Your mentor system is Horribly Horribly Flawed.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

Why are entirely optional fights such as EX trials part of the mentor system at all? Mentoring players is about helping people to learn the game, their class/job and helping people enjoy the game. That includes assisting players through MSQ related content. EX trials don't - IMHO - belong in Mentor Roulette.

---

A lot of people participating in such content for the first time really do benefit from having mentors to show them the ropes. Arguably, Ex Primals are THE most important stepping stone for newer players who plan to go on to advanced content such as raids. These are some of the first places where mechanics actually have some complexity, that failing them has serious consequences, and where slacking off on your dps may cost your group the fight even if you manage to handle the mechanics.

It may be optional content, but it's content for which newbies sorely need guidance - even something as simple as someone to recommend to them that they study up on fights like this before they take the plunge.

I have seen both good and bad mentors. Unfortunately, the bad seems to outweigh the good: speed-runners, bullies, "elitists", trolls, etc. I've seen them all. Even on these forums and in game, most tend to view mentors as jokes because the bad apples spoiled the rest.

I just recently got my crown (just needed that dungeon achievement), but I'm scared to use it. No, I don't have every job/crafter/gatherer to 60. No, I can't remember every dungeon and every fight and every mechanic. But I want to help people the best I can. It really sucks being somewhere new and not knowing anything. I'm not one who can learn by watching videos, and yeah, reading guides is helpful, but I need to do the fights to really learn them--kinetic learner, that's who I am. And I know others are like that too. We can't all just watch videos and read guides on things and have them down 100%.

I know I don't need the crown to help others. But I want it there so people know they can ask me. However, it's not even day two of wearing it (initially I didn't even want to since mentors have such a bad rep it seems), and someone demanded I be kicked from Weeping City for trying to help a new person (a healer, no less) with boss fights (specifically Forgell, which has a healer check!!!). I'm sorry if I take longer to type out my responses--I play on Ps4 and use a wireless keyboard for chat so I have to drop my controller to answer questions while also trying to do other things--like heal when people pull bosses before we finish explanations and in running as WHM or AST.

Yes, a lot of mentors are useless and only in it for the rewards. But not everyone. Yeah, I want the mount but it's not the only reason I have a crown. I want to help. I haven't even done and mentor roulettes yet, and haven't planned to until I refamiliarize myself with some fights. Again, not every mentor with a crown is a crappy one. And we are all human too. We aren't perfect. Don't berate us for making mistakes, or forgetting to mention a mechanic. Don't bully those of us who actually want to mentor for trying to mentor. We are human too. Have some compassion. Have some respect.

As of right now, my crown is off. Not sure if I will turn it back on anytime soon either.

I have my status on, if you are willing to help, why you don't dare to show it to everyone.

I think a lot of ppl over expected the mentor thing, the crown only tells ppl, you can blame me if I am not nice in your PoV. ^^;

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nights-Rune

... Most of the people I have met with crowns are either dead silent while I mentor the newbies or are complete and utter bullies.
yers ....

---

Actually they set the requirement too low, I think almost everyone is a mentor,
so if previously you grouped with bad guys frequently, then now you grouped with bad guys with crowns ^^;

Think positive, now at least you can blame them bcoz they have the mentor status on.

As an immediate fix, I suggest adding a check box [ ]No Mentors for DF,
at least it can make sure you won't be grouped with those bad players with crowns.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nicobo

I have my status on, if you are willing to help, why you don't dare to show it to everyone.

I think a lot of ppl over expected the mentor thing, the crown only tells ppl, you can blame me if I am not nice in your PoV. ^^;

---

Willing or not, some days when I get home from work, I want to relax and have fun. But it seems that those with crowns (good and bad) are more prone to be Keyboard Warrior magnets. And some days I don't have the energy. Not that good mentors should have to put up with the verbal abuse, but it happens. Unfortunately. :/

I've said it on these forums before. The problem with the mentor system is the language is way too vague as far as what they are supposed to do. As such, people project into it to mean whatever they want. It's like that fine print on legal documents or on your cell phone contract. What if it just said: "Be excellent to each other!" instead of all that tiny text of rules and regulations? Does "be excellent" mean treat everyone with kindness? Does it mean to live in excess and have every vice in the book in a effort to find happiness? Who knows.

