"Huge lack of tanks and healers in the game"

@Mykul, hate is what determines participation.

That's why people spam big heals. I can get full credit provoking the boss then dropping RoH, drop combat and leave, or spamming Flash and then the same.

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Originally Posted by Klamor

That sort of thing happened occasionally in RIFT as well. Basically someone would queue as tank and then immediately switch to a dps role once inside and just be like "someone else can do it." Obviously, you'll find people like that everywhere. Have you looked out your window lately? lol

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It was a big enough problem for them to change how the system worked.

I've been running roulettes on a daily basis because I've been leveling all my jobs for pretty much no reason.

I've come with a helpful tip to avoid having to deal with drama in a dungeon:
If someone says something other "Hello!" or "Good game", it's best to just bail right there. If someone finds something to say that doesn't start drama in the past, I'd give them a accommodation. Right now, if anyone attempts to drum up a conversation, I hover my finger over the abandon group button. From past experiences it's proven the 30 minute penalty and not completing the dungeon is way cheaper than the drama. I usually take those 30 minutes to reflect on my life, do my taxes, paint the house, clean the litter box, etc all the while realizing I dodged the bullet. Shoveling cat poop out of a box is way much more exciting than sticking around to see what will happen.

Have any of you actually had a situation in a random "leveling" roulette where a conversation went well? Usually it involves something completely random and offensive in my past experiences. I'd love to just turn off the chat feature entirely but if I did people would just assume I was a bot and try to ban me since I'd never respond... The only correct response is "abandon party".

Even the devs commented on how in a dungeon that you should consider your fellow adventurers like NPCs (maybe one of you guys can find the quote and link it). Therefore, if these NPCs start "speaking", they must be some sort of horrible artificial intelligence emerging and means the robot apocalypse is upon us. Best to (Run Away!).

Yea as I'm lvlving my tank I see it gets worse and worse...in the the vault the healer was in cleric stance the whole time not healing and pulling extra mobs, obviously next I die trying to save him...then the dps say stupid crap like "tank much" or "do you even cd bro" (second one was funny) but the point was I had blown my CDs on the first huge mob that I didn't even pull >_> lol I swear these ppl scare tanks away unfortunately I want my DRK 60 so two more levels of this garbage...the healer respone was I always do this...I'm like with who!!! A tank in i300 gear not synced gosh

But every healer besides the WHM ole faithful lol has been in cleric stance the whole time rushing the dungeon...I don't get it where is everyone in a rush too?

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Originally Posted by Klamor

That sort of thing happened occasionally in RIFT as well. Basically someone would queue as tank and then immediately switch to a dps role once inside and just be like "someone else can do it." Obviously, you'll find people like that everywhere. Have you looked out your window lately? lol

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It happened in DCUO as well. Caused loot rage. You would queue as dps, a heals would leave, so you would switch to heal to help, then the other healer would rage if you rolled on healer loot, but the dps would rage if you rolled on dps loot.

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Originally Posted by Aomine1992

lol I swear these ppl scare tanks away unfortunately I want my DRK 60 so two more levels of this garbage...

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My War is a 54... so I still have a bit of DF to have to deal with. I've leveled Paladin to 60 on my alt and liked the role so much I'll be leveling it on my main too (53 at the moment). I've earned my Zeta on War so I'm familiar with the DF but it's not something I enjoy. So much more fun to do it with friends and our FC is large enough so finding a full party for stuff we do is pretty easy.

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Originally Posted by Cherie

If someone says something other "Hello!" or "Good game", it's best to just bail right there.

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Yes, how dare people try to ask their party's preferences, or communicate strategy. What terrible, rude players trying to stir up drama.

And trying to be friendly. Good lord, what are they thinking? How toxic.

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Originally Posted by Iagainsti

This from a #lolDrg smh, anyway, I apologize that us tanks are the epitome of awesomeness (Sit back down PLD! nice try though) and that we are in short supply outside of our FC/LS groups because: 1) we make friends soo easily. 2)The thought of running with random herp derps gives me Delirium Tremens(Latin, look it up #google). In short, why would I want to waste my time in Stranger Danger DF when I can Blitz through it while having a convo with ppl I like?

#ByeFelicia

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you think they are your friends...lolol

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Originally Posted by CyrilLucifer

Yes, how dare people try to ask their party's preferences, or communicate strategy. What terrible, rude players trying to stir up drama.

And trying to be friendly. Good lord, what are they thinking? How toxic.

