No FC room, no personal house... big deal??

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Originally Posted by scarebearz

Why are you complaining about peoples views of a total optional vanity acquisition?

;D

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The response with rage and anger and bitter vitriol seems to be completely disproportionate for the personal housing content that has been added to the game. The raging seems like the the same raging people had against atma. What is so wrong with the idea that getting personal house is not something to be given out as an entitlement? Just like not everyone will have novus/nexus today? Last I checked there are still unsold small plots, not to mention lots of the medium and large ones. IF you want to decorate a place get a FC room and have fun.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

SNIP

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I'm sure part of the reason is every other MMO out there with personal housing (at least that I'm aware of) has it attainable by everyone not just those who were quickest or richest. And trying to compare it to novus/nexus is silly. You're trying to compare something vanity related to something progression related. They're not comparable. I really wish people would stop trying to equate the two. And really, how many times do we have to tell you not everyone wants to be in an FC? You keep making that same tired FC room argument.

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Originally Posted by Amenian

... And really, how many times do we have to tell you not everyone wants to be in an FC? You keep making that same tired FC room argument.

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Solo players should not get priority over the FC. This is an MMO after all right? It is not some offline single player game. Solo players demanding stuff at the expense of everyone else is definition of selfishness. Learn to work together and build a community. Big empty house for a single player is really nonsensical.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

The response with rage and anger and bitter vitriol seems to be completely disproportionate for the personal housing content that has been added to the game. The raging seems like the the same raging people had against atma. What is so wrong with the idea that getting personal house is not something to be given out as an entitlement? Just like not everyone will have novus/nexus today? Last I checked there are still unsold small plots, not to mention lots of the medium and large ones. IF you want to decorate a place get a FC room and have fun.

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If you can find me an unsold small plot on excalibur, I will give you all of my gil.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

Solo players should not get priority over the FC. This is an MMO after all right? It is not some offline single player game. Solo players demanding stuff at the expense of everyone else is definition of selfishness. Learn to work together and build a community. Big empty house for a single player is really nonsensical.

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Just because I choose not to be in an FC does not mean that I'm a solo player. I'm in linkshells. I have friends. I take part in duty finder groups. I'm active in the community. There's no reason I shouldn't have access to a small house, which is the perfect size for a player. Your argument is just not very strong.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

Solo players should not get priority over the FC. This is an MMO after all right? It is not some offline single player game. Solo players demanding stuff at the expense of everyone else is definition of selfishness. Learn to work together and build a community. Big empty house for a single player is really nonsensical.

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Screwing over solo players is definitely not an excuse that's plausible in this game. It might be an MMO but I can do group activities without being in an FC by joining lots of LS-es. Even if I'm actively doing group content as long as I don't join an FC, I should be penalized? That's basically your argument right now.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

What is so wrong with the idea that getting personal house is not something to be given out as an entitlement? Just like not everyone will have novus/nexus today? .

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The difference is that one can be earned with work and perseverance.

The other is not available.

Besides that, mog houses are basic fluff content. If you want to build a monument to yourself in a video game and exclude others from having a basic mog house to put their personal items in, you have personal issues to address.

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Originally Posted by Souljacker

The difference is that one can be earned with work and perseverance.

The other is not available.

Besides that, mog houses are basic fluff content. If you want to build a monument to yourself in a video game and exclude others from having a basic mog house to put their personal items in, you have personal issues to address.

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It will become available when people put in the time and effort to get it. Just not all right now.

Besides is this FFXIV or is this minecraft? It seems people are putting disproportionate focus on the housing aspect just so they can build that said "monument"? And I don't think FFXIV is about monument building.

I would advise everyone in opposition towards to OP to take a step back and look at their replies. This topic will not move because of OP's rigid brown nosed demeanor. You all are wasting your time with this person. As they will use anything and everything to justify their point

Case in point: "Originally Posted by NyarukoW
How much money did the Seahawks put in to win the superbowl? The top prizes all demand a lot of blood, sweat, and tears as well as tangible assets and time and effort. Call it gilsink if you want, but it is a prize for players to play for. Not everyone will get it. And it isn't even a zero-sum game, since more lots and more ward will be added over time. Don't be raging just because you can't get it now."

That's right folks...
NFL is comparable to Eorzea.

When you have already made up your mind and ignore the opposition you are no longer debating. OP's mind was made up by the mere stroke of the first letter they hit on their keyboard.

^^^

Exactly. You can't debate with someone when their platform for argument is "you don't see it my way and are therefore wrong."

As TTB suggested, ignore them and they won't have fodder to keep going. Let arguments and threads like this die, that is the best way to get rid of them.

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Originally Posted by TouchandFeel

Exactly. You can't debate with someone when their platform for argument is "you don't see it my way and are therefore wrong."

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but both sides are like this.

everyone should get a personal house if you think other wise you're wrong.

if you think everyone should get a perosnal house you're wrong.


either way it's an opinion and everyone has a right to it. noone is right, and noone is wrong.

That does not invalidate what I said, if someone takes the stance that their viewpoint is the only correct one, whatever side they are on, there can be no true debate on the subject.

Everyone is entitled to their opinions but I caution against continuing entrenched arguments where neither side will budge and to not let the opposition goad you back in.

I admit. I'm mostly just fascinated by this mindset that people must be in an FC or they're playing the game wrong.

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Originally Posted by TouchandFeel

That does not invalidate what I said, if someone takes the stance that their viewpoint is the only correct one, whatever side they are on, there can be no true debate on the subject.

Everyone is entitled to their opinions but I caution against continuing entrenched arguments where neither side will budge and to not let the opposition goad you back in.

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i was not trying to invalidate what you said just that both sides are like this.

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Originally Posted by Musashidon

i was not trying to invalidate what you said just that both sides are like this.

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This is very true, the vast majority of either side of any argument tend to be very polarized and cut and dry. It makes me very happy when I see people approach such debates in a more open and diplomatic way, even if they themselves have a personal bias in the matter.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

The response with rage and anger and bitter vitriol seems to be completely disproportionate for the personal housing content that has been added to the game. The raging seems like the the same raging people had against atma. What is so wrong with the idea that getting personal house is not something to be given out as an entitlement? Just like not everyone will have novus/nexus today? Last I checked there are still unsold small plots, not to mention lots of the medium and large ones. IF you want to decorate a place get a FC room and have fun.

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You are on a Tiny server, on the medium/larger populated servers, the small houses have sold out.

Meaning an FC or private