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10-25-2017, 05:11 PM
BillyKaplan

Quote:

Originally Posted by KageTokage

That move is poorly translated (They translated "continue to act" as "scatter"), so I don't you can blame anyone for messing up at it without reading a guide.

You want to tell me they actually took away the Kelpie lore from "opposite horse" in Skalla by switching the attack names, but they left 'scatter' that has nothing to do with the debuff-command itself? Gosh darnit, SE
10-25-2017, 06:07 PM
RiyahArp

Issues, lets see.

I hate how most wipes tend to be simply because people forgot to put markers, and people get confused about which little prison to go into. This is actually a big issue on chariot guy, because the timing is pretty tight to get in there. I also hate the spinning confusion marker, because it's cheap difficulty. Chariot guy's ultimate is still too long, and the last boss's 3 misses = chicken mechanic isn't fun for many people because it takes all control out of your hands for a long time than kills you.

It also feels like it really punishes people who do it only once per week. I mean its hard to get used to these mechanics specifically without a bit of practice, since it's not just dodging or relatively easy tells.
10-25-2017, 06:17 PM
Pheryx

My only complaint is getting to hashmal and the spams for vote abandon after only 2 wipes. :/
10-26-2017, 09:19 AM
DamianFatale

I dislike when people give up on Hashmal. He’s not impossible.
10-26-2017, 09:22 AM
Enla

Quote:

Originally Posted by DamianFatale

I dislike when people give up on Hashmal. He’s not impossible.

He's actually insanely easy. He just requires people to somewhat know the fight, stick to the middle when the pillar spawns aren't in play, and pay attention.
10-26-2017, 10:12 AM
RitsukoSonoda

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enla

He's actually insanely easy. He just requires people to somewhat know the fight, stick to the middle when the pillar spawns aren't in play, and pay attention.

Hashmal IMO the main cause of wipes on him to me is players killing other players with mechanics frequently because they appear to only be focused on their own DPS and don't care that they are dropping markers on other people. Also frequently in my expriences the 2 golem adds are left to run around punching squishy ppl as the please because neither OT tries to grab them. Or. the OT's do grab them but no one actually DPS's them so they get to spam AoE's until a large part of the alliance dies when both AoE in sync with Hashmal doing his Quake AoE.
10-26-2017, 10:50 AM
Enla

Quote:

Originally Posted by RitsukoSonoda

Hashmal IMO the main cause of wipes on him to me is players killing other players with mechanics frequently because they appear to only be focused on their own DPS and don't care that they are dropping markers on other people. Also frequently in my expriences the 2 golem adds are left to run around punching squishy ppl as the please because neither OT tries to grab them. Or. the OT's do grab them but no one actually DPS's them so they get to spam AoE's until a large part of the alliance dies when both AoE in sync with Hashmal doing his Quake AoE.

For me the Golems are never an issue since the times I've run it with only one exception, the magic DPS have saved their limit break to wittle them down. It's happened so frequently while I'm farming I'm surprised it isn't the current meta for others.
10-26-2017, 12:21 PM
RitsukoSonoda

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enla

For me the Golems are never an issue since the times I've run it with only one exception, the magic DPS have saved their limit break to wittle them down. It's happened so frequently while I'm farming I'm surprised it isn't the current meta for others.

I've only had 1 group actually caster LB3 the golems without 6+ ppl saying to do it beforehand. However its also very easily manageable if everyone burns the same golem right as they spawn cutting the add AoE dmg in half then burn the other afterwards.
10-26-2017, 12:53 PM
alimdia

Not sure if it was mentioned yet, but despite the raid requiring i305 gear, people under i320 can die during the third boss limit break attack if they don't have any sort of mitigation, even if their HP is full. I find that problematic if you happen to have whm+whm with drk as tank.
10-26-2017, 03:30 PM
Rhindas

Problem I see with Hashbrown (....seriously auto correct? I'm not changing that.) is people panic too readily. There's a lot more time to react than you'd think, but it quickly devolves into headless chicken mode. It reminds me of Titan Hard and Ex when they were new. Of course nothing stops the party from panicking when the healers get squashed but that's just one of those things.
10-26-2017, 03:33 PM
Vahlnir

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhindas

Problem I see with Hashbrown (....seriously auto correct? I'm not changing that.) is people panic too readily. There's a lot more time to react than you'd think, but it quickly devolves into headless chicken mode. It reminds me of Titan Hard and Ex when they were new. Of course nothing stops the party from panicking when the healers get squashed but that's just one of those things.