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If you are being serious, then yes, of course not everyone is mean and crude. It's not black and white though. It's not like, there are some people that are like evil incarnate and the rest are all little angels. The way to hell is paved with good intentions. Even conversations in good humor often degrade into something unpleasant.

Case in point, these official forums. We are a bunch of jovial little monsters aren't we? :P

If I'm trying to get a dungeon done for the daily I really don't want to discuss it with the group. If someone has a valid point, I will address it but if they want to take the dungeon off track for 10 minutes because (insert reason here) then I want to leave. Penalty is better than having to police a internet argument for strangers.

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Originally Posted by Cherie

I've been running roulettes on a daily basis because I've been leveling all my jobs for pretty much no reason.

I've come with a helpful tip to avoid having to deal with drama in a dungeon:
If someone says something other "Hello!" or "Good game", it's best to just bail right there. If someone finds something to say that doesn't start drama in the past, I'd give them a accommodation. Right now, if anyone attempts to drum up a conversation, I hover my finger over the abandon group button. From past experiences it's proven the 30 minute penalty and not completing the dungeon is way cheaper than the drama. I usually take those 30 minutes to reflect on my life, do my taxes, paint the house, clean the litter box, etc all the while realizing I dodged the bullet. Shoveling cat poop out of a box is way much more exciting than sticking around to see what will happen.

Have any of you actually had a situation in a random "leveling" roulette where a conversation went well? Usually it involves something completely random and offensive in my past experiences. I'd love to just turn off the chat feature entirely but if I did people would just assume I was a bot and try to ban me since I'd never respond... The only correct response is "abandon party".

Even the devs commented on how in a dungeon that you should consider your fellow adventurers like NPCs (maybe one of you guys can find the quote and link it). Therefore, if these NPCs start "speaking", they must be some sort of horrible artificial intelligence emerging and means the robot apocalypse is upon us. Best to (Run Away!).

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I hover my hand over the abandon button if I don't get a single response to my hello when I get in a dungeon. If you can't spare the time to respond to even a simple hello... then I'm assuming that you don't care at all.

I'm not talking a conversation.... just a hello.

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Originally Posted by Sylve

Theres no tank shortage.

There IS a shortage of tanks willing to put up with PuGs in the DF though.

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After getting into tanking full time (lvl'd a WAR thru fates pre-HW, but lvl'ing DRK now in DF), I understand why.

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Originally Posted by karateorangutang

I hover my hand over the abandon button if I don't get a single response to my hello when I get in a dungeon. If you can't spare the time to respond to even a simple hello... then I'm assuming that you don't care at all.

I'm not talking a conversation.... just a hello.

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Does a /bow and/or /welcome count? I play with a controller and although I have a keyboard hooked up to my PS4, it's always just been easier for me to hit one button since you can just add emotes to the bar. I always assumed people understood that I was essentially saying "Hi," but now I'm worried people think I was being rude by not saying anything haha

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Originally Posted by Dante_V

I'm on the NA data center and main a tank and I rarely see these groups everyone talks about. Every once and a while I get a doucher but for the most part everyone is chill and just does there thing. There is still a shortage of tanks and healers however. The new has worn off on the expansion classes and a lot of the flavor of the month people didn't make the cut and are going back to dps or whatever they played before.

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Same here. I've rarely run into horrible groups.

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Originally Posted by Galaktica

Does a /bow and/or /welcome count? I play with a controller and although I have a keyboard hooked up to my PS4, it's always just been easier for me to hit one button since you can just add emotes to the bar. I always assumed people understood that I was essentially saying "Hi," but now I'm worried people think I was being rude by not saying anything haha

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Sure, some kinda of response. I also play on a PS4, save up for a USB keyboard. It'll make your life a million times better.

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Originally Posted by Bodicca

Same here. I've rarely run into horrible groups.

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You guys must be pretty lucky. I get a bad group pretty regularly.

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Originally Posted by Galaktica

Does a /bow and/or /welcome count? I play with a controller and although I have a keyboard hooked up to my PS4, it's always just been easier for me to hit one button since you can just add emotes to the bar. I always assumed people understood that I was essentially saying "Hi," but now I'm worried people think I was being rude by not saying anything haha

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I play on the controller too, you can easily macro /p "Hello" and set it in your crossbar. I wish I've done this sooner, much more convenient

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Originally Posted by Cherie

Even the devs commented on how in a dungeon that you should consider your fellow adventurers like NPCs (maybe one of you guys can find the quote and link it). Therefore, if these NPCs start "speaking", they must be some sort of horrible artificial intelligence emerging and means the robot apocalypse is upon us. Best to (Run Away!).

