With the extremely tight DPS checks MCH/BRD are being discluded from Savage groups

Four bards would be pushing it.... No synergy and all of them already do less than other classes without outside buffs.

Am I the only one who remembers that MCH and BRD's have abilities that decrease an enemy's resistance?

I have yet to find a group of people who believe that a BRD or MCH should not be in the group. Don't let a few ignorant groups be a representation of how the community as a whole feels about the two jobs.

I don't even have a DRG in my static and I can hit around 1k just fine on MCH.

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Originally Posted by SovereignAegis

There is now this prevailing mentality where if you can't do at least 1.2k DPS steadily then you're removed from the party.

...

MCH and bards are obsolete already, on the FIRST DAY OUT.

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I know a Bard who killed Faust Savage with his party, he was at 1170 DPS with NO DRG in the party, food (+27 crit/ acc)+ dex pot 60 HQ. And after what he said to me, The fight Vs. The oppressor is stressfull/very mana consuming for healers, at the point you won't do it without a mana song. So plz Git Gud and stop snip those jobs.

BRD and MCH are not obolete, and with a DRG they can do more than 1300 DPS on FAUST.

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Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

I don't believe Opressor can be cleared with an AST especially with current gear. I would love to be proven wrong.

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I should have it cleared tonight and will update, it will be whm/ast healing combo. We only had a couple hours in there last night but saw the entire fight. Should have it cleaned up and beat tonight.

All I can say is Im glad I hung up my bow and switched over to Ninja, level 60 on it now and gradually gearing myself up.

World first had a BRD.. get real.

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Originally Posted by LunaMana

World first had a BRD.. get real.

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Yup, that's all that needs to be said, pretty much.

I know everyone has been been making fun of Yoshi-P's "get good" attitude, but turns out he's right. MCH and BRD can put out plenty of DPS.

I wouldn't say MCH is in a terrible spot right now. They need some adjustments, sure, but they certainly aren't bad enough to justify not inviting them to statics.

That being said, simply because the best of the best of Statics like those that are world first doesn't prove a whole lot. If a Job is only good when played by 1% of all people who even play it, that's a very poorly designed class. While difficulty in class design is fun and rewarding, by my estimates I'm missing anywhere between 80-100 DPS on my MCH from a very very very slightly wrong OGCD weave rotation. There's a very steep fall off in effectiveness for MCHs that differentiates solid dps from abyssmal. And I think that fall off stands to be made a bit more gradual with some QoL adjustments, similar to the potency increase on the wrong-directional Skills they just added for DRG.

Mhm ofc it is tight dps check but as mch the only thing is for me is actully work out the rotation and i went from 800 to 920+ dps so yea not 1k yet but getting there need more work on it.
thats what i like savage it give me a challange for my class i play

World 1st A1 group has bard.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...UZc3U8jIkCZDvA

Now STFU.

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Originally Posted by otarolgam

Gotta admit, I've seen an A1S clear with a Bard in it.

Sorry man, your arguments aren't holding water this time.

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thats assuming any of the "arguments" had held water. every thread/reply is always the sky is falling levels of crying about how bad bard and machinist are dps wise, with no supporting evidence.

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Originally Posted by Kaze3434

thats assuming any of the "arguments" had held water. every thread/reply is always the sky is falling levels of crying about how bad bard and machinist are dps wise, with no supporting evidence.

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The last thread he posted a parse that got discredited by the people who were actually in that party. They were in A1 normal messing around.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

The last thread he posted a parse that got discredited by the people who were actually in that party. They were in A1 normal messing around.

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thats kinda my point. every post by cole is usually hyperbole about the bard/machinist dps situation with nothing but other peoples words to go by, none of his own testing, and ignoring links or testimonials of others who do play the jobs and do great dps.

You people may say that they aren't shunned now but just wait. The way Yoshi made BRD in 3.0 is going back to what BRD was in 1.23 and nobody wanted a BRD in the party for endgame stuff. And back then BRD had more support capabilities than they do now.

