Viability of a Spell Speed WHM set up?

I see but this have nothing to do with Determination. This have to do with your Vitality that increases with time (more gear) since the more HP you have, the more SS will absorb. Also the shields from a SCH will absorb more with more gear. But the damages never increase with time so eventually with a SS/shield you will take 0 damages from some abilities of bosses when you are OUTGEARING the content.

I still don't see where Determination is preventing interrupt.

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Originally Posted by firstsin

Yes. Best example I can give is ifrit hm. As a WHM i stand just outside of ifrits push back aoe and never move. I am geared enough to not die from any attacks, just need to heal or ss some of the attacks.

In the past when I had i90 gear any of these hit would interrupt my cast. But now I can sit in most aoe and cast away.

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Are you sure that's not Stoneskin?
How much Determination do you have? The in game tooltip doesn't say anything about Det affecting interruption.

Also, without Stoneskin there is no way Hell Fire would not interrupt your spellcasting. Or his knockback AoE.

I personally stand closer to Ifrit, and get hit by the knockback but because of Stoneskin I don't move.

Also a side note: Love how this thread is tagged "popcorn thread" now. xD

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Originally Posted by VanilleFang

Are you sure that's not Stoneskin?
How much Determination do you have? The in game tooltip doesn't say anything about Det affecting interruption.

Also, without Stoneskin there is no way Hell Fire would not interrupt your spellcasting. Or his knockback AoE.

I personally stand closer to Ifrit, and get hit by the knockback but because of Stoneskin I don't move.

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I agree here. If you take 0 damage from an attack that's intended to knock you back, apply a debuff, etc, then that effect will not occur in most cases. This is actually employed as the intended method of dealing with Prey in Turn 10, and Turn 11 is notable for having this explicitly turned off; the target of secondary head will get stunned even if the hit to apply said stun deals 0 damage, keeping the second tank necessary. I can say with relative certainty that Determination is not preventing the knockback; Stoneskin is.

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Also a side note: Love how this thread is tagged "popcorn thread" now. xD

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This thread has taught me that this forum could use a few features:

1. A PM System.
2. An ability for members who have posted in a thread to flag it as something that should be closed, for one reason or another(vastly off topic, toxic atmosphere/attacking others, etc.).
3. A PM System.
4. An abolishment of the 1000 character limit on posts.
5. A PM System. :D

I'm actually a spell speed WHM.

Why? It's simply because I like it. Lack of having Det/Pie gear also contributed to this fact, but I do like Spell Speed.

The reason why I like isn't because of the -0.2 GCD, it's because there's a very noticeable difference when a WHM uses PoM and it makes for a pretty good OH SHI- button. With ~1200 spell speed (which is pretty close to 2.0 GCD), you'll have your tanks/party topped off in no time. I agree that for the most part, this isn't required provided there aren't any mess ups. But let's face it, your group (and you) aren't perfect. Mistakes happen, and people take extra damage. I don't think anyone would disagree with me gearing this way so I have an extra panic button.

However, as a result of taking spell speed I lose out in some crit chances, and/or my healing average is lower.

I don't have personal stat weights or priorities. My goal is to enter P4 in T13 with no mana song and max MP while solo healing P1, P2, and most of P3 (w/ Selene). Most of that is skill, cooldown management, and my own timing of heals. Secondaries won't help me that much in that regard (although, Piety does :3)

I also don't sacrifice stats for Spell Speed. I take a look at my overall stats, and balance as necessary. As an example, I would use Demon Shoes of Healing over Dreadwyrm Shoes, if I needed the Piety. If I didn't, sure I'll use the Dreadwyrm Shoes. It depends :P

Side Note: Demon Robes of Healing > Dreadwyrm Robes :D

Here's my "BiS" set I put together: http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/PO7E

Notice that the spell speed is about 160 under the maximum possible value. There's a reason for this, and I'll explain each stat.

534 spell speed, with presence of mind drops GCD to 1.8, and with fey glow will make your GCD Exactly 1.5.
442 piety, which gives me about 5200~5300 MP. This is enough for all content, and (personally speaking) is overkill for everything outside of T13 or solo heal challenges.
314 det, the dump stat. Yet I still have +112 from my gear.
+0 crit. I don't think I need to explain that.

TL;DR: As some/most have already said. Your secondary stats have minimal impact on your party's overall ability to stay alive throughout the fight. Gear however you want to gear.

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Originally Posted by Sumimi

With ~1200 spell speed (which is pretty close to 2.0 GCD)

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That's even 1,70s GCD :D

With the current gear (from coil too) you sacrifices only one stat when building SS : crit. Otherwise you can have the ~600 SS, the ~5K MP and even the ~300 minimal Det.

I think we all agree to say that every benefits from each stat is only a bonus, that we can do fine without it. So the real thing is to look at the inconvenients instead.