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That's the wrong take-away from that dev quote you're thinking about.

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――Can you comment on the Content Finder（※30） system that FFXIV has used to let players form parties more easily?

Yoshida：In the past, I’ve said something like：“If you use the Content Finder, you can just treat most of the people you’re matched up with as though they were NPCs.” (Laughter) That’s not meant to encourage players to act out and be jerks, but rather to reinforce the notion that it’s OK to just form a party with people whom you’ve just met and to go out and have fun.

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Originally Posted by HolyGlassofWater

Try reading it as if I was laughing, it wasn't supposed to come off as entitled. I'm guilty of doing the same things and I main the Tank job.

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See this is the problem with this whole thread. You think because tanks aren't quing up in duty finder its our fault the qus are longer. Don't lump us in with you if you feel guilty that's your problem not the whole tank community. That is why wer ripping on your post and calling this whole thread pointless and stupid.

Its not our duty to spam duty finder every day I hate duty finder I only really use it for expert once a day at most. As a tank.

And switch you forum character to your main if you want people to take you more seriously.

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Originally Posted by Dererk

And switch you forum character to your main if you want people to take you more seriously.

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I'd personally love to be change mine. Where exactly do you do that because I haven't been able to find it.

Edit: Nevermind found it! :)

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Originally Posted by Sylve

Theres no tank shortage.

There IS a shortage of tanks willing to put up with PuGs in the DF though.

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Exactly
I'm leveling a tank right know but, considering the attitude of a lot (not all but a lot) of players i'm terrified when I think of tanking with PU cause I know that, as a "trainee" tank i will probably get a lot of insults for being....well a "trainee tank that can do mistakes time to time".
The worst part being that, 90% of the time, i get insulted by people who do not even play a tank so, most of the time, the comments will not help me to do my job correctly, it will just be a free clash oO

tanking is the biggest responsability in DF, if you dont have the best gears people will criticize you, if you're not the best tank out there they will criticize you, if you dont pull big enough the dps blame you, if you pull too big the healer blame you, i dont blame tanks for not joining DF, you have to be pretty confident in your tanking abilities to join a DF because you'll get the blame for the tiniest mistake. that's why you see so many tanks but none queuing, tanking is fun but DF makes it a nightmare. maybe if we all start understanding the responsabilities of tanking and be less hard on them and more forgiving more people would try tanking in DF.

on the other hand, there's nothing more annoying than an overconfident tank, who think he's a "god" for tanking and everyone should play HIS way or else he quits, no matter how good a tank you are, without a healer and dps, you are nothing. thank you for tanking and all but you're not special, we can replace you anytime.

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Originally Posted by RosaBlanche

thank you for tanking and all but you're not special, we can replace you anytime.

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It's faster to replace a healer or a DPS than a tank :^)

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Originally Posted by RosaBlanche

on the other hand, there's nothing more annoying than an overconfident tank, who think he's a "god" for tanking and everyone should play HIS way or else he quits, no matter how good a tank you are, without a healer and dps, you are nothing. thank you for tanking and all but you're not special, we can replace you anytime.

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My momma taught me that all the people's are special.

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Originally Posted by Sensual

It's faster to replace a healer or a DPS than a tank :^)

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Yeah I agree. Most of the time a df party fall apart if the tank leave or wait there for 10 to 30 minutes at least the dungeon is popular, but HW is not new anymore ppl (new and returned) rushed thru the content.

It is funny that ppl blame tanks in general to have an attitude, but I bet you that the PERSOn playing as a tank switch to dpa is the DPS now to have an attitude. Ppl with attitude or play badly will yell on others to feel better. I experienced that. I met dps going ad healer and them switching to dps to pretend to be another player. I encounter those ppl in DF parties.

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Originally Posted by dekal

Yeah I agree. Most of the time a df party fall apart if the tank leave or wait there for 10 to 30 minutes at least the dungeon is popular, but HW is not new anymore ppl (new and returned) rushed thru the content.

It is funny that ppl blame tanks in general to have an attitude, but I bet you that the PERSOn playing as a tank switch to dpa is the DPS now to have an attitude. Ppl with attitude or play badly will yell on others to feel better. I experienced that. I met dps going ad healer and them switching to dps to pretend to be another player. I encounter those ppl in DF parties.

