Playing an MMO with a controller

That's 1 thing that annoyed me and don't know how to set up, combat and non combat hotbars, guess i wasnt looking hard enough, like i DO play on the PS4, but not for content, more like fate grinding for alex/atma and stuffz.

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Originally Posted by Jamein

While I will agree that controller targetting is fantastic in this, to say it could be more precise/quicker and easier than a mouse is just something I can't agree on I guess.

You just stated the process which is press L1/R1 and cycle through or hold L1 and press up and down and cycle through and I think ultimately that is the point, you have to cycle. I make one single click on a mouse, that I can move over the mob/enmity list within a split second and it is done.

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The counter point for your argument and any others against controllers me would have to be "so what."

I play on a pc using an xbox 360 controller. I've defeated T13, and I'm working on Savage T7 now. It doesn't really mater if I have to cycle enemies or any other weakness of the controller because I can still complete and actively challenge the hardest content in the game and still come out victorious.

It literally doesn't matter.

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

The counter point for your argument and any others against controllers me would have to be "so what."

I play on a pc using an xbox 360 controller. I've defeated T13, and I'm working on Savage T7 now. It doesn't really mater if I have to cycle enemies or any other weakness of the controller because I can still complete and actively challenge the hardest content in the game and still come out victorious.

It literally doesn't matter.

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Feel free to re-read the other part of my post where I specifically stated it does NOT put you at a disadvantage by any means, it may not be as precise, but you are by no means a lesser player or unable to clear content for using one and I never ever implied that.

Nor was I ever against controllers. I like it when I want to chill out on the PS4 and lay on the sofa while playing instead of being sat at the PC.

I've used both, I do prefer my keyboard and mouse, but the controller is designed well and works just as good.

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Originally Posted by Jamein

You just stated the process which is press L1/R1 and cycle through or hold L1 and press up and down and cycle through and I think ultimately that is the point, you have to cycle. I make one single click on a mouse, that I can move over the mob/enmity list within a split second and it is done.

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It's fewer button presses with a mouse, but with a mouse it's both moving the mouse across the screen to the position you want to click on and then pressing the button. With a controller it's a few presses of buttons your fingers are already resting on anyway, without the need for that movement first. Either pattern can be done in a split second when you're used to it.

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Originally Posted by Jamein

Nor was I ever against controllers. I like it when I want to chill out on the PS4 and lay on the sofa while playing instead of being sat at the PC.

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That's the biggest reason I got the game on PS3 (and PS4 once available) in the first place. I don't mind playing games on PC if that's the only way they're available, but I sit at a computer desk all day at work. I'd rather kick back and relax when playing a game.

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Originally Posted by Kagalli

That's 1 thing that annoyed me and don't know how to set up, combat and non combat hotbars, guess i wasnt looking hard enough

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Character Configuration -> Hotbar Settings -> Cross

At the bottom of that tab (under the Set Selection heading) check the boxes for "Enable auto hotbar switching when drawing/sheathing weapon", "Enable customization for when weapon is sheathed", and "Enable customization for when weapon is drawn."

There are a set of checkboxes for each (cross)hotbar under each of those "drawn" and "sheathed" sections. Have one or more of them checked under "when weapon is sheathed" but NOT checked under "when weapon is drawn." These hotbar(s) are where you put non-combat actions like Return, Teleport, mounts, etc.

Similarly, have one or more of them checked only under the "weapon drawn" section and not under the "weapon sheathed" section. These are where your primary combat actions go.

The crosshotbar(s) you use for "Expanded Hold Controls" (the L2+R2 and R2+L2 settings) however, should NOT be checked under either the "weapon drawn" or "weapon sheathed" sections, as you have a different way of accessing those.

One note about this, though. It works pretty well for combat classes, but it's a global setting, and will affect crafting classes as well. Even though it seems like it should go to the "weapon drawn" settings when you start crafting (you have your tools out for that after all), it doesn't. So either you have to manually change hotbars to the one with your crafting skills, or you'll need your crafting classes to have their main crafting skills on the non-combat "weapon sheathed" bar (which therefore shouldn't be shared among all your classes, and needs to be set up separately for each).

I play PLD with a strange mix of controller/KB.

