6.08 Patch Notes

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Originally Posted by Asari5

all these buffs make easy content even easier.... and even more boring... great....

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Imagine easy content being easy. The audacity.
From all those threads here what people struggle with I'm not surprised and thats exactly why SE doesn't balance around that. Making it harder would scare those people away.

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Originally Posted by Asari5

all these buffs make easy content even easier.... and even more boring... great....

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How does balancing some classes to be more on par with the rest make the content easier?

Cause PLD and DNC being gated out of savage cause of their trash damage was totally fun and exciting and challenging instead. And other such things.

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Originally Posted by Asari5

all these buffs make easy content even easier.... and even more boring... great....

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Most of the changes are single target potency buffs, and therefore do not impact dungeon pulls that much.
Also, potency changes barely impacts the difficulty of easier content. It just makes easy bosses faster to kill, and thus, less boring.
The mechanics are still going to be the same.
If anything, it makes hard content easier, since the only thing those changes really impact are the DPS checks, but that's all.

“Buff these jobs” - GCBTW
“Ok” - Yoshi-P
“NO NOT LIKE THAT!” - GCBTW

For the vast majority of you the numbers are fine. You won’t and aren’t raiding the high end while it’s relevant so just pick your flavor and enjoy it. The tears are unreal, I’ve seen less in League.

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Originally Posted by ryouma17

as a healer the less healing i have to do the happier i am

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Why do you play a healer then? I'm very confused.

MNK doesn’t need any damage buffs.
Just bring positionals back to Twin snakes/True strike then tone down the potencies of the fail attempt ones.
Problem solved.

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Originally Posted by Xuled

For the vast majority of you the numbers are fine. You won’t and aren’t raiding the high end while it’s relevant so just pick your flavor and enjoy it. The tears are unreal, I’ve seen less in League.

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"Pick your flavor and enjoy it" I'm sorry but this is hugbear level of copium.
When playing your job, you should feel useful to the party. If the differences were minor, no problem.
But we talk about big discrepancy there.

I love MCH but I can't enjoy it because the job is nothing but a burden to the group
It doesn't brings healing, shielding, extra mitigation, it doesn't brings rDPS, it only brings DPS and it's garbage.

What's wrong with simply requesting to be useful to the group?

they could nerf things. but oh no that would provoke a shit-storm because nobody thinks reaper is too strong.

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Originally Posted by SnowVix

"Why didn't things other than damage get changed on a patch we were explicitly told was only adjusting damage?"

For all your complaints of the devs not playing the game, you sure don't read their statements.

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He explicitly said potencies. Not damage, potencies. There's more than just damage potencies.

That means drk having some more sustain. And why isn't misery and toxikon upped to they aren't dps loss to use? Astro's pdps is pitiful as usual.

And i don't recall dragoon tether distance being a potency? So if that can change, why not other qol like say making living dead not kill the drk

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Originally Posted by SherlottaEryut

Can someone please explain if DNC is decent now? I know it's not exactly the best DPS but can I now play it without the fear of slowing down the group by a lottt?

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As I tell everyone, if DNC is the job you like, you have fun with it, and you are good at it, then play it. I'd rather have someone in my party who knows a lower-dps job front and back over someone who's playing a "meta" job but struggles on it.

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Originally Posted by CKNovel

"Pick your flavor and enjoy it" I'm sorry but this is hugbear level of copium.
When playing your job, you should feel useful to the party. If the differences were minor, no problem.
But we talk about big discrepancy there.

I love MCH but I can't enjoy it because the job is nothing but a burden to the group
It doesn't brings healing, shielding, extra mitigation, it doesn't brings rDPS, it only brings DPS and it's garbage.

What's wrong with simply requesting to be useful to the group?

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MCH *does* bring mitigation - it's called tactician. In light party content, MCH will also be greater damage than both BRD and DNC by virtue of having fewer players for the more support-centric physical ranged jobs to buff. In a competent group, MCH *should* fall off against less selfish jobs. If the rest of the group isn't great, MCH would be the better option.

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Originally Posted by Xuled

“Buff these jobs” - GCBTW
“Ok” - Yoshi-P
“NO NOT LIKE THAT!” - GCBTW

For the vast majority of you the numbers are fine. You won’t and aren’t raiding the high end while it’s relevant so just pick your flavor and enjoy it. The tears are unreal, I’ve seen less in League.

