Feedback on 4.0 Scholar

Dissipation's primary benefits are the immediate three aetherize stacks, which are very useful, and the +20% healing buff that applies to your Physick, Adloquium, and Succor (and only those skills). The detriments to the ability is the loss of the fairy which can be large if you're using Eos unless her abilities are all on cooldown, or limited mostly to just Embrace if using Selene, as well as both the expensive mana cost for resummoning the fairy and often the use of Swiftcast to do it. And those last bits are it's real problem, because the skill requires a sense of commitment to it. You can earn the mana for resummoning the fairy by using some of the stacks gained with energy drain, or you can accept the 1800 mana cost. You can then decide whether you want to resummon the fairy with a hard-cast (recommended if the boss is about to jump away for a while), or burn your swiftcast timer and lock yourself out of swiftcast for its cooldown, limiting your res and recovery potential. You may also decide to not resummon the fairy, in which case you are the healing equivalent to a NIN that doesn't use Huton or a MCH that forgets Hot Shot.

Most of this would be remedied simply by having the fairy return after the duration without having to be resummoned. Three aetherize stacks on demand is a powerful benefit, especially coupled with a Divine Seal effect that further stacks on top of actual Divine Seal (Largesse), but the enhancement comes at a cost you have to pay not in the present but half a minute in the future, and unless you're confident in what the situation will be like then you may have reservations about consigning your Swiftcast or mana cost to it. And make no mistake, it is actually a useful ability, but even if the cost is something you're willing to pay there's something thematically off about a SCH getting rid of its unique class trait for a buff that puts you at a disadvantage later unless addressed.

I'm still wondering why this isn't working like INV enkidle.
And they even had two go at it, and neither really works.

Also, there's a thing in the game about how two ground AoE cannot be up at the same time, yet there's basically two of them. Why not give more AoE that do other different things ?

Honestly if someone asked, Do you think a SCH the way it is now can solo heal the 2 new primals? The answer is no, but ive seen AST solo heal pts in PF. So it hurts my moral.

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Originally Posted by Mirakumi

Honestly if someone asked, Do you think a SCH the way it is now can solo heal the 2 new primals? The answer is no, but ive seen AST solo heal pts in PF. So it hurts my moral.

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Yes. At least Susano. Haven't tried Lakshmi yet, but Susano is absolutely doable if people don't screw up.

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Originally Posted by Riyshn

Yes. At least Susano. Haven't tried Lakshmi yet, but Susano is absolutely doable if people don't screw up.

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Sch can do Lak solo too as long as people are not screwing up, and if it's a solo healer party it's pretty much expected that people should be good enough to not make mistakes

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Originally Posted by Riyshn

Yes. At least Susano. Haven't tried Lakshmi yet, but Susano is absolutely doable if people don't screw up.

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I tried Susano Solo in a Farm PT but people who hit us with lightning makes it impossiburu. ;;

I would like to see Dissipation be a DWT type of thing, buffing our healing, granting aetherflow and not getting rid of the fairy. Maybe even reset aetherflow CDs or adding in an automatic embrace whenever you perform a healing spell on a target. Dissipation would use fairy gauge while up and I would like Fey Union to just be removed and instead add a new command to fairies for dedicated healing.. like focus embrace on <t> when set while providing the same benefits as Obey. Replace fey union with a OGCD new shield ability that consumes fairy gauge and could only be used under dissipation.

Probably a lot wrong with this but it was just a random thought that occurred.

I've noticed two main issues:

Mana Economy: using aetherflow charges on Energy Drain, Lucid Dreaming, and gimped Aetherflow makes it... possible. However, compared to 63whm never running out of mana, it's insulting. Holding Aetherflow charges for heals is important for dealing with heavy damage. So while the 68 trait seems nice, I end up holding my charges rather than ED'ing to restore mana for a chance to proc.

Heal Potency vs. Cost: I did some quick comparison between healers, and sch has the worst heals per cost. even counting (non crit) adlo/succor shields as heal potency, we get a weaker heal for more mana. Our heal abilities are faster to use, but don't heal for as much. Lustrate feels weaker than it was. Excog is a waste of a charge. I saw someone suggest it go off at the end of its timer, which I like. I like healing as scholar, and I'm going to hold out on it. But right now, especially with tanks pulling like idiots, I don't feel equipped to do the job.