Stances, mounts, LB and other utilities: F1 - F12
Short/ most used CD buffs: Up, down, left, right.
Longest/ situational CD buffs (awareness, tempered will, hallowed, etc): Home, pgup, pgdown, end, insert, delete.
Shortest cd buffs (Fight or flight and rampart) and general battle stuff: Controller first hotbar
Pvp abilities: Controller second hotbar
Legacy mode, btw.

I feel like playing an action rpg =D

I love playing with controller. It is so comfortable and fun. My neck and shoulders hurt too much playing on kb/m.

Took me a while to get used to the crossbars, but really like them now. The only gripe I have still is not being able to fully/completely customise the buttons. So when I go play console games, I die a lot because I keep hitting the wrong button to jump. LMAO

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Originally Posted by Alipoprocks

I love playing with controller. It is so comfortable and fun. My neck and shoulders hurt too much playing on kb/m.

Took me a while to get used to the crossbars, but really like them now. The only gripe I have still is not being able to fully/completely customise the buttons. So when I go play console games, I die a lot because I keep hitting the wrong button to jump. LMAO

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PS4 update today let's you completely remap the controller buttons.

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Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

PS4 update today let's you completely remap the controller buttons.

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Really? How?

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Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

PS4 update today let's you completely remap the controller buttons.

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I'm on PC. Did that get updated too and I missed it?

Because last time I tried to move things around, it wasn't fully free to map it as you wish. It was more of a trade off, with a few options.

I use a controller when im fishing, or sometimes when im lazy and playing a low level class. But I think im doing like 10% of what I could do with my keyboard when im on a controller.
Targeting the target I want to target takes ages, and sometimes I target my own party and sometimes I just sheathe my weapon in the middle of battle, and well..

it was great for light farming though as a summoner, I figured out how to use 3 dots and fester and ruin and that was enough to kill garuda!

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Originally Posted by Alipoprocks

I'm on PC. Did that get updated too and I missed it?

Because last time I tried to move things around, it wasn't fully free to map it as you wish. It was more of a trade off, with a few options.

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Not that I am aware of, although the last time I tried using my DS4 on my PC for FFXIV, I was able to remap controls, sadly though the driver I had was not quite up to the task, and the remapping was a bit patchy....

The controller is doable for sure, but really KB+Mouse vs. Controller is just preference.

Me, I go best of both worlds and use a Razer Naga + Razer Orbweaver combo so I have pretty much everything at my fingertips and never have to move my hands. All attack/combat abilities on one hotbar are assigned to the numpad on the Naga and targeting on the scroll wheel clicks, all my CD's and spells and marking stuff on the keypad on the Orbweaver plus the directional stick for movement + mouse steer.

I understand how people can play on a controller, but I'd never try to play a MMO like this on one. If anything because of the camera control and strafing. I've become so accustom to how movement works with strafing, and I can turn either my character or just the camera precisely and as quick as I need to by turning with the mouse.

Not to mention you have more button combinations then you could possibly need with Alt, Control, and Shift modifiers, as well as the ability to switch to typing immediately, in case something needs to be said mid-battle.

I just don't feel that using a controller for this game gives you the same level of control. But hey, if they can do what they need to do as well as anyone else, I'm not gonna scoff at someone using a controller.

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Originally Posted by Kiara1

I use a controller when im fishing, or sometimes when im lazy and playing a low level class. But I think im doing like 10% of what I could do with my keyboard when im on a controller.
Targeting the target I want to target takes ages, and sometimes I target my own party and sometimes I just sheathe my weapon in the middle of battle, and well..

it was great for light farming though as a summoner, I figured out how to use 3 dots and fester and ruin and that was enough to kill garuda!

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I first tried the sheath/not sheathed setting since everyone recommends it.. But honestly, it just irritated me when I went to get treasures in dungeons. I do find without it.

People feeling that controller crossbar setup cant quite hold enough, there is an option in the settings to turn on an option that makes 2 new hotbars available that hold your more general UI buttons. Holding down the L2 button and then pressing and holding R2 will open 16 new buttons, holding R2 first then pressing and holding L2 will bring up another 16. These include emotes, abilities and traits, and TONS of other buttons. Check it out if you havent enabled it. It really helped me out.