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What is the point of you posting? You're saying it's fine for most people. But acknowledge on higher end there is an imbalance, which justifies their complaints. People aren't complaining about jobs that they wanted buff being buffed, their complaining about already exceeding classes being buffed. So you just want to put down people that aren't good at the game? While assuming who clears when and plays at what level? Let people advocate for good things instead of putting people down.

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Originally Posted by Xaphire

MCH *does* bring mitigation - it's called tactician. In light party content, MCH will also be greater damage than both BRD and DNC by virtue of having fewer players for the more support-centric physical ranged jobs to buff. In a competent group, MCH *should* fall off against less selfish jobs. If the rest of the group isn't great, MCH would be the better option.

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Melee have Feint and casters have Addle, Tactician shouldn't be considered novel or unique utility. It's the bare minimum.
MCH should deal more dmg than it does, or bring some more utility.

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Originally Posted by Asari5

they could nerf things. but oh no that would provoke a shit-storm because nobody thinks reaper is too strong.

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Thank goodness you're not a dev.

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Originally Posted by Tlamila

How does balancing some classes to be more on par with the rest make the content easier?

Cause PLD and DNC being gated out of savage cause of their trash damage was totally fun and exciting and challenging instead. And other such things.

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Some jobs needed buffs, others didn't and reaper just needed a nerf. This means that content doesn't receive an indirect nerf which is what happens when you buff most DPS jobs.

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Originally Posted by Teno

Thank goodness you're not a dev.

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So you are happy content gets a nerf?

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Originally Posted by raelgun

Some jobs needed buffs, others didn't and reaper just needed a nerf. This means that content doesn't receive an indirect nerf which is what happens when you buff most DPS jobs.

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Pray tell me, outside of obvious Monk, which jobs that got buffed didn't need buffs?

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Originally Posted by Tlamila

Pray tell me, outside of obvious Monk, which jobs that got buffed didn't need buffs?

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Most DPS jobs, they only looked rough when compared to reaper, remove reaper from the list then most jobs fall into where they were.

It's reaper that skews the data for others.

Imagine demanding that RDPS or a support DPS do the same or even better damage than a melee dps ( MNK,SAM ,NIN) or BLM.

Stunning

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Originally Posted by raelgun

Most DPS jobs, they only looked rough when compared to reaper, remove reaper from the list then most jobs fall into where they were.

It's reaper that skews the data for others.

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Are you sure that just isn't people that are just bad at those jobs?

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Originally Posted by Xaphire

MCH *does* bring mitigation - it's called tactician. In light party content, MCH will also be greater damage than both BRD and DNC by virtue of having fewer players for the more support-centric physical ranged jobs to buff. In a competent group, MCH *should* fall off against less selfish jobs. If the rest of the group isn't great, MCH would be the better option.

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Psst, hey, closer...
A bit closer...

EVERY RANGED HAVE TACTICIAN. They are named Troubadour and Samba, those are virtually role action. In this equation or ranged utility, MCH brings nothing more.
4 party content is non existant. Only dungeons are light party, trial, savage, ultimate, 24 man raid, Eureka/Bozja.
Only Deep dungeons and Dungeons are 4 man content, DPS don't matter, healing barely matters and most of the dungeon is aoe spam + 3 bosses.

Even in ShB, if you wanted to perform better than a Melee/casters, you needed to overgear the Melee/casters and them to perform poorly.

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Originally Posted by CKNovel

Psst, hey, closer...
A bit closer...

EVERY RANGED HAVE TACTICIAN. They are named Troubadour and Samba, those are virtually role action. In this equation or ranged utility, MCH brings nothing more.
4 party content is non existant. Only dungeons are light party, trial, savage, ultimate, 24 man raid, Eureka/Bozja.
Only Deep dungeons and Dungeons are 4 man content, DPS don't matter, healing barely matters and most of the dungeon is aoe spam + 3 bosses.

Even in ShB, if you wanted to perform better than a Melee/casters, you needed to overgear the Melee/casters and them to perform poorly.

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Hey...hey, psst...you shouldn't perform better than melee or casters

Beeing worse then SMN DPS wise is hard right now... *cough* *cough* but hey BRD can have Utility, BUffs AND DPS but MCH are NOT ALLOWED to dps

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Originally Posted by Xaphire

Hey...hey, psst...you shouldn't perform better than melee or casters

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Actually stop listening and open your eyes.
Where did I ever mentioned that I wanted MCH to be on par with melees or casters?
My point was that the "mobility tax" was insanely high that if a melee/caster was below a ranged, it meant the player had no idea how to play the job at all.
In any case we already established that mobility tax was a useless joke, especially in content like P1S, P2S and P4SP2, most of the hard content is 95%+ melee uptime.