I know plenty of good people that join with intentions of helping out. I know plenty of shady people that want it as a cover to act even shadier (since who would suspect the teacher?!).


It's the system itself that is the problem. Maybe it isn't a problem in JP. I don't know how their region handles it. It's pretty evident in NA that it's a mixed bag of good people and wolves pretending (or maybe worse, not pretending well enough) to be good. Maybe it works in other places.

I dont use the crown very often, if at all. I have /novicenetwork on usually and i think thats where they did a good thing. I help those out who ask if im not too busy(in an instance) and give advice accordingly, to that degree i think the nn at least on my server(when I'm on) seems to be the best help this system can offer. In a dungeon with randoms? Its not doing very well imo. Maybe the roullette itself was a little high tuned for some.I mean I get it, Ive cleared titan ex, doesnt mean ill be able to get a group synced down to clear it on my own

@ADVSS - I think the issue with it not working in instances is because the ones who aren't new to the duty tend to be impatient, and they don't want to wait for the mentor to explain mechanics and battles to the newbie. In a party of all new sprouts I had, they all waited patiently for explanations. Being that they were all new and wanted to learn. The run of Weeping I had last night with 1 new person out of 24? Disastrous because the majority did not want to wait for simple explanations of boss fights.

These explanations don't even take that long, but it seems a lot of impatient people get grouped with newbies, and don't really give them the opportunity to learn or mentors the opportunity to teach.

Simply put,

"Why?"

This game isn't a job, and it isn't like SE is paying mentors to give out advice, so a service that makes you play interactive help desk FOR FREE; means you'll get what you paid for. If YOU don't like it, and YOU feel like you serve as a better mentor. Than Mentor. You sitting around while "all the bads" take the reigns is example exactly of why the system gets the type of people it does, because nobody else will.

The system doesn't need checks and balances because let's be real, we're only doing it for the free tomes, and if SE is going to knock down a chunk of my sub to be a mentor; I will continue to give them exactly what they paid for. Also half of this game is explained and spoon fed where this system is more for niche points. Anything that is fundamentally important in this game, is given to you in game dialogues... So READ.

Oh and if you're saying my payment is the bonus tomes, that's funny, I'm pretty sure that's my payment for me contributing my skills to carry noobies through challenging content, not that I babysit an spoon feed them all the info like a teacher. I can't tell you how many times I get EX primals that would otherwise require scrubs to pay gil to get clears for, an I'm doing it for +10 lore when it could cost upwards to a mil in gil... so be thankful ;-).

You ask me a question as a sprout to a mentor (yes I am a mentor) I will answer, we go in, and you look like you don't know what you're doing, I will explain as the stuff comes up, or after we wipe. I can tell when you're NOT trying to learn and looking to get CARRIED, and if you learn too slow, sorry that's someone elses problem, not mine. You get three tries of me watching you do what I explained to you, and if you're junk at it, sorry, it's nothing personal, I just got stuff to do and no time to waste on someone I'll probably never see again. If you want to act like this is your $14.99 and you can play the game how you wanna play it, sorry, you'll be someone elses problem, because I'm kicking you.