There are no real inconvenients from Det except the minimal overheal maybe, but Det is the little sister of Mind, so when you gear up you automatycally gain Mind and Det is just slightly more Mind. Not really noticeable.

The real inconvenient from crit isn't you can't rely on it (because you can play crit build without depending on it), it's the fact you will overheal a lot. You already are likely to overheal without any crit added. Each crit resulting in overheal is often a big number. It's personal but, efficiency for healers is also about reducing overheal as much as possible (sometimes you have to overheal to be safe, but it's a specific situation). In term of non-efficiency, overhealing with crit is the worse.

The real and only inconvenient from SS isn't you don't need it to precast/to save 0,05s from a wipe (because you can play SS build without depending on it), it's the fact SS grants no benefits for the HOT/DOT ticks. In term of non-efficiency, this isn't reducing your efficiency unlike crit is. It's the big cons of SS, it's what makes it less attractive, but this isn't really something that is giving you problems in the end.

Edit : Sumimi your 534 SS is the magic number to exactly reach the 1,5 GCD hard cap, right ?

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Originally Posted by Kelya

Edit : Sumimi your 534 SS is the magic number to exactly reach the 1,5 GCD hard cap, right ?

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According to Purostrider's SPD chart, yep.

Teeechnically speaking you can reach the same hard cap with like 700 Spell Speed (using Dreadwyrm Weapon and food gets me at 685) and no fey glow, but you lose out on so many stats that you're pretty much only using that gear set for dungeon speed runs.

Thanks! I'm more looking at a SS base + Fey glow than a SS base + Presence of mind since Fey glow is up half the time in the fight where Presence of mind is only up each 135s.

I'm surprised no one here appreciates crit as decent stat for whm. I main sch so a lot of my gear itemize for crit, but as a whm I weigh my stats as mind>determination>crit/pie>spell speed. i know alot of people don't want to rely on crit, but i feel that it saves mana and can help top people off quickly. also, I hear medica II is effected by crit as well. If I am full time healing on whm, I don't really feel any effect of from spell speed except for when I cast presence of mind. In my opinion a lot of the fights in this game are scripted and you can just precast before any big attack.

on my whm I run with a pretty absurd amount of crit. i have 504 crit, 634 healing potency,411 spell speed and still have over 5k mana. my whm crits quite a bit, so i tend to just use cure 1s a lot and if it crits it's a free cure 2. this is just my personal preference, I guess technically i have determination as my secondary stat, but over all i avoid spell speed like the plague.

Yes, Crit works on the HOT.

To save mana, you already have the Piety stat.

Since all the fights are scripted and you can just precast before the big attack, you don't need spell speed as well as crit :p so it's only about preference

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Originally Posted by Kelya

Yes, Crit works on the HOT.

To save mana, you already have the Piety stat.

Since all the fights are scripted and you can just precast before the big attack, you don't need spell speed as well as crit :p so it's only about preference

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Well, healing aside, crit also affects your DoTs and the occasional fluid aura. If you're the type of White Mage that does some DPS once in a while. While crit is overheal in most cases, for those few cases when it's not it's a nice bonus.

On the DPS side crit will always be good for sure. But on the healing side, I just stopped at "overheal in most cases".

Sorry, I have to agree that the secondary stats for healer, at least for WHM are purely useless numbers. SO MUCH of my healing is already over-heal that I frankly don't care what gear I'm wearing, it's going to do the job just fine.

lol, what is all this "im a healer so all I do is heal". Ok I understand this more for WHM I guess, but you should be dpsing a little as well.

As a SCH crit is amazing for DPSing as well! So saying secondary stats are uselss is really backward.

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Originally Posted by Gurpsmeister

Sorry, I have to agree that the secondary stats for healer, at least for WHM are purely useless numbers. SO MUCH of my healing is already over-heal that I frankly don't care what gear I'm wearing, it's going to do the job just fine.

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If you know how to play, you can make any combination of secondaries function. Doesn't mean that some load-outs aren't slightly better than others, however.

Melding some accuracy in will have a far bigger effect on a SCH's DPS than their choice of secondary in FCOB. Outside of FCOB it just doesn't matter.

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Originally Posted by Sebazy

Melding some accuracy in will have a far bigger effect on a SCH's DPS than their choice of secondary in FCOB. Outside of FCOB it just doesn't matter.

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Accuracy matters when I tank golem in T9 or like yesterday tank the Wolfbanes in WoD (dont ask... Tank of A reset after death noone else cared so I did my best to keep from other healers >.> ) Also had some misses on Levi EX when dpsing add. Gotta admit tho i118 default accuracy not yet my crafted and accuracy melded pieces :o

I think you misunderstood my point! When I say it doesn't matter outside if FCOB, I'm referring to secondaries in general.