Again for your pretty eyes:
I want to feel useful when playing MCH, be it damage or utility wise.

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Originally Posted by Xaphire

Hey...hey, psst...you shouldn't perform better than melee or casters

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to be fair, smn at this pojnt is barely a caster anymore and offers great value via rezz, and redmage while more of a caster than smn completly blows most classes out of the water as far as utility goes, so even when dealing the same damage as a physical ranged both would still be usefull...

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Originally Posted by Xaphire

I have to assume the OP doesn't play the game at any level that actually matters - PLD was by far the lowest performing of the tanks in end game content and DRK the highest. GNB and WAR are both in good spots and didn't really need any adjustment. I'll be surprised if the PLD buff doesn't get walked back a bit next patch (as SE is wont to do).

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You can keep assuming that... you know, makes an ass out of you and all that. I play daily, and yes, I play them all. Jokes on you though.

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Originally Posted by Greyhawk

You can keep assuming that... you know, makes an ass out of you and all that. I play daily, and yes, I play them all. Jokes on you though.

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You mean like in… Savage content or -?

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Originally Posted by raelgun

Most DPS jobs, they only looked rough when compared to reaper, remove reaper from the list then most jobs fall into where they were.

It's reaper that skews the data for others.

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Idk where you're getting that idea. Reaper isn't even the highest dmg job before this. It was monk. And monk got buffed somehow. I'm very curious how you're coming to this conclusion

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Originally Posted by Delily

More players do dungeons and normal raids than savage and ex content, so calling them irrelevant is just ridiculous. Expert and the level 90 roulette are arguably more important than savage raids.

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From a balance perspective, they are irrelevant because none of that content is tuned remotely close to what the jobs are capable of. Case in point, if you outright deleted Bloodwhetting, TBN, Corundum and Shelltron. What changes? Absolutely nothing. The healers still spend 90%+ of their casts on the ST/AoE nuke.

Even mildly insinuating Expert is more important than Savage is completely laughable. I'd like to remind you they've readily been removing dungeons every expansion. Can't say the same about Savage.

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Originally Posted by SherlottaEryut

Can someone please explain if DNC is decent now? I know it's not exactly the best DPS but can I now play it without the fear of slowing down the group by a lottt?

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Dancer's rDPS is roughly 6% putting it on near even footing with Bard. It'll still come out very slightly behind overall I believe but it's very competitive. Machinist on the other hand...

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Originally Posted by Averax

So like. A healer who would be happier not healing is probably not somebody who should play a healer, is what that person is getting at. There's nothing wrong with using downtime to dps, but someone who just straight up doesn't like to go out of their way to use their healing abilities shouldn't be playing one.

There's a whole issue right now of healing being so baby mode easy that it's breeding a type of player who feels slighted at the possibility of needing to use a GCD to stop dpsing and heal someone. Green DPS memes have never been more real. Damage just isn't going out, ex trials can be cleared without healers at all.

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Don't hate the player, hate the game. Healing is designed to be 99% spamming your single target and using oGCD's to heal.

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Originally Posted by Xaphire

Hey...hey, psst...you shouldn't perform better than melee or casters

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He never said anything about performing better than other roles. Great assuming and reading btw.. it shows you have no clue what you're talking about.

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Originally Posted by Greyhawk

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...848e8fb1c3aaf7

Congratulations, you give a tank that is already operating really good and buff it while two other tanks are still an abomination, and one remains literally so useful it needs no healer in a duty. While you are at it, give him a buff on the one thing it rarely uses, LOL.

Healers untouched (shocker - why do we have those again? Oh yeah, those abominations). DPS buffed (again, shocker). Glad to see DRG get a little something, but RPR is still whippin' that booty.

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honestly you clearly don't know what you are talking about ...

MCH main reporting in. Changes - as expected. Will continue to pray for mercy throughout the expansion. :rolleyes:

Pretty Happy with the change... but I was pretty happy before the change too so..... yeah nothing changed

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Originally Posted by LilyPendragon

Yeah it's not like MNK was outperforming every DPS apart from RPR (and even then only in certain circumstances). MNK didn't even really need a buff.