I guess I'm part of the 1% that's doing this to help. I don't care about the mount, and honestly wish they had never added it as a reward. The tomes are already enough of a reward for running the mentor roulette at least once a day. Also I'm usually rather quiet. But I do explain mechanics to people who seem interested in learning them (for example, if they wait for them before each boss fight). Not long ago, someone asked me how to extend cards to other party members while in the Weeping City, and I was happy to explain Royal Road to them. Also, I was impressed with how much I remembered of the AST quest line since it has been a while since I did those haha.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lilith_Merquise

The system doesn't need checks and balances because let's be real, we're only doing it for the free tomes,

---

I agree with some of what you said in this post but this right here, I don't agree with. Yes some people did this for the bonus tomes they get in their new daily roulette, but some of my friends and I, as soon as we heard about this Mentor system, were generally excited and were all saying "I can't wait to be a Mentor, I like helping those who want the help and want to learn things." This was our true and honest feelings when Yoshi P announced it. So I get some people just do it for the rewards and nothing else, but some of us actually want to help the player base.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

"I can't wait to be a Mentor, I like helping those who want the help and want to learn things."

---

lol, you could do it from day 1 of the game. You don't need a crown for it.

P.S. I have that crown, but I have turned it off (changed status to Online). I tried to remove my mentor status, but I didn't like 30 days penalty, so I allowed this to stay. And I don't do mentor roulette, because during my playing since ARR beta3, I still haven't found time to finish some guildhests.

There really needs to be some sort of mentor rating for those who actually give helpful advice or at least try to.
I think in the whole 3 months i seen like............. 2 pple with crowns that came out patient and helpful in a dungeon run.

For me, the image of a mentor is that you go above and beyond what you expect of a normal player, thus a little symbol on your name to recognize you apart so that pple who need help may recognize and come to you specifically. Not so that you can give your input and expect others to 'get gud' within your set timeframe.

i all for a mentor rating system i had mentor tank join with one player then he left as soon the instance start.

I've run into far more people who attack mentors for not playing perfectly than mentors being jerks to new players. A rating system won't work. Too many people will give mentors a negative rating simply for being a mentor. If someone with the crown is actually harassing a new player, vote dismiss that person for harassment and report.

You won't find a perfect system in any game because it's impossible to prevent abuse. Even if they could afford to have a system in place where GMs recruit volunteers based on skill and good attitude etc., you'll still run into those using it for the status rather than out of any desire to help others. I worked on a game as a moderator for a while, and I had plenty of colleagues who were just in it for the attention and did nothing good for the game.

I think novice chat was a pretty great addition to the game. I can't speak for every server, but almost no question goes unanswered on Hyperion. I see mentors offering to run dungeons with new players to speed up queues, and it also creates a community for new players (and even mentors) to make friends they may not have met otherwise in a game with cross-server dungeon matching (which I still feel should not exist in a game that has no cross-server friends/tells/grouping). It's not perfect, but I think the mentor system does a lot more good than harm.

i run into good mentors but also see mentor be jerks not all them but there few of thems

And yet the other day someone sarcastically called me a preacher because we were failing (miserably) at a fight and I tried explaining it. Of course there are bad mentors, but on the other hand, people need to stop with the attitude towards them and quit assuming each mentor is doing it for the crown. It becomes a cycle of resentment between mentors and new players.

The Mentor system should be split in two, because it's just trying to be too many things at once:

1. Actual Mentoring. This should have a non-glamorous icon that isn't an ego boost, and zero bribes or rewards. The real Mentors that want to Mentor will do so without bribery (and have already been doing so, since long before the system was implemented).
2. Some sort of 'Heroic Status' you get for fulfilling enough requirements. There, you're special now, you leveled a lot of stuff, etc. Have a Gold Crown. Have access to a "Duty In Need" Roulette where you get bribed with a pegasus for agreeing to queue in to any Duty that's struggling to fill players, prioritizing new players in need first. You don't need to talk or even be nice, just get your warm, Crown-wearing body into the queue.

There. Now Mentors can Mentor with an icon and role that means something, and 'Mentor Roulette' can be converted into a more transparent version of its actual purpose, 'Fill queues that need players so I get a mount eventually Roulette', helping content queues pop without triggering an influx of players that just want the icon and daily rewards and achievement, but really would prefer not to actually teach others.

If someone still turns on Mentor status in that revised system and then doesn't mentor, then I don't even know.