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Originally Posted by Bruiser_Cruiser

People feeling that controller crossbar setup cant quite hold enough, there is an option in the settings to turn on an option that makes 2 new hotbars available that hold your more general UI buttons. Holding down the L2 button and then pressing and holding R2 will open 16 new buttons, holding R2 first then pressing and holding L2 will bring up another 16. These include emotes, abilities and traits, and TONS of other buttons. Check it out if you havent enabled it. It really helped me out.

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That's just crossbar 8's default configuration. L2+R2 accesses crossbar 8, and I've set it to be different for every class. I mostly stick my cooldowns there.

I play with controller and keyboard. Been doing it the same way since 2003 with FFXI.

I can fit everything on my controller. (L1,R1 and L1+R1) but I use lazy macros for lazy content.

For FCoB I use controller for GCDs and micro manage CDs with F-keys. Waymarkers and mob markers are Crt+numbers.

Movement and camera control with a controller is very easy, precise and fluid. The only disadvantage I see with controller is targeting. I play on a PC with a controller so I do use the mouse sometimes when targeting would be too chaotic / slow and I don't need the movement. Think the bomb spam at the final boss of Brayflox Hard.

FFXI and FFXIV are the only MMOs I\\'ve played with a controller instead of kb/m. If you played FFXIV 1.0, it was actually easier to play with a Dualshock 3 because the original team put more emphasis on developing the UI for controller input (presumably for the post-poned PS3 release?)

I played 1.0 with a Dualshock 3, as well as 2.0 onwards until the Dualshock 4 came out. I main Whm, and while it\\'s true that target selecting -can- be less accurate than using a mouse, I don\\'t currently experience any issues with it. Personally, I think I\\'d have trouble using keyboard/mouse and still comfortably accessing all my skills/spells. Having L2/R2 is great, and I can R1-pageswap without even thinking about it.

I use it to fish while laying in bed because i'm a lazy sack of crap.

Controller seems too tedious for this game at least. With a MMO mouse like Logitech G600 I have access to crossbar 1 and 2, which holds up to 24 weaponskills/spells/macros to my mouse itself. Movement just WASD QE. Targetting is so much easier, especially with floor AoEs like Flaming Arrow/Shadow Flare and things like Sacred Soil.

I love it when people reply to these kinds of threads citing efficiency.

It's true, KB+M IS more efficient in terms of how quickly you have access to stuff.

The thing is, though, there is no instance or fight that requires split second, frame perfect reflexes. Anything that you have to outright react to gives you ample time to do so, with the rest being up to individual player skill. That said, this is not a fighting game. You're not doing an FADC-into-ultra or kara cancelling. This game just doesn't demand such dexterity.

Of course, I know that me saying that is kinda pointless. This IS an MMO, after all, a genre known for its OCD levels of perfectionism. People will go "I do this cause it optimizes #s by XXX% TO THE MAX!" in a game that just isn't that demanding.

I use a wireless xbox 360 controller with a "evil d-pad" top shell mod.
I have the interface in kb/mouse mode with the hot crossbar showing because I use a combination of both(with all 10 kb/mouse hotbars showing). for things I need quick access to I use the controller. a lot of people take a look at my hotbar layout and are like "holy sh_t Jenna, how can you play with that many hotbars on your screen?"
what can I say. I have it in a way that suits me :)
right now I'm trying to find a mount kinda like they have in the stores/shops for the controllers so that when I'm in front of my computer I can let go of the controller to type without putting it down.

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Originally Posted by Fahzewn

How did you do that with LotRO? I wouldn't mind doing this on days where I just want to farm deeds and such.

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on games that gon't have built in I use pinnacle game profiler myself. but if your controller includes software for it all the better.
for a free one you could use an older version of xpadder.

I use a pad because character movements are more responsive using analog sticks rather than M+KB in my experience using both.

Access to hotbars has never been a problem for me except when playing ACN-derived jobs. Primary hotbar for regular skills, secondary hotbar for situationals like Goad or Lethargy. Tap R1 during the GCD to get to my situational skill, tap R1 again. No actions are lost, 'on demand' skills like holmgang, hallowed ground, and bene always go on my primary hotbar, so...

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Originally Posted by Hazama999

I love it when people reply to these kinds of threads citing efficiency.