OP and everyone who agree with him are full of it. No one is excluding any of these classes, but I personally would exclude OP from my parties for reasons completely unrelated to whatever classes he does or doesn't play. Git gud, qq more, etc...

http://i.imgur.com/8mY9kFf.png
http://i.imgur.com/lv3pRcW.png
http://i.imgur.com/PM8W0jm.png
http://i.imgur.com/S6immxV.png

Reddit post about A1 Savage being cleared with both MCN and BRD in the same party.

http://i.imgur.com/YknaJ3O.png

/thread? @_@

Not this guy again. He was already proven wrong on this very topic lol. This troll is a hungry one...

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

Reddit post about A1 Savage being cleared with both MCN and BRD in the same party.

http://i.imgur.com/YknaJ3O.png

/thread? @_@

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I guess that settles it then :P

Yes because TP regen and reduced magic resist to make your black mage do more damage definitely doesn't justify having a bard.

This is a stupid topic.

Savage is balanced for i190 and up. This, and 90% of all the other knee-jerk reactionist threads (DPS checks, VIT vs. STR tanks, nerf content that's been out a damn week) need to be deleted. It does nothing but contribute toward the whirling vortex of negativity on these forums. Make your own PF group and call it a day. Prepare to wipe anyway, unless you're in a pro-static. Otherswise, wait till gear and the playerbase's experience with the content makes up for any current, existing skill or mechanical deficit.

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Originally Posted by FoxyAreku

Yes because TP regen and reduced magic resist to make your black mage do more damage definitely doesn't justify having a bard.

This is a stupid topic.

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Don't forget MCH turret ability to make enemies take 10% more Physical Damage or 10% Magic Damage with Overcharge which will help a lot with a MNK, NIN, BRD and DRG in the group while also boosting the Tanks damage as well.

On another topic:

We all should just let this thread die already. The answer has already been said.

http://i.imgur.com/N8lqNxL.png?1

I just wanna bump this thread up to point out one point only. People always complain stuffs without giving it a time.

I remember saw a thread saying that "Nobody will like MCH/BRD in raid, because they do low dps" and this "tight dps check, they will not let MCH/BRD" join and "MCH/BRD are not better support than any other DPS classes who out damage them".

But in the end, nowadays nearly every party in the PF has special slot for MCH/BRD to join for their support ability.
Today our Party Finder PT has waited 1 hour long only to have BRD/MCH filled the last spot.

I had a good laugh today in Alexander turn 2 via DF. One of the dps said that the BRD (me) should get the bombs bc they are worthless o.O. He said, "BRDs are worthless compared to NINs utilities and DRGs utilities." I lol and "shrugged" it off and DID NOT get the bombs. So another dps grabbed the bombs and the same dps complained and cried that I didn't grab the bombs. 1/3 the way through the fight the WHM for some odd reason was at 3k MP so I sung a mp song till the WHM was back up to full mp. Then 2/3s of the way through I had to sing again for the whm. So yea I laughed at the end and said "yea BRDs are totally useless"
....

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Originally Posted by Alise

I just wanna bump this thread up to point out one point only. People always complain stuffs without giving it a time.

I remember saw a thread saying that "Nobody will like MCH/BRD in raid, because they do low dps" and this "tight dps check, they will not let MCH/BRD" join and "MCH/BRD are not better support than any other DPS classes who out damage them".

But in the end, nowadays nearly every party in the PF has special slot for MCH/BRD to join for their support ability.
Today our Party Finder PT has waited 1 hour long only to have BRD/MCH filled the last spot.

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It's the same person making all these threads and I'm getting sick of him. Hint he made this thread too.

Elysium just cleared AS3...with a BRD.

Seriously guys, this thread is a joke.

Yay now bards and machanist can join crafters/gathers at the top of the we dont give a f about you list

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Originally Posted by loreleidiangelo

Elysium just cleared AS3...with a BRD.

Seriously guys, this thread is a joke.

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crank up the bard qq (maybe).