How about a glamour mentor? For those who are experts in fashion, vanity and wearing things for show and even a sparkly animated crown (with extra sparkles!) /shrug

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eorzean_username

The Mentor system should be split in two, because it's just trying to be too many things at once:

Actual Mentoring. This should have a non-glamorous icon that isn't an ego boost, and zero bribes or rewards. The real Mentors that want to Mentor will do so without bribery (and have already been doing so, since long before the system was implemented).

There. Now Mentors can Mentor with an icon and role that means something, and 'Mentor Roulette' can be converted into a more transparent version of its actual purpose, 'Fill queues that need players so I get a mount eventually Roulette', helping content queues pop without triggering an influx of players that just want the icon and daily rewards and achievement, but really would prefer not to actually teach others.

If someone still turns on Mentor status in that revised system and then doesn't mentor, then I don't even know.

---

You can do that RIGHT NOW, just be a mentor with out the status if you or anyone else knows so much. What you are describing is basically what is already happening. You get the mentors only in it for the rewards (me) and the people that apparently want to judge an not apply for it but feel they are a better mentor. You can do exactly what you described, with out anything being done to adjust it.

That crown isn't a sign that you are a Noobie Wooping boy to jump when the idiot in your group says "How High?" That sign is something you get because you put in the time, the dungeons runs, and the skill to "play" this game. For better or worse. It's SE's way for congradulating players that stuck it out and have played enough to be considered able to impart SOMETHING to players. Whether that's a sense that if you can't figure out what is being told to you, this game isn't for you. Whether it be that you shouldn't trust randos and ACTUALLY READ up on the information YOURSELF, rather than being a burden and relying on others; than a lesson was taught.

Whether you realize there can be good people in this game that have NOTHING better to do but spoon feed you and hold your hand, have at it. But that crown isn't a symbol that I NEED to clean the mud off every nooby that wants to spam Thunder because it was the strongest move in other FF"s and it's their "$14.99" It's a symbol that I put in the time, and arguably I know how to play this game, so when a nooby questions me, I only need to point up. ;-)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nights-Rune

Most of the people I have met with crowns are either dead silent while I mentor the newbies or are complete and utter bullies.
"I have a crown so shut up I can do what like!"
"I am a mentor so I am better than you"

---

I wish I would get those people. Every time I join a mentor roulette, I end up with people that have no idea what to do. Sure they have the crown, but by now I wonder how much money they spend to get the clear of specific trials or raid content, just to be able to meet SE's roulette requirements. SE should start with the changes right there, not everybody should get a new mount :D

here I have to say it to you all clearly...when the Mentor system was about to be introduced, some of us (not many) but some of us has expressed what you all are saying in here, it was something totally predictable, and we, those that said so, have been mocked about, insulted even to a point when it was totally obvious. Most found it the top of the top something incredibly useful and the like, we were demeaned so to speak on the boards. I am sorry to say but

you wanted (community that is) this system in place, you got it.. now you have to live with it.

when it was time to come forward you (general you) didnt come forward, you let things go by when it was totally obvious, now you live with it. You wanted a system that rewards people that give their time to teach others, when most dont care, now you live with it. Afterall, SE gave you all (us unfortunately) something you wanted, now you got it and you have to live with it.

Mentoring is the dumbest system ever, you cannot have a mentor system with people that are for the most part not even mature enough to use proper decorum when speaking to others, you cant have a mentoring system with players that barely aged enough to drink a coca cola, but you all wanted it..so now....why complain for something you wanted? you keep it and deal with it.

and yes I have it out of my chest finally. It was obvious VERY obvious and it will promote to create a generation of self entitled people that since they were not *properly* mentored, they will just reproduce the same type of teaching. Heck I even met one yesterday that told a player (new to the place) was in Ramuh, to play it unsync, when he himself didnt give a single advice other then that piece ?