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Yoshi P is the one who said he wanted to buff the job, not me, and he stated so multiple times in the interview that monk would be getting adjustments. Personally, I agree that monk was fine, and this buff is basically nothing since it's 150 potency on a skill the monk doesn't even use until 2 minutes into the fight and then every 2 minutes after that. This buff is incredibly minor. And with reaper and monk being so close, and with reaper being the baseline he wanted to balance jobs around, a small buff to monk is justified when you conisder that reaper has more party utility than the monk does (it heals the party where monk does not, and it's party buff lasts longer than monk's)

I had more been hoping for them to address the other glaring problems with the monk's toolkit. Riddle of Earth has no reason to fall off after three weaponskill uses anymore. Anatman and Six Sided Star continue to be garbage buttons that you basically never have a reason to press.

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Originally Posted by Greyhawk

You can keep assuming that... you know, makes an ass out of you and all that. I play daily, and yes, I play them all. Jokes on you though.

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Uh huh. I'm sure you do - you must if you thought paladin was in a remotely good place before this patch and wasn't so far behind the other tanks that early groups would have not been able to clear if one of their tanks had been a paladin.

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Originally Posted by wereotter

Yoshi P is the one who said he wanted to buff the job, not me, and he stated so multiple times in the interview that monk would be getting adjustments. Personally, I agree that monk was fine, and this buff is basically nothing since it's 150 potency on a skill the monk doesn't even use until 2 minutes into the fight and then every 2 minutes after that. This buff is incredibly minor. And with reaper and monk being so close, and with reaper being the baseline he wanted to balance jobs around, a small buff to monk is justified when you conisder that reaper has more party utility than the monk does (it heals the party where monk does not, and it's party buff lasts longer than monk's)

I had more been hoping for them to address the other glaring problems with the monk's toolkit. Riddle of Earth has no reason to fall off after three weaponskill uses anymore. Anatman and Six Sided Star continue to be garbage buttons that you basically never have a reason to press.

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Monk already did more than reaper when you account for raid buffs and mantra is better than arcane crest. So I disagree saying it was justified. Also the buff is like .4-.5% when most jobs get 2-3% buff. So it's fairly worth mentioning and not minimizing.

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Originally Posted by Xiu_Ye

Monk already did more than reaper when you account for raid buffs and mantra is better than arcane crest. So I disagree saying it was justified. Also the buff is like .4-.5% when most jobs get 2-3% buff. So it's fairly worth mentioning and not minimizing.

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Arcane Crest is utility in the same way everlasting light and rekindle are utility, except that it actually goes out when the healing is needed. Mantra is handy, but speaking with my own healers, the boost doesn't actually save them any healing skill uses. Arcane Crest may be the same, but it's healing for the party that reaper has and so should be considered when balancing the jobs. It's also not just that but that Arcane Circle has a longer duration to buff the party than does Brotherhood, so the job should be comfortably ahead of reaper, which from what I've seen, it was about neck and neck with it.

But also like you said, the buff is incredibly minor. Phantom rush doesn't even get used until two minutes into a fight, and then every two minutes after that. Sure it's a buff, but also it's the smallest buff any DPS (that got a buff) received. I never thought monk needed more damage, but just going off Yoshida saying more than once he wanted to see the job buffed, and had hoped more that our other skills would see changes, even if they might have been turned into utility skills instead.

Here's a list of the DPS gains based on the changes:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen.../unknown-9.png

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Originally Posted by wereotter

Arcane Crest is utility in the same way everlasting light and rekindle are utility, except that it actually goes out when the healing is needed. Mantra is handy, but speaking with my own healers, the boost doesn't actually save them any healing skill uses. Arcane Crest may be the same, but it's healing for the party that reaper has and so should be considered when balancing the jobs. It's also not just that but that Arcane Circle has a longer duration to buff the party than does Brotherhood, so the job should be comfortably ahead of reaper, which from what I've seen, it was about neck and neck with it.

But also like you said, the buff is incredibly minor. Phantom rush doesn't even get used until two minutes into a fight, and then every two minutes after that. Sure it's a buff, but also it's the smallest buff any DPS (that got a buff) received. I never thought monk needed more damage, but just going off Yoshida saying more than once he wanted to see the job buffed, and had hoped more that our other skills would see changes, even if they might have been turned into utility skills instead.

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Gonna start with saying I don't care what yoshi wanted. I'm actively disagreeing with his statement. And monk was already comfortably ahead of reaper. To the tune of hundreds of DPS. Mantra contributes way more to healing than arcane crest. I can't do anything to prove that to you on a forum but take a look at the end of final fight and you'll see just how much stronger mantra is. So monk already did more personal then reaper and it's comparable utility for healing is significantly better. Also need to not downplay the buff. A .5% vs a 2.5% buff is a huge portion given to a class that was already the best DPS on every fight.