It's true, KB+M IS more efficient in terms of how quickly you have access to stuff.

The thing is, though, there is no instance or fight that requires split second, frame perfect reflexes. Anything that you have to outright react to gives you ample time to do so, with the rest being up to individual player skill. That said, this is not a fighting game. You're not doing an FADC-into-ultra or kara cancelling. This game just doesn't demand such dexterity.

Of course, I know that me saying that is kinda pointless. This IS an MMO, after all, a genre known for its OCD levels of perfectionism. People will go "I do this cause it optimizes #s by XXX% TO THE MAX!" in a game that just isn't that demanding.

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I see you have not stepped into any of the coil turns yet.

Whilst there are console players clearing coil, but when referring to the top teams and early savage coil clearer, I've seen a console/controller user within. There's a reason for that.

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Originally Posted by Ooshima

I see you have not stepped into any of the coil turns yet.

Whilst there are console players clearing coil, but when referring to the top teams and early savage coil clearer, I've seen a console/controller user within. There's a reason for that.

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Yes and the reason could also be that nerds who have enough time to loose on this kind of content are usually no lifers who live with their computers. Reverse argumentation.

This kind of argument means nothing. you are not a special person just because you use a KBM or because you play the coils

Outside of pvp where the mouse is better for targeting among 72 players there is no need for a KBM to perform better in any content

Says another person who doesn't step into coil.

Nope, using KBM doesn't make us special. What makes me cringe is that people who haven't stepped into said content proclaims that said content doesn't require that dexterity and thus, the benefits brought about with KBM is nonsesne (and with you claiming that raiders are no lifers who lives by their computer - oh wow, not this shit again, does that make your point instantly valid?), it's really funny.

In any instance a MMO dedicated mouse is better than your controller because you simply does not need to scroll through stuffs with your controller. The mouse instantly makes 24 slots on 2 crossbars instantly accessible. That's an undeniable fact. However this does not say that it is not playable with the controller, but it is just more tedious. There are only a handful of players who are on PS4 that can play top contents at an competitive level, throw them a KB and a MMO mouse and I'm sure they can do far better.

I played MMOs for years using the Keyboard and Mouse, then when my computer pulled stupid I had to go to using the controller on my PS3. It was a learning curve, but eventually, I got used to it, and It's SO MUCH BETTER. Especially for me, when I get excited I shake really hardcore and then can no longer hit keys on the keyboard. But with a controller, the shaking doesn't even matter. After I got a new computer, I tried to go back to keyboard and mouse and I couldn't. Nothing made sense anymore. I couldn't do it, it was so bad. So I got myself a driver for my controller now I use it both on PS3 and computer and everything is good forever XD

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Originally Posted by Ooshima

Says another person who doesn't step into coil.

In any instance a MMO dedicated mouse is better than your controller because you simply does not need to scroll through stuffs with your controller. The mouse instantly makes 24 slots on 2 crossbars instantly accessible. That's an undeniable fact. However this does not say that it is not playable with the controller, but it is just more tedious. There are only a handful of players who are on PS4 that can play top contents at an competitive level, throw them a KB and a MMO mouse and I'm sure they can do far better.

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Depends on the class or role you're playing. Global Cooldown of abilities makes it so that you have plenty of time to flip through hotbars, so you're not behind those 'top notch keyboard mouse users' at all.

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Originally Posted by Ooshima

Says another person who doesn\\'t step into coil.

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How do you state so easily that i dont coil? Im on T11 like almost everybody on earth thank you. the fact that im not glamouring HA gear outside of my ring doesnt mean anything mate. and no luck with FCOB RNG even tho i got a few DRG gear which i dont play

You look REALLY retard with your assumptions

i find certain classes are better with controller or keyb+mouse controller = melee dps keyb+mouse = casters(including whm) i havent tried tanking with controller but i assume it would be fairly straightforward as there arent too many skills realy

that being said i hate the macro system in this game should be more free if your using a controller imo as most dont have an option that are using a controller

I'm using Razer Nostromo + mouse. Think it's better than keyboard or controller. Still have no idea how to move using wasd and doing skills at the same time on keyboard.