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Originally Posted by Esuka5

I've noticed two main issues:
Mana Economy

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idk about mana economy considering i always run out of mp as ast in trials now, while my sch cohealer goes from almost empty to full mp in less than a minute. and while i agree that whm has the best mp economy, scholar's is way better than ast's

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Originally Posted by Esuka5

Holding Aetherflow charges for heals is important for dealing with heavy damage.

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where is your cohealer? what are they doing? while i do agree that burning out all of your aetherflow on drains right away is unadvisable, rarely do i ever need to use more than one stack for healing before refreshing it.

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Originally Posted by Esuka5

... Lustrate feels weaker than it was. Excog is a waste of a charge..

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?? how exactly is a heal for more potency than lustrate a "waste". do you never let the tank's hp drop below 50%?

also are you using eos or selene? are you rousing the fairy? i think half of your problems would disappear if you tried to use more of your healing kit and if you didnt want to have everyone at full hp at all times. whispering dawn is twice as good as indomitability and its entirely free. a deployment tactics is miles better than succor especially if it crits or if convalescense was up when you used it and not nearly as expensive.

Scholar was never the "best" solo healer towards the end of HW though, it was Astro in this seat. Most of the time even in Noct-stance. Able MP economy with L.Aether+CO, and on-demand Helios. Just one shouldn't expect the same experience on Scholar even though any of the three can.

The more immediate changes I would like to see on Scholar are:

Excogitation. The potency should be upped to about 700 when it procs. If the proc expires you should not lose the heal or Aetherflow stack, just have it spit a normal Lustrate potency if the timer expires. We have too many not-so-good Paladins using Clemency because they apparently watch their HP bar more than doing damage, and sometimes like being above 50% HP at-all times (Which can be seen as insulting to good healers, cause we play the "did you die?" card, no. you are alive, stop making us work harder) It's so infuriating that I just stop using it with these less-than-desirable players, and use it as a <50% heal.


Aetherflow nerf is probably more detrimental for Summoner than Scholar, but both jobs got shafted here cause it's an Arcanist nerf.

If you die as Summoner without any Aetherflow or Lucid available you practically doomed the party for several GCDs of damage because you won't have enough MP to re-summon your pet, let alone continue doing respectable damage without enough refresh ticks and blowing Energy Drains means loss of Trance. There is no other DPS class in the game that suffers more than a death than Summoner. Scholar death isn't as bad, and recovery is more able. However the MP nerf to Aetherflow doesn't really catch-up to the increase costs of SCH skills. Adlo costs 1800MP at Level 70, you also get less return from the skill than a Noct-stance Astro that has less cost. So either the cost needs to be more in-line to the skill return or increase the return on Aetherflow.

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where is your cohealer?

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There are no cohealers in 4mans. I just recently hit 70, and my sch isn't geared for primal fights. We'll see how things go in Omega.

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?? how exactly is a heal for more potency than lustrate a "waste".

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650 potency vs 600. It's there, but it's not impressive. It's supposed to be a fire and forget heal, but thus far, trying to launch it before they drop below 50%, it doesn't get there. If they're sub-50%, I automatically use Lustrate instead.

I admit I don't use every ability of my kit, but I use all but one regularly. I've been using Eos since SB launched, the extra heals are nice. And yes, I like to keep people topped off. I don't consider that a bad thing for a healer.

Yeah, the extra Excog potency currently for "rewarding" the player for using it's timer correctly isn't a good sell by whoever designed the Scholar new skills. It's supposed to be a way to put it on the tank for a buster and the auto-heal to cover HP for the auto-attack after. The return needs to be better, and there should never EVER be any opportunity to lose an Aetherflow stack.

I thought we got away from this possible Energy Drain Missed junk with not enough accuracy, but now we have another skill that could put your Aetherflow at-risk and because of not-so-good tank players causing it. This is bad.

Bump to Embrace potency is fine. my reasoning is something has to give if they are giving us 1800 MP Adlo with less return than a Noct AB with less cost. Reverting the Aetherflow nerf would fix SMN recovery issues and address the high-skill cost-return situation. If they think Deployment Tactics is the only reason they can stuff SCH with higher cost, well i'm not buying that reason because that is still situational and on a long cooldown.

I've been watching this thread since 4.0 became playable - thanks all for thoughts and input.