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not blaming ALL tanks in DF, but most times, the bossy one with the shitty "i'm better than you" attitude is the tank.

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Originally Posted by RosaBlanche

not blaming ALL tanks in DF, but most times, the bossy one with the shitty "i'm better than you" attitude is the tank.

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Once again I disagree with u. My main is being a tank (all three tank classes), and every time I say to the healer or DPS to do something like "hey don't cast the tank if he/she is luring" I ll get a reply as don't be a smart ass. Do ppl think I am yelling? That I am saying this aloud and with a sarcastic tone? I speak with the same tone as I do in college with classmates and friends.

Or on another time when I see the DPS wasting a LB I said "don't use LB if the boss is bugged with reduced dmg"the DPS tells me "don't be an azzhole and just tank shit, dick" once again did I use a sarcastic tone? I use logic and knowledge on how to play against the mechanics in this specific game.

I don't even say anything other than Hi and when I see something wrong. Why do I get yelled on and insulted. But when I play as a DPS (I wanna get all my classes to lvl 60) and say the same thing as I did when I was tank now as a DPS I get recomms and thumbs up? Tell me how should I feel about the attitude those ppl give me.

What if...

https://i.gyazo.com/06ea095212ca5b0f...3678a2200c.png

https://i.gyazo.com/1485abab539a425e...225cb7a007.png

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Originally Posted by Sylve

Theres no tank shortage.

There IS a shortage of tanks willing to put up with PuGs in the DF though.

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This is pretty much it.
I know way too many people who straight up won't tank in DF because they either can't take the pressure of being in a lead role or can't stand the poorer performance found by randoms in a dungeon.
I personally just love tanking, it's my favourite role and I love to have a great time. I don't get upset at the poor performance of others, I mean this isn't savage stuff we're in. But it seems I'm somehow in a minority.

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Originally Posted by Dererk

Snip.

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I\\\\'m not lumping you in with anybody. I\\\\'m making fun of the fact that I hear that there\\\\'s a lack of tanks and healers in the game when there:s really not, hence the quotes around the title. What you quoted me for saying was merely a joke and seems to be the main reason why a lot of people here thought it was a rage thread. Lighten the hell up people. And I don\\\\'t want to go through the trouble of figuring out how to switch my character just so people can "treat me seriously."

I seriously have to be on my main to have people treat me seriously??? Now that makes YOU look like the asshat. I'm already posting on a previously maxed out tank

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Originally Posted by Canadane

This is pretty much it.
I know way too many people who straight up won't tank in DF because they either can't take the pressure of being in a lead role or can't stand the poorer performance found by randoms in a dungeon.
I personally just love tanking, it's my favourite role and I love to have a great time. I don't get upset at the poor performance of others, I mean this isn't savage stuff we're in. But it seems I'm somehow in a minority.

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I don't DF that often, but it's not necessarily just because of the quality of players in DF. I also know i'm gonna get recruited to run expert or something that day. I use my free time to lvl alts etc instead of my tank, because I know that I will be doing it that night regardless.

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Originally Posted by RosaBlanche

you're not special, we can replace you anytime.

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Then do.

Oh, wait... that's what this thread is about. People don't want to replace me, they just want me to spread myself thinner, and do it their way.

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Originally Posted by JeniLinsky

Then do.

Oh, wait... that's what this thread is about. People don't want to replace me, they just want me to spread myself thinner, and do it their way.

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This isn't what this thread is about.

You know what, goodbye everybody, I'm done explaining myself. Rail on me all you want, I never intended to offend anybody or order anyone around. The last sentence was meant to be taken in a joking manner. This thread is actually about people usually claim there are no tanksnor healers when that's simply not true because i see them everywhere. Not once did I EVER order ANYONE here to do ANYTHING

DF people suck so bad, its very rare you get players who actually know their job. I play multiple jobs at cap mind you, 190war/SMN, 188drk, 185sch/whm, so I've seen it from all sides. You can easily tell when you've got good DPS vs bad, same with healers. Normally I tank EX roulette since I play war the most, but 9/10 I'm running with a premade from either some friends or FC mates, whatever so I don't have to deal with shitty DF people and their bad attitudes when you offer constructive criticism/tips.