It has gotten to the point for me where whenever I see a crown next to a name, it is just a glorified achievement (like a title) and nothing more. I have grown to expect mentors to not help at all. I've even seen one whine about people not doing mechanics right, yet they offered no advice and kept begging us to kick him. ◔_◔

The only mentors I trust are ones that I know from my FC. I'm sure there are good mentors out there, but they are hard to come by for me at least. I am optimistic that they system will one day change.

[QUOTE=Lilith_Merquise;3783558] snip [QUOTE]

I am not sure how to take your post so before I put on my warrior helmet I want to be sure I undestood it the right way.

You are in essence saying that the crown that identifies you as a Mentor is a recognizion by SE that you have achieved that status through efforts and in noway a sign that gives you somewhat the obligation to help the rest ? and even when asked you merely look down on those people and tell them to go and read by themselves ?

Do I get this right ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lilith_Merquise

snip

---

This guy describes 95% of the "mentors".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Huskell

This guy describes 95% of the "mentors".

---

I am still holding on my comments before I jump on that person...you know, we could misunderstand what he or she wants to say....I cant believe there are people like that..maybe he or she is just being ironical ..if so he or she failed at being it.

Also, there is this fact that once pple get mentor status they stop giving others commendations (tho not just limited to mentors)
There should be a system where if one doesnt put in a vote, their status slowly decreases and then gone.
As of now, its harder for newer people to get mentor status regardless of how helpful they are compared to when the mentor system first came out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MeiUshu

You are in essence saying that the crown that identifies you as a Mentor is a recognization by SE that you have achieved that status through efforts and in noway a sign that gives you somewhat the obligation to help the rest ? and even when asked you merely look down on those people and tell them to go and read by themselves ?

Do I get this right ?

---

For the most part, yes.

The part that I would disagree with is "tell people to go read themselves." That part I'm saying if you want things to be done better, have a basis to work off of by actually reading or watching videos on the content before doing. I get that just because you watched a video doesn't mean you know it (or else everybody would clear everything), but be able to know what people are teaching you rather than nothing. If your excuse for why you are wiping in a fight is because "It's your first time" there are many other fights with similar indicators to condition players to know what to do with them. So to act like it gives you a blank check for stupidity is not the way to go about it.

If someone asks me about mechanics or wipes to them, I will explain them, sure. But if I can tell they are NOT trying to learn them, or have a learning deficiency. That's not my problem. Find people willing to deal with you, and run stuff with them don't subject me to you, and expect me to suffer it because there is a crown next to my name. If I can teach you, I will do what I can, if I can't, you're gone. What I hate the most out of noobies are the people that have ALL of the resources around them, and utilize NONE of them, because they would rather have someone take their time and others to hold their hand through mechanics that they could of been familiar with themselves had they only put in their own time and effort to acquire them.

If you say:
"... It's my sub, I'll do what I want..."
"That's not the way I play this game/class..."
"......"
"Play your own game, don't worry about me..."
"Got it.. *continues to do the thing you told them not to for 3 attempts now...*"

= You're getting kicked

If you say:
"Thanks for that, I wasn't getting it"
"oooooo ok! I understand *does what you taught them* thanks!"
"Oh that's a cool trick, I'll remember that."
"Hey guys, that was my bad I'm still not sure about *insert mechanic here*"

= You will stick around

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MeiUshu

You are in essence saying that the crown that identifies you as a Mentor is a recognizion by SE that you have achieved that status through efforts and in noway a sign that gives you somewhat the obligation to help the rest ? and even when asked you merely look down on those people and tell them to go and read by themselves ?

Do I get this right ?

---

I think some of the dull crayons dont realize that the mentor system is not, first and foremost, an achievement (the achievement is an extra add).
But more a neon sign for newbies to look up to, for those players who want newbies to recognize them as a person to 'come to' for help

The problem with this is that most mentors have the patience of a flea poop. AKA their ADHD standards or gtfo
ex) I had a PT in Gubal Library, the newbies were dying like 10x at the book boss, i kept ressing them but they died continuously but i could tell they were trying despite the horrific deaths. The tank and i (healer) eventually killed the boss. Inwardly i thought to myself, at least 80% of the so called mentors would ditch the instance at this point.

