid farms.

As far as they're concerned, the best way to address this was to simply attach it to tomestones, which doesn't care about the 'how' - Again, I personally don't like it, but historically the community has only complained, and complained about the 'how'.

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Seriously. First it was "WE WANT A WEAPON WE CAN GRIND FOR!" after the base AF weapons were gained through Myth tomes and a couple of relic fights you rarely see people going through anymore, which turned into "no not like this!!! It's TOO HARD!" in which... a lot of XI players went "lol" at.

The complaints were many in HW and if you had a Zeta weapon you could skip the first step entirely! But it was still a resounding "not another light grind I hate it!"

And then Eureka + Bozja.... I don't think I need to highlight those complaints. I didn't mind the zones, I did all the ShB relics (and still didn't get my freakin' raptor mount from Dalriada which means I have to catch it again eventually), and I enjoyed Eureka since I'm also an old XI player - it's just XI in my XIV.

But when the playerbase complains heavily about content, the devs are just going to go "okay, we'll go back to grinds /shrug" so I don't know what people were expecting. Tome grinds, atma grinds, whatever, it's going to be boring as sin.

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Originally Posted by LyraMaru

I just don't get why the relic quest is always soooo late in the XPac. The new deep dungeon comes pretty late too.

Uhm and why we are getting just one dungeon per patch cycle? For quests like that?

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Gives the chance for the Savage raiders to have the better weapons for... idk, better raiding for a bit. Wasn't really an issue in ARR since T6S-T9S didn't really require those back then, but then when HW came out, Savage gear was dyeable and slightly better. Dungeons being 1 per have been like this since SB, less dev time on optional dungeons that some people won't run and more dev time on other things... though going by a few here on the OF, if it's not something they can see they're not actually working on the game. :P

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Originally Posted by ReynTime

Who the BEEP is "we" exactly? You don't speak for me. I enjoyed the past relics (except ShB to be honest), animus included, a lot more than this garbage. And so did most of the three XIV discord groups I'm still on.

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To be honest the forums complained like crazy for both past relics chases. That is a given. For me personally I loved them and hope after this we get them again. To say that people were happy with Eureka and Bozja is a joke but then again the forum is never happy with anything we get.

I'd rather it be tomestones than having to farm dungeons for some rng relic drops or farm light and so on. Am I happy with it no but this appears at least to be the lesser of evils cause running older content for stuff would be a lot worse and frankly I'd probably not even do it and this is coming from someone with 12 Cerebus mounts.

The tombstone vendor worried me and I'm not surprised we're getting more of it.

Please please give us back exploratory zones in 7.0.

Blame casuals who complain every time they have to play the game.

You can say what you want about farming tomes again for the next step, but really? The exact same thing as before? This is the first time they've literally recycled the same exact step from before right? It's just lack of creativity frankly. People complained about Eureka and Bozja so the devs just stopped trying. When has that ever been the right answer?

SMH, I think this is the first time a patch came out and I have no excitement or motivation to play it day 1. I'll for sure do it eventually, but everything here has been done before. We've had multiple deep dungeons in the past, multiple beast tribe quests in the past, and the relic step is the exact same as it was last time. What's there to be excited about?

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Originally Posted by Fourbestintoner

Blame casuals who complain every time they have to play the game.

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But the joke is that they don't have to play the game: They already have tomestone weapons which are basically free for all. And the crafted weapons too.

And now they removed the only somewhat meaningfull PvE grind from the game...

It's just stupid, IDK, to start cannibalizing other freaking players who aren't even in SQEX and say they're responsible for a copy-paste of the first step. If you think they were too loud, well, be louder next time. Blame the people in charge and control of this stuff, not the "muh casuals" boogeyman who's just one voice among others.

Moreover to say this is less grindy/boring is just completely wrong lol

With something like the Animus books at least you were asked to do different types of content. Most which was in the overworld. Hate on the "work" all you want, they were meticulously designed to make players need to do every tier of dungeon in existence in that patch, FATEs and levequests that would otherwise be ignored.

1500 tomes for a weapon is really easy and quick if you only want 1 weapon. If you want multiple weapons it's way worse now because what you're gonna do to get them at the most efficient way possible?
Hope you enjoy spamming Praetorium, with a capped character no less so not even leveling at the same time.

Why does a relic step become more interesting if I have to grind it for more time? Not harder content, not varied content, just the same thing but longer? Does delubrum suddenly unlock the new exciting mode when you enter it for the 20th time? Does titan do the construct 7 dance when you fight him for the 5th time?

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Originally Posted by Saraide

Why does a relic step become more interesting if I have to grind it for more time? Not harder content, not varied content, just the same thing but longer? Does delubrum suddenly unlock the new exciting mode when you enter it for the 20th time? Does titan do the construct 7 dance when you fight him for the 5th time?

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If you don't like it, don't do it? But can we have our grinding content like raiders have their savage floors and hardcores have ultimate, and casuals have IS or Limsa AFK?
Why is it so hard for people like you to let us enjoy that kind of content?

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Originally Posted by rainichan

But when the playerbase complains heavily about content, the devs are just going to go "okay, we'll go back to grinds /shrug" so I don't know what people were expecting. Tome grinds, atma grinds, whatever, it's going to be boring as sin.

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You don't know what people were expecting? I don't know, maybe not the exact same step twice in a row? A journal with different targets to slay. A new trial. Some crafted parts. Materia melding. A reason to actually do the new variant/criterion content released in Endwalker. A modicum of creativity, like the devs used to have back in ARR.

You're acting like it's impossible to do a proper relic quest without Eureka/Bozja and it's simply not the case.