He will now be referred to as Hashbrown. Thank you.
10-26-2017, 05:06 PM
Enla

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vahlnir

He will now be referred to as Hashbrown. Thank you.

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images...hT_400x400.jpg

The resemblance is UNCANNY.
10-26-2017, 05:34 PM
XykeVayaris

Quote:

Originally Posted by alimdia

Not sure if it was mentioned yet, but despite the raid requiring i305 gear, people under i320 can die during the third boss limit break attack if they don't have any sort of mitigation, even if their HP is full. I find that problematic if you happen to have whm+whm with drk as tank.

That attack, apparently if you were to run to the sides away from the path of the boss' charge, you will take far less damage. (Read: 20k vs 4k) Yea it took me this long to realise when one of the random runs I had I saw some people running off to the sides while the majority stayed in the middle.
10-26-2017, 06:14 PM
Dualgunner

TIL: Hashbrown is a monster
10-26-2017, 06:16 PM
ElHeggunte

Quote:

Originally Posted by XykeVayaris

That attack, apparently if you were to run to the sides away from the path of the boss' charge, you will take far less damage. (Read: 20k vs 4k) Yea it took me this long to realise when one of the random runs I had I saw some people running off to the sides while the majority stayed in the middle.

Heavenly Subjugation is a raid buster so physical position shouldn't make any difference (just like hiding behind the stone pillars makes no difference in how much damage you take from Garuda's Aerial Blast--the only thing that matters is how many and how big the remaining pillars are). The only way you can shave off damage is by killing the adds faster and then stacking as much mitigation as you can. I wouldn't recommend running off to the sides unless your group agrees and follows you, otherwise you're just running away from some of the mitigation that might make the difference between life and death.

I haven't been hit by him since day 1 so I can't remember off the top of my head, but I'm fairly certain people are largely dying to Heavenly Subjugation because when he runs you over during the gaol phase it's just like being hit by Trample: it applies a short damage down debuff and a much longer vulnerability debuff (the adds might apply a debuff too, but again, I haven't been hit by Rofocale since my first or second run so I can't remember). The vulnerability debuff lasts long enough for him to perform his lengthy animation if you took a hit near the end of the phase, so with enough stacks and low enough max HP it's nearly impossible to survive even if his mana gauge is low. Otherwise, I've seen players with sub 30k HP survive in the middle of the room just fine.

I'll pay more attention the next time I go in, but I'm fairly certain the players who regularly get pancaked spent most of the add phase getting hit by things.
10-26-2017, 06:25 PM
XykeVayaris

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElHeggunte

Snip

I'm pretty sure it does reduce damage, I guess it's like proximity damage. If it were to come charging down from the north running east or west will reduce the damage. I'll update with images or something when I get around doing it.

Edit: https://imgur.com/a/Kgp5j
There was an ast in my party, but even with one i doubt their shield can fully mitigate 20k+ damage for standing in the middle.
10-26-2017, 06:51 PM
LalaRu

It is written nowhere that if I wanna enjoy the lore, I must refrain to use party finder. Me rude to you because you have lost ONE MINUTE of your (tentative) speedrun?

Then you surface dweller are rude to me because you don't want me enjoy the game, the lore, the scenery, the game.
10-26-2017, 07:04 PM
Mirakumi

Getting tossed in an alliance with all the shit talking people who can't dodge mechanics. Then sighing internally.
10-26-2017, 07:34 PM
Nestama

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enla

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images...hT_400x400.jpg

The resemblance is UNCANNY.