In the end i got alot of gratitude for being patient and that felt nice.

I take my mentor flag reasonably seriously i.e. ask a question and I'll try my to answer as best as possible. I see no reason explain mechanics and potentially come off as incidentally condescending if a duty is progressing smoothly as-is. As for the Novice Network, I can't really comment; never had anyone on Balmung /tell me for help!

On the subject of bad behavior on both sides of the fence: I've had far worse experiences in dealing with newer players that refuse to listen and/or are extremely rude in response towards form of constructive criticism than I ever had with fellow mentors. Anecdotal, sure, but what else do we have to go by?

I did over generalize a lot as people have pointed out but its hard to be detailed with a word limit. Ironically I DO think non crowns should be shining examples willing to learn and not complete asses to people. To all of you who do actually mentor properly this is not aimed at you. I have only personally met like 2 mentors that were worth the crown and its a shame more cant be like you who actually do guide and teach.Hence why those who do it properly should be rewarded also.

As for the system going away I am not sure. I think were it to be a little better then it has potential to be really useful to players who don't have a group or FC or are new.

I am not intending to insult anyone, I have just seen a serious problem that I feel needs to be worked on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lilith_Merquise

snip

---

then I am afraid to say so to you but you dont deserve the title of Mentor....at all. you are the reason why I was against that system and still am. Your attitude/approach whatever is just dispicable and does in no way reflect what a Mentor should be like.

Mentoring is a job...sure some wont listen but as aMentor you have the power (and I dont speak of kicking) to make them follow you or suffer the conséquences...but in no way is your place or your right to look down on those newby for no reasons....(albeit this is independent of a crown )

The crown is NOT a reward for your achievement is an indentification to others that you are someone they can turn to for questions , game questisons, class questions, job questions, mechanics questions and by your decision to be a metnor, you accept that fact that youw ill be bugged stopped when walking around interrupted andt he like...if you cannot deal with that YOU shouldnt be a Mentor and just give up on the crown AND status. you dont deserve it

I'm still of the opinion that the mentoring system should have been a voluntary thing. I would much rather talk to someone who is experienced at their main job, who actually WANTS to help, instead of the people who just got the crown because a) they could or b) just wanted a shiny icon. Of course there are mentors now that do actually try to help, but plenty of the others are completely useless and prattish.

What would have been the worst case scenario here? You get a new player asking someone who may have to tell them "oh, I'm sorry, I don't know that particular answer"?

I confess to being a largely silent mentor, unless the sprout or person new to the duty either a.) asks for advice at the start, or b.) is clearly struggling/dying to the same mechanic/wiping the group repeatedly by not figuring out what to do. I generally assume that most players don't want their hands held, and will try to figure out mechanics on their own, and taking that fun away from them by immediately launching into a diatribe of every fight mechanic in the instance seems rather condescending and gauche.

Sorry if this makes me a "bad" mentor, but I was raised to believe that's it's polite to give advice only if it's asked for, or if it's really needed. I'd be curious to hear what sprouts think of this approach, though...I should ask in our Novice Network when I get home from work.

Less concerned with the behavior of mentors, more concerned with the fact that many of them aren't even remotely competent players. If I had 1,000 gil for every time I saw a mentor utterly failing to perform their role, I'd have enough money to pay for a relinquish on Balmung.

Not sure how long i was gone from the game, but the mentor system did not exist when I left. Coming back I decided to restart because I could not remember how to play my class. A week in I sat and watched a group of mentors verbally fight with each other in the novice chat channel for at least an hour. It was pretty disgusting. I figured out how to remove the sprout and leave the novice channel and have never looked back. Finding a good FC is all you need. Or use a system like SOE did EQ2 did where you had "guides" that were at least monitored. I used to be one would willingly do it here too help people out.