The SCH nerf has been upsetting, but post-4.01 content I feel:

- SCH scales better than other healers with iLvl. Remember, skill MP costs are not percentage based, but MP recovery is.
- Many SCHs don't use their whole kit. Largesse and Rouse are sorely underappreciated. Emergency / Deployment Tactics are conditional but good MP conservation.
- I don't see SCHs using Shadow Flare. It got buffed, it's an instant cast 0MP AoE DoT. There is no reason not to use this.
- Excog: communication with tanks is key, but for times like Susano EX, it proves itself time and time again as a "spend a GCD now so I can AoE later".
- Aetherpact I've been complaining about. But it's healing for 0MP. I'm on the fence here.
- I only wish our improved Aetherflow proc at 68 was higher chance, or just 100% chance. That's my biggest gripe at present.

I mained SCH from ARR to the End of HW and started playing AST to see what the hype was about. I kept leveling AST in 4.0 my ilvl is 315 and I've cleared a good amount of content on my AST.

Yesterday I started leveling my SCH hit level 65. I feel pretty strong. I time big hits, I know how to spike heal and preemptive heal so that I can spread DoT's and deal some damage on big pulls before having to get back to the tank. It takes a bit more work sure and concentration but it's doable. I don't run out of MP yet but again I have only healed dungeons, but on SCH same gear I'm wearing now, I felt I was struggling more on AST then I am on SCH. Sure we got a few nerfs but I feel we are still relevant.

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Originally Posted by NewSinz

Sure we got a few nerfs but I feel we are still relevant.

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Definitely. SCH is supposed to be all strategy and tactics anyway, and stuff like our Chain Strategem we can quickly pop and "contribute" to an increase in group DPS for how easily we apply it.

I'm not happy with scholar's AoE heals.

WD is weak, even when under rouse and FI it heals less than succor per tick. Succor eats roughly 12%mp for a 150p heal/shield, you don't use it unless you have no options left or you get the SS proc. ET Succor is the equivalent of one medica every 30s. Indom is by far the most powerful tool in SCH's kit, being an instant, no mp 400p AoE heal, but it too is on a 30s cd. You can get a total of 4 decent AoE heals a minute, costing you 2 aetherflow and 24% of your mp, of which you regain 10% back from aetherflow. And if you need to use both ET and Indom close together? You're stuck with 150p succor.

As for fixes, I'd reduce the cds of both ET and Indom to 15s. AoE heals as mediocre as 300-400 shouldn't be locked behind resources and half-minute cds. I'd also change Lustrate, Excog and Indom into off gcd spells to allow them to be affected by spell-based healing buffs. If they can make Empyreal Arrow an off gcd weaponskill, they can do this too.

IDK I find the cooldowns there as pretty good training wheels for bad players to not waste resources and lol at calling WD weak it's very very strong for a regen let alone one that cost us 0 mp and we don't even cast it ourselves


Edit: Half the post on the forums sound like people want SCH to be the main healer and come off like people that want to solo heal 8 man content. For starters the class can already just fine, and to be blunt about it in almost every real world scenario where high aoe healing is needed the sch has a partner they are assisting.

The class is all about learning fights inside and out and timing your stuff exactly as needed when needed and are insanely strong in that regard. If you don't want to be the secondary healer that focuses on dps and assisting the main healer when it's time to in 8 man content, why are you pretending to take sch seriously because you clearly are not.

When it comes to 4 man content they are more that good enough to heal it 0 issues and just need a small aoe dps increase.

Gathering from prior comments it makes sense that they designed sch for supplemental heals instead of a great healer in its own right. However Would also state that the utility that Ast brings seems to have overshadowed what a Sch is bringing to the table now.

PVE aside for a moment, for the last couple years I have main Healed in PVP content as a Sch. It was fantastic, the stance dancing aside sch never could provide much dps in this regard but its heal utility in a fight was outstanding... Fairy to act as a small heal turret, skills to mitigate all damage to yourself for a short time, shields for days, floating low-mid range heals and multiple in quick succession. being able to gauge a fight, focus on individuals that are pushing, sch acting as a juicy target that was able to provide more depth of strategy to the field.

Now it feels more like a limp noodle, unable to really help push a group, no more ability to help direct the outcome of a match. The DPS and Tank adjustments are much more fun to play, and I find myself playing WHM now as its basically a buffed SCH now.

AST to provide movement heals, and buffs. WHM to provide big heals/shields and dps.

what does SCH get, a timed fairy and no real utility.