Hashbrown, Bringer of Taters.
10-26-2017, 08:21 PM
Neri

Heavenly Subjugation can be mitigated by running to the side, away from his charging path. Once with a fully shielded, I took 0 damage contrast to those still in the middle of the arena took about half their HP off.
10-26-2017, 08:48 PM
Kaoru_Nagisa

I remember a run I had with some friends, we had a lot of new people in the Alliance but just as many people who had been in before and acted like they knew what to do when the first boss started. (Keep in mind I don't think anyone except maybe one person in my party actively stated they were new....)

Mateus goes about as well as expected - the people who weren't new still weren't doing mechanics properly because muh deeps, the new people had little to no idea what was going on, we all wiped. I think an Ice Slave was what kept killing half the raid, but I can't remember at this point. Anyway, while we're all running back to Mateus after the wipe, I just make a joking quip in Alliance once all the mud-slinging started (ofc) going "Remember kids, mechanics are important!" I directed this at the people who WEREN'T new since goodness knows they weren't paying attention to half the mechanics, plus no one was really aware how many new people we did have... since literally no one but like 1-2 people said anything.

Queue impatient angry manchild newbie who goes, "well some of us don't f***ing know mechanics, but thanks for the condescension. How about you f***ing explain instead?" To which I just responded, "So angry." and left it at that. I was doing the raid for the first time on a healer so I had more important things to worry about than dealing with that. Someone else explained her mechanics, we proceeded, half the raid still wiped since either they weren't doing them or didn't understand them - but we managed to get past her. From then on someone explained all the boss mechanics as best they could. Ofc the party with the newbies did the worst but that's to be expected.

This guy though - he would literally spend the entire raid doing nothing but passive aggressive insults to me regardless of what was going on. People failed a mechanic and someone had to reiterate what to do? "Remember guys, mechanics are important~~~!" I ended up dying because someone ran pools into my face or couldn't sprint from Hashbrown's fire fast enough? "Remember, mechanics are important!" Like. I thought it was stupid at first (still was anyway tbh), but by the third boss I was actually upset. I hadn't spoken a single word after Mateus' wipe save for adding on to some mechanic explanations where needed, and I didn't acknowledge that manchild throwing a tantrum at all. But for whatever reason he took great personal offense to my joking quip at the start and made it his mission to make fun of me the entire run when we weren't even on the same team. Like what even, man? No wonder half your group is dying, with you talking more than healing. The worst of it came with Thadalfus ofc, since regardless of what class I'm on that boss still gives me trouble with some of his mechanics - and admittedly I was messing up worse because I had some anxiety building up from this dude's constant mudslinging.

And ofc before they left, they had to get one last parrot out of "Mechanics are important!" I was in such a terrible mood after that run. Some people literally take the crown for petty and unnecessary salt.
10-26-2017, 09:03 PM
Misstique

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaoru_Nagisa

I remember a run I had with some friends, we had a lot of new people in the Alliance but just as many people who had been in before and acted like they knew what to do when the first boss started. (Keep in mind I don't think anyone except maybe one person in my party actively stated they were new....)

Mateus goes about as well as expected - the people who weren't new still weren't doing mechanics properly because muh deeps, the new people had little to no idea what was going on, we all wiped. I think an Ice Slave was what kept killing half the raid, but I can't remember at this point. Anyway, while we're all running back to Mateus after the wipe, I just make a joking quip in Alliance once all the mud-slinging started (ofc) going "Remember kids, mechanics are important!" I directed this at the people who WEREN'T new since goodness knows they weren't paying attention to half the mechanics, plus no one was really aware how many new people we did have... since literally no one but like 1-2 people said anything.

Queue impatient angry manchild newbie who goes, "well some of us don't f***ing know mechanics, but thanks for the condescension. How about you f***ing explain instead?" To which I just responded, "So angry." and left it at that. I was doing the raid for the first time on a healer so I had more important things to worry about than dealing with that. Someone else explained her mechanics, we proceeded, half the raid still wiped since either they weren't doing them or didn't understand them - but we managed to get past her. From then on someone explained all the boss mechanics as best they could. Ofc the party with the newbies did the worst but that's to be expected.