Queue for mentor roulette on WHM. Everyone says hellos. I buff the party and off we go. DRK has grit on but not darkside. I don't say anything for the first pull.

Second pull, I say "Darkside?"

No response.

Third pull, "Do you have Darkside?"

No response.

I check the chat log. He said Hello all in English. I find the skill in auto translate anyhow. {Darkside?}

No response.

I start turning cleric stance on for every pull longer and longer to do more damage, cutting it close a few times. I'm trying to weigh whether I should ask again. I've had runs where a DRK never turned on Darkside. I've had runs where an arcanist physicked the tank and accused me, on SCH, of not doing my job when I advised them they'd be most effective if they dotted all the enemies. Some people get hyper defensive about what they perceive as criticism, or it just falls on deaf ears.

Just as I've steeled myself to not saying anything and staring resigned at that lonely Grit icon for the run, the DRK turns on darkside. I was about to recommend he use Blood Price at the start of every pull when lo and behold he starts doing it.

Not everyone wants to play optimally all the time. I get that. I feel that way myself sometimes.

Breaking this whole thing into camps "All mentors are bad! The system is broken!" "All new players are lazy and unwilling to learn! They're ungrateful and won't take guidance!" is the worst kind of over generalization and sloppy thinking. Of course everyone has bad experiences with one or the other, but isn't that because bad experiences tend to stand out in people's minds?

Look at the Tales from the Duty Finder thread. How many of those are bad stories versus the good ones where players pulled together and supported one another? I can tell you I've seen the negatives get far more forum response and interaction than the stories where things went well.

It's important for everyone to assume good intentions in cooperative game play and go from there. And when people don't react the way you want them to, the only thing you can control from there is your response.

Could the mentor system use more guidelines and maybe even higher standards for entry? Sure. Could the crown be a different icon so it doesn't look like a player putting themselves above others? Sure. Should the mentor roulette rewards be rethought? In the case of that achievement mount, absolutely. But give mentors the benefit from the doubt you'd give any other player. A lot of us really are just here to help.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MeiUshu

Cool Story

---

It doesn't change the fact that I am, and if you want to hold player hands. Have at it. But I don't pay a sub to work a job I'm not getting paid for. Tomes are me helping to clear the content since they couldn't do it themselves or find a FC/LS willing to help em clear content, or pay the gil amount that players are selling clears for. You want to be high and mighty, fine, but if you know so much get off your rump and get a crown so you can do the mentor roulette and help noobies out. If not you're just being a Arm Chair Activist, criticizing from a far with no intentions to improve. The fact I help contribute SOMETHING to new players is what "$free.99" gets you.

NOTHING IN A VIDEO GAME IS A JOB, Until you actually receive monetary incentive to conduct actions you put in what you're willing to do FOR FREE. And if it's the glory of feeling like you helped someone, great, if it's the tomes because that idiot that thinks he can stand in all the AoEs and be "healed through it" than you do what you gotta do. And given that I'm getting some likes for these posts. I'm going to assume that there are those that have the same mind as me, just as there are the Arm Chair Carebears that want to complain and contribute nothing more than words.

Funny enough many of the posts i've read that do complain about it ARE NOT Mentors, and refuse to take up the mantle out of some sort of righteous protest. When in truth all you're doing is hurting the players more by offering nothing more so than the players that offer very little but at least are offering SOMETHING. Again whether it be the knowledge that there are jerks out there and that if you want anything done, sometimes you gotta use what tools are at your hands. Or that there are some people willing to hold your hand and let you walk all over them.

no you are not, not remotedly even close to it, no matter how much you want to convince yourself of the contrary.

You, and those like you, are a pleague, a sickness, that should be eradicated to the root, understand removed from the game as a whole...hopefully it will soon be the case as the damages done by you and those like you are high to new players and to those Mentors that take this to heart knowing how much it is important to support, guide and help new comers. You contribute to give a bad rep to the overall Mentor group and promote arrogance to its best with new players..