I am disappointed thats it's just again 1500 stones. Not much to do again.

Liked it better when it was a aug tome/raid equivalent and earlier within the patch cycle. I dont care how grindy they make it just needs to happen far earlier in cycle so it doesnt just become a glam weapon...

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Originally Posted by BreyVoreas93

This should never be an excuse, those of us who have paid for this game for 10 years loyally, don’t care about whether they are wrapped up in FFXVI….do your job on this game and stop catering to the 3 hour a week, new, players only…what a joke.

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So alternatively they should cater to the no job, no life, live and breath the game types. Ok

Im glad its like this.

/hides

On a plus side least we know we need to cap tomes before 6.45 release date :P

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

So alternatively they should cater to the no job, no life, live and breath the game types. Ok

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as if some people that work dont play for more than hour a day, this "content" will be done in 30 mins at most, 2 hrs if you have to farm the tomestones, if not less, and then what ? You people are so agaisnt long lasting content it's ridiculous, you just want a minuscule amount of content so that you dont feel like "oh no i have to log in once in a week to do a tiny bit of content, the drama", and it all has to be catered to you

Some people work 10+ hrs a day and still manage to log in FF a few hours to play and have fun, and I am sure these people would also like something to do aside from some boring tribes that take 10 mins a day and a deep dungeon that will be done very quickly

if having a tiny bit of content to do hurts you so much, you can also not do it, but let people have something to do in this game aside from afking in limsa

Are we still going to argue a field content zone that doubled as a levelling zone wasn’t the best compromise between eureka and fell court for the 956th time

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

So alternatively they should cater to the no job, no life, live and breath the game types. Ok

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While I don't care which way they went they probably should have been somewhere in between the two. Like 750 stones + some fates (maybe specific ones like kill these bosses one time and give a list could include past expansions )and idk 5-10 expert dungeons and 5-10 lvl 90 dungeons....idk just suggesting something that takes a lil time would been fine.

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Originally Posted by Saraide

Why does a relic step become more interesting if I have to grind it for more time? Not harder content, not varied content, just the same thing but longer? Does delubrum suddenly unlock the new exciting mode when you enter it for the 20th time? Does titan do the construct 7 dance when you fight him for the 5th time?

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It becomes more interesting because you actually have something to do.

Playing the game to get the relic is more interesting than standing around with the relic in your hands.

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Originally Posted by Reinha

You don't know what people were expecting? I don't know, maybe not the exact same step twice in a row? A journal with different targets to slay. A new trial. Some crafted parts. Materia melding. A reason to actually do the new variant/criterion content released in Endwalker. A modicum of creativity, like the devs used to have back in ARR.

You're acting like it's impossible to do a proper relic quest without Eureka/Bozja and it's simply not the case.

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Hell Moogle Tomestones are a better system than this. Even incentivising certain content, maybe content I don't already do on a semi-daily basis, would have been more interesting.
Obtain n of item X, which is acquired by completing these five underrepresented duties...
Maybe some of the old Hard Mode dungeons, and ideally the HW and ShB alliance raids would be included at some point.

Instead I now have the option of... running Level 90 Roulette... which I already do anyway. I've been capped on Astronomy for weeks.

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Originally Posted by Masekase_Hurricane

On a plus side least we know we need to cap tomes before 6.45 release date :P

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I'll be capped long before 6.45 trust me

https://cdn.frankerfacez.com/emoticon/601910/4

I'm conflicted tbh. On one hand, there are multiple ways to obtaining tomestones, so farming them doesn't lock you into repeating the same activity over and over. On the other hand, it doesn't feel like it's ...connected? like it's just there to basically waste your time, not because you actually need the tomestones.

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Originally Posted by Tint

It becomes more interesting because you actually have something to do.

Playing the game to get the relic is more interesting than standing around with the relic in your hands.

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makes the relic feel way more rewarding and memorable too

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Originally Posted by Masekase_Hurricane

On a plus side least we know we need to cap tomes before 6.45 release date :P

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Dude just skip out until you can just get it with poetics amirite?

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Originally Posted by Duskane

makes the relic feel way more rewarding and memorable too

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Which is kind of interesting in itself I think.

1500 astronomy is basically 15 daily lvl 90 Dungeon roulettes, which wouldn't be that far removed from roughly this same relic step in ShB.

While that isn't exactly a thrilling objective, I feel like it would be more engaging than the current objective, even though strictly speaking the only difference is that I did those 15 dungeons before this patch, rather than after it.

The Devs cant win.
Its been proven each, and every expansion, no matter what the method is, people will complain.
And then the next Expansion, people will say they liked the last method.

I feel for this team.
Its never good enough.

Honestly, minus the Umbrite Step, I think my favorite Grind was the HW Animus Lux Weapon.
Bozja a close 2nd.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Remember when we had 4 eureka zones for relic steps and everyone complained and hated it and said they wanted the old tomestone grinds back from Heavensward?

Remember when we had to do 15 DR and people just wanted their old content crystal tower farms back?

So now SE is letting people do whatever content they want as long as it gives the tomestones.

Tbh people asked for boring old content and they got it. It’s the people attacking eureka as a concept that got us here so I hope they enjoy it.

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Not saying I like or dislike eureka/bozja, but who is "Everyone"? The playerbase is very vast, so a few people complaining shouldn't be the end all be all. I'm not saying those exploratory zones were the correct implementation, but saying "remember when everyone hated it?" is just straight lying.

It's like now when people are complaining about every boss being a wall boss or big hitbox and people coming out like "Well everyone complained so this is what you get!" Huh? Who is "Everyone"??