This guy though - he would literally spend the entire raid doing nothing but passive aggressive insults to me regardless of what was going on. People failed a mechanic and someone had to reiterate what to do? "Remember guys, mechanics are important~~~!" I ended up dying because someone ran pools into my face or couldn't sprint from Hashbrown's fire fast enough? "Remember, mechanics are important!" Like. I thought it was stupid at first (still was anyway tbh), but by the third boss I was actually upset. I hadn't spoken a single word after Mateus' wipe save for adding on to some mechanic explanations where needed, and I didn't acknowledge that manchild throwing a tantrum at all. But for whatever reason he took great personal offense to my joking quip at the start and made it his mission to make fun of me the entire run when we weren't even on the same team. Like what even, man? No wonder half your group is dying, with you talking more than healing. The worst of it came with Thadalfus ofc, since regardless of what class I'm on that boss still gives me trouble with some of his mechanics - and admittedly I was messing up worse because I had some anxiety building up from this dude's constant mudslinging.

And ofc before they left, they had to get one last parrot out of "Mechanics are important!" I was in such a terrible mood after that run. Some people literally take the crown for petty and unnecessary salt.

Wow, I'm sorry to hear that. It seems like that raid brings out some of the worst people. I ran it yesterday and a mnk was pretty much holding up the whole raid due to computer issues or what not and people were getting upset since they couldnt start. The monk refused to leave and wanted a kick and the guy that came with the monk ended up arguing with the whole raid, telling people to "eat s**t and die" and other profanities. Of course, I left at hashmal even though I wasn't even a part of the argument since those types of people can totally ruin your experience. So when you mentioned how that guy was actively harassing you like that, I can imagine how upset you'd be. I mean if that was me, I'd pretty much copy the whole conversation and report him for harassment.

Anyway, I checked the guy's name on lodestone and lo and behold, his fc's name is " toxic ******* " lol, must be a great bunch of human beings.

One thing I don't understand....why are people typing during raids instead of dodging or following mechanics, (I've see this pretty often). When I'm doing literally any ex trial or raid, i don't read or even look at the chat log, I'm too busy healing or rezzing people.
10-26-2017, 11:04 PM
Cold_Raven

Got some heavy salt when I ran as tank last week in alliance C.

Alliance A went in to tank (Paladin) - no problem. I'm a WAR, I like to DPS anyway.

First boss went through no issues.

Second boss was going fine, but all of a sudden the boss swung around to me.
I'm tanking now?
Did A die and I didn't notice? Nope... they're still alive.
Did I forget what stance I was in? Nope... still in Deliverance.
Seems like A simply didn't generate enough hate. Maybe they tried to swap into DPS stance on their own? I dunno.
I walk to the front of the boss, stay in Deliverance, and just keep going.
A stays there too, eating cleaves for no reason... but never gets hate back with me staying in DPS stance...
Ah well, no biggie. Boss dies and we move on.

3rd boss is buy-on-the-chariot, right?
On that one, same thing happened. A's PAL starts the fight, and everything's going fine.
At about 45-50% health left, I end up with hate again in my DPS stance.
I walk around to the front of the boss and continue to tank in DPS stance hoping they'll just take it back and do their job.

Then some DPS in A's alliance starts calling for A and C to stop fighting for hate.
I just stay quiet... it's pretty obvious to anyone who cares to look that I'm not fighting anyone, A's tank just sucks.

Then DPS-from-A starts whining about chariot-boss not being tanked in the centre... because the bomb-AoE (run away as far as possible from boss) causes more damage if boss is near a side.

I find that really suspect. Seems to me that if the boss is near a side, there's more room to run away (and take less damage) where if he's in the middle, it's all equal distance to run away from. I can see advantages to that (DPS doesn't have to consider where they are... just run away from boss). But I can see advantages to tanking him nearer to one side... if DPS position themselves, they can easily run farther away, and take even less damage.