You just an ignorant person, very ignorant and arrogant in a negative way which makes you a sad little person.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lilith_Merquise

Or that there are some people willing to hold your hand and let you walk all over them.

---

http://i.imgur.com/v6S3HEf.png?1

Anyhow, I do see your point as some players hate to take any sort of constructive criticism. I was told to 'not blame anyone' when the tank died from a bomb in Hakkuke Manor at the final blast. Someone was reiterating the fight mechanics. I only said that, those mechanics were not the problem since we did them correctly and that only the tank died from the bomb. I didn't say anything bad about the tank or his/her ineptitude at dodging (could just be a brain fart or keyboard froze or didn't react / camera got zoomed awkwardly or whatever).

When it becomes pervasive to that extent at identifying the cause of wipes, I do feel a little down inside. I prefer to take responsibility for my actions in causing success and failures for the entire group, since my groups' success is also my success and vice versa.

As a sprout, it depends on the context of the environment. Whether you see players rushing ahead you (probably efficiency - achievement orientated players) or players waiting before everyone is ready, or players talking and being chatty. It's best to explain it after a wipe, so it makes more sense. You can also make a quick outline of three or so sentences of key points and remind them when the mechanic is about to happen in fight, then reassure them it will be fine [if it is the sprout in question that is failing the mechanic or failing to notice the contingency]. I kind of prefer to learn the fight myself and design a strategy, but the run of the mill average player just wants to clear it and probably is thankful afterwards.

My biggest gripe with these crown status mentor players are that, by and large, they all try to rush mobs before I establish a solid ground of aggro on mobs, and do things pre-emptively, like activating switches and whatnot. Which I am somewhat kind of, and not grateful for. I do certain dungeons over 30+ times already, and I just autopilot with a blank mind. However, I have to be at my tippy toes and mashing buttons to move fast and swiftly when these players come. They also tend to be tippy happy in terms of telling me to optimize my gameplay like... I'm restoring mana using Umbra Ice after transposing from Astral Fire, and they start commenting that I'm an ice mage, or how I need to use Fire II only on mobs of 3 or more before BLM or something of that sort, when I (a) don't need said advice, (b) don't appreciate being told to play optimally when I know I am not playing optimally, (c) could possibly be considered pretentious, condescending or stupid based on the way they say it with a few remarks like "lmao", or some further comments (although I don't really care about the tone, and more so the content - but I can definitely see other sprout players avoiding you guys like the plague).

I can definitely see the correlation between crown status, willpower and focus to grind to said status, and trying to rush through dungeons without any consideration of the status of other players' experiences or willingness to pre-read "video guides, strategy wiki guides" on everything, of which, I recall, the Japanese might presumably do so in converse to American culture (I might be wrong), and thus further infer that a mix of some minimal experience requirements, as well as a formal community approval process would get better results. At least a plus or minus voting system, where you can only vote three times a day on mentors as a new sprout would filter out the bad bunch.

Also, a pretty good system would be a trinity-tiered styled graph with multiple edges from points A, B, C - stating efficiency, conscientiousness, relationship. Before any dungeon or trial or whatever can be queued, you need to select your point on what you value the most. The system parses this in consideration in addition to the queue, so that you would never get a (0, 5) - (X, Y) trait player with the other player, henceforth eliminating irreconcilable value differences between players. The most social players who want to goof around or have interesting talks while doing small pulls or taking their time would choose relationship - or maybe they want to establish friendships. Players wanting to just get things done straight to the point would choose efficiency, aiding in pulling mobs, choosing the right targets, DPSing optimally and everything associated with said trait. Players wanting to feel needed, and want to do the run in a respectable manner in consideration of other players' feelings at all times, following closely with all socially inclined procedures like standard hellos, byes, explanation of mechanics, waiting for cutscenes would choose conscientiousness.

If SE had the capital, they could probably do all this by analytics and heuristics.