Read through the first page and then I decided to just skip right to the last page to see if this dissolved into another "PC vs. Console" debate. Did not disappoint. I love my controller. I love being able to walk in any direction I want as fast as possible without having to spin the camera. I can tell you with absolute certainty that having a controller has helped me and my friends out immensely when we were doing progression in T13 and other turns with Divebomb mechanics as opposed to our "MASTER RACE PC PLAYERS LOLZ" getting hit by bombs every other run.

That's not to say the Keyboard and Mouse doesn't have its advantages. I can tell that targeting for healing or tanking (and even to some extent switching targets for DPS jobs) would be easier with a mouse but at the same time I think any competent controller user would have found ways around this. I had one of my PC friends watch my stream once and he was amazed at how fast I cycle through things with a controller.

Whatever you are most comfortable with is the best option. I don't feel hampered at all with my controller. I see only Pro's to it; I see no Con's. My achievements speak for themselves.

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Originally Posted by Ooshima

In any instance a MMO dedicated mouse is better than your controller because you simply does not need to scroll through stuffs with your controller. The mouse instantly makes 24 slots on 2 crossbars instantly accessible. That's an undeniable fact. However this does not say that it is not playable with the controller, but it is just more tedious. There are only a handful of players who are on PS4 that can play top contents at an competitive level, throw them a KB and a MMO mouse and I'm sure they can do far better.

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I can promise you that I can scroll through any and all abilities I need, targets, party list and whatever else just as fast if not faster than most PC players. Even with optimized setups. The exception being the people who play this game, and other MMO's, like it was a job. I'm sure they have an advantage over me but not because of their Keyboard and Mouse.

I consider myself really good at what I do. If I can scroll through and memorize 5+ hotbars in the blink of an eye, I think I'm doing more than fine. I don't need a special mouse or keyboard. Not saying I'm in the majority just saying if you're comparing the two options you need to compare on similar levels.

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Originally Posted by Ooshima

Controller seems too tedious for this game at least. With a MMO mouse like Logitech G600 I have access to crossbar 1 and 2, which holds up to 24 weaponskills/spells/macros to my mouse itself. Movement just WASD QE. Targetting is so much easier, especially with floor AoEs like Flaming Arrow/Shadow Flare and things like Sacred Soil.

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It honestly isn't, at least to me it isn't. If I were to switch to keyboard and mouse, there is a 100% chance I would go from being a very decent Black Mage to instantly being replaced in my static. I tried my hand with KB+M with FFXI, GW2 and WoW and... how even? Too tedious for me.

All in all, it's just a matter of preference. Neither is better than the other as the game was designed to be played with both controls in mind.

T12 clear (BLM): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kccY1to_t20
Leviathan EX clear (SCH - 10 months ago): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grGQ_h-BzS8

I'm also an Australian on an American server. Do I get extra points for dealing with latency?

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Originally Posted by Clarkamite

dissolved into another "PC vs. Console" debate

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More like KB/M vs controller. Seeing how you can use either one on either platform, its pretty much turned into 12 pages of posts ending with "whatever your preference is". Pretty much like arguing whats the best side of the road/car to drive on. It'll just come back to what we're use to.

The whole "having loads of buttons to press instantly" thing doesn't apply for FFXIV because of global cooldown - I can easily hit a GCD move, switch crossbar, pop a buff and check the cooldown situation on stuff on that bar, switch crossbar again and hit next GCD in less than 2.5 seconds and it's not a problem. It's even fun, to be honest, having more stuff to do. I main DRG in FCoB and I've never felt like a keyboard would improve my play. Our BRD uses a controller as well and agrees.

Pet jobs, though, can be slightly more tricky even for someone who's as used to a controller as me. Pet positioning and waymarking is a little slower than it would be with a mouse, I reckon.

Hi, one of the best things I appreciate from FFXIV, if not the most....

Is its fully almost perfect compability with gamepad...

I just... can't... CAN'T move my character with 'a,s,d,w' keys... Or such, I just can't.... I like how they managed to make easy (IN MY OPINION) the controls, and I enjoy it.


Hearty thanks for giving us such an awesome controller environment! (Targetting is tricky when you start, but you can fully manage to do right with the time and some personalization of filters)


PS: Feel free to watch my channel, a lot of action with gamepad!