I'm open to being convinced otherwise on this, anyone really care if the chariot-boss is tanked in the middle or not? What are the reasons?

But, in the moment, I thought it was fine where it was and I didn't move it.
Boss died easily enough anyway and we move on.

Moving towards last boss, DPS-in-A starts crying about tank-fights and how bad Alliance-C tank (me) is. I still don't say anything. I don't really care about what some kid thinks.

Last boss starts up, A-Tank starts fight and takes boss again.
This time I decide to relax a bit on DPS... just to make sure I don't take hate off of A-Tank. Whatever, boss is dying fast enough anyway.

But then I notice the boss swinging all around again.
Did A die this time? Nope, lots of health over there... what happened?
Check the hate tables and see that some Monk on Alliance B edged A-Tank in hate and took the boss.
Well, as a tank this is simply something that I can't stand for. Let the DPS do their jobs!!
I flip into tank stance, provoke, berserk, unchained and butcher's block until the cows come home. Boss doesn't move again, and DPS kill him easily... all the while A-DPS is chirping about tank-fights and how bad C-tank is. I'm just laughing at him the whole time.

Anyway... such is the fun of 24-man content :D
10-26-2017, 11:31 PM
Stormfur

Maybe someone can explain something about the last fight to me.

When it says "the false god commands you to turn away" - and you get that icon with the eye and the NO symbol, and some symbols over your head like in Ravana. What does that even mean?!
10-26-2017, 11:49 PM
Byonka

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormfur

Maybe someone can explain something about the last fight to me.

When it says "the false god commands you to turn away" - and you get that icon with the eye and the NO symbol, and some symbols over your head like in Ravana. What does that even mean?!

Commands:
Eye = Turn around/Stop casting
Scatter = Actively be Moving/Casting

Pay attention to the face that pops up on your screen.
Blue-eyed Angelic Face = Follow the command (White light orbits boss)
Red-eyed Demonic Face = Opposite command (Dark Blue light orbits boss)
10-26-2017, 11:54 PM
LaylaTsarra

I'm curious how you avoid that hand pointer over your head with the last boss. I seem to get it way to much and am not sure what i'm doing wrong.
10-26-2017, 11:55 PM
Avatre

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

I'm curious how you avoid that hand pointer over your head with the last boss. I seem to get it way to much and am not sure what i'm doing wrong.

If you're talking about the spinning pointer, everyone gets it. You need to start moving when it's pointed in the direction you need to go for the safe spot.
10-27-2017, 12:08 AM
Byonka

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

I'm curious how you avoid that hand pointer over your head with the last boss. I seem to get it way to much and am not sure what i'm doing wrong.

As mentioned above, everyone gets it. It's hilariously annoying :P Try rapidly tapping forward until you're pointed in the right direction.
10-27-2017, 02:13 AM
LaylaTsarra

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byonka

As mentioned above, everyone gets it. It's hilariously annoying :P Try rapidly tapping forward until you're pointed in the right direction.

thank you. I didn't realize everyone got it. It seemed some didn't so at least I know it's not me. I've learned to deal with it although I will say it's quite annoying. :)
10-27-2017, 06:18 AM
ElHeggunte

Quote:

Originally Posted by XykeVayaris

I'm pretty sure it does reduce damage, I guess it's like proximity damage. If it were to come charging down from the north running east or west will reduce the damage. I'll update with images or something when I get around doing it.

Edit: https://imgur.com/a/Kgp5j
There was an ast in my party, but even with one i doubt their shield can fully mitigate 20k+ damage for standing in the middle.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neri

Heavenly Subjugation can be mitigated by running to the side, away from his charging path. Once with a fully shielded, I took 0 damage contrast to those still in the middle of the arena took about half their HP off.

Well then, you learn something new every day.

https://i.imgur.com/tEAjtCG.png
10-27-2017, 06:28 AM
alimdia

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElHeggunte

I'll pay more attention the next time I go in, but I'm fairly certain the players who regularly get pancaked spent most of the add phase getting hit by things.