Like yesterday I decided to pug Ex roulette on war.. Load in, healer is super geared, more so than I. Monk is pretty geared, bard has full Alex left and... all vit accessories on the right.. I'm like OK I don't mention anything yet, let's see how it goes. I do my pulls like normal and the whm is cure 2 spamming me at 95% HP quickly going OOM, not using regens, asylum, anything even though I'm using CDs and managing self heals just fine. Brd is doing no aoes but single target amongst a big pack and everything is taking FOREVER to die. I gave some tips to the whm like he could divine seal + regen, use asylum and do some DPS if he wants and told the bard AoE DPS is better for 3+ mobs and maybe switch to dex accessories as that'll boost his DPS and I just get told to stfu noob tank. :/ then at the end of the run brd and whm instantly dip which makes me think they were friends and queued together, makes sense since I guess terrible/rude people stick together. But its this kinda shit that makes me not want to tank for these people and just stick with my friends.

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Originally Posted by megaman

snip

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Had a similar experience with a WHM, I noticed his heals were really low so I examine and he is wearing 1 healing acc and the rest caster accs, lol so I have a lvl 60 WHM so I gage him asking "hey thinking about healing what accs should I use?" He says "pff who heals these days it's all about the deeps so use caster acc noob tank" lol like wtf so I ignore him some how we make it through with me using every cool down for like virtually every pull including 1 mobs lol and the BLM spamming the SCH heal haha

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Originally Posted by Aomine1992

Had a similar experience with a WHM, I noticed his heals were really low so I examine and he is wearing 1 healing acc and the rest caster accs, lol so I have a lvl 60 WHM so I gage him asking "hey thinking about healing what accs should I use?" He says "pff who heals these days it's all about the deeps so use caster acc noob tank" lol like wtf so I ignore him some how we make it through with me using every cool down for like virtually every pull including 1 mobs lol and the BLM spamming the SCH heal haha

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I'd have just booted his ass.

Edit: Below:

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Originally Posted by jomoru

Tanks don't owe you anything. Its their life and game if they want to rp in town or afk because they are busy its their choice not yours. You want ot change it roll a tank and do nothing but pugs constantly. Nothing else.

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Erm... he *is* a tank.

He's basically saying "Shortage? What shortage? There is no shortage."

The *only* place there's a "shortage" of tanks and healers is in duty finder, because we don't want to put up with the bullshit that *is* duty finder.

I DF all the time and finish it in 15 mins as a tank

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Originally Posted by HolyGlassofWater

Yet, 90% of the time when i see a disciple of war class in a town or the open world its a tank or a healer. What's even more funny is that the "adventure in need" bonus is for tank in every single roulette category yet they're the one's I see most in the open world. Most often are they afk too. Just sitting there for hours and hours lengthening everyone's que times by doing nothing.

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Tanks don't owe you anything. Its their life and game if they want to rp in town or afk because they are busy its their choice not yours. You want ot change it roll a tank and do nothing but pugs constantly. Nothing else.

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Originally Posted by Aomine1992

Had a similar experience with a WHM, I noticed his heals were really low so I examine and he is wearing 1 healing acc and the rest caster accs, lol so I have a lvl 60 WHM so I gage him asking "hey thinking about healing what accs should I use?" He says "pff who heals these days it's all about the deeps so use caster acc noob tank" lol like wtf so I ignore him some how we make it through with me using every cool down for like virtually every pull including 1 mobs lol and the BLM spamming the SCH heal haha

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This right here is why SE is hesitant to release parsers. That WHM would have been gone the SECOND he said that nonsense.

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Originally Posted by HolyGlassofWater

This isn't what this thread is about.

You know what, goodbye everybody, I'm done explaining myself. Rail on me all you want, I never intended to offend anybody or order anyone around. The last sentence was meant to be taken in a joking manner. This thread is actually about people usually claim there are no tanksnor healers when that's simply not true because i see them everywhere. Not once did I EVER order ANYONE here to do ANYTHING

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The only way ppl are going to know it, is if u change the original post. Every post from here, usually hasnt seen any of the previous posts. (There's a lot of posts to read, to catch up.)

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Originally Posted by Hayward

This right here is why SE is hesitant to release parsers. That WHM would have been gone the SECOND he said that nonsense.

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It doesn't take a parser to realize that he was gimping both his heals and his DPS by doing that. He needs to re-read how cleric stance works.

Currently finishing my last tank class to 60 and will be working on healer right after. I just started healer up so I don't know much, but from a tank perspective the only thing I find annoying is when people pull the mobs for me and force me to hold every bit of aggro for them. I don't talk or rant in DF. I say my require, "Hello" and move on to tanking. That alone is enough to get tanks to turn away from DF.