I can 100% confirm that with 31600 HP on my WHM it will hit me for something like ~32900 with no debuffs whatsoever, i can only survive if someone else does any sort of mitigation or if i use benison on myself and let other people in my party die.

Hoooweever.... I didn't know it was directional damage, that seems weird. I need to test that myself.
10-27-2017, 06:50 AM
SendohJin

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cold_Raven

Then DPS-from-A starts whining about chariot-boss not being tanked in the centre... because the bomb-AoE (run away as far as possible from boss) causes more damage if boss is near a side.

I find that really suspect. Seems to me that if the boss is near a side, there's more room to run away (and take less damage) where if he's in the middle, it's all equal distance to run away from. I can see advantages to that (DPS doesn't have to consider where they are... just run away from boss). But I can see advantages to tanking him nearer to one side... if DPS position themselves, they can easily run farther away, and take even less damage.

I'm open to being convinced otherwise on this, anyone really care if the chariot-boss is tanked in the middle or not? What are the reasons?

what bomb AOE? the chariot boss is best tanked near the middle because of his 180 degree "conal". if he's too far to the side and turns towards the middle that makes only the small slice behind him safe. it's similar to the last boss in Dun Scaith but there's less control by the tank.

it's not a big problem if everyone stays near him most of the time but lots of people don't.
10-27-2017, 07:31 AM
BillyKaplan

Quote:

Originally Posted by SendohJin

it's similar to the last boss in Dun Scaith

You mean Weeping City of Mhach, it's a Haircut mechanic a-la Calofisteri. Only here it's worse because the person who has control over positionals isn't the tank - it's the dps or healer that get targetted by it and prioritize their personal dps over getting close to the boss to keep him from moving too much.
10-28-2017, 12:42 AM
Cold_Raven

Quote:

Originally Posted by SendohJin

what bomb AOE?

The circle one that spreads out from directly underneath him. Similar to the red-chocobo bomb earlier in the trash fights.

Quote:

the chariot boss is best tanked near the middle because of his 180 degree "conal". if he's too far to the side and turns towards the middle that makes only the small slice behind him safe. it's similar to the last boss in Dun Scaith but there's less control by the tank.

That makes sense.

Quote:

it's not a big problem if everyone stays near him most of the time but lots of people don't.

That makes more sense :D
10-28-2017, 10:44 AM
MoroMurasaki

I recently had a run of this that went so poorly my more-or-less-permanent cohealer is going to tank it from now on because even with both of us healing we wiped to freaking Mateus.

I ran Rabanastre on 4.1 launch with only one person in the raid who had done it before who didn't offer much help apart from "focus on mechanics over damage" and we didn't wipe to Mateus. This time though...

Our tank was the only PLD, both others were DRKs. My cohealer was on WHM so I did AST for shields even though I'm not the biggest fan. Our tank seemed to intend to MT but the train went off the rails quickly. For part of the fight my cohealer was tanking adds while I spammed Aspected Benefic to keep them up. The Azure Guards spawn and immediately something is wrong - two of them are clumped together.

Lots of people are typing in chat to pull them apart, I guess one of the DRKs provoked my tank's guard off of him and onto themself. We wipe because the aether gague fills to 100%.

Next time around close to the same thing happens, they pull them back apart but we still wipe to the ultimate.

At this point my coheal initiates Vote Abandon and I agree, so does our RDM friend. It doesn't pass but we decide we won't sit past one more wipe. The team of the DRK who is provoking either kicked him or he left, we get another DRK.

We clear Mateus this time after our group killing our own add then helping both other groups with theirs. It is a hot mess. The rest of it is similarly messy.

I didn't think of this raid as particularly tank-intensive, there aren't a lot of adds that show up and with shields all the tankbusters can be laughed at even without CDs but after the long and arduous run we had on Tuesday we're going to pug my cohealer and just hope for no double WHM comps because apparently a competent tank is more essential than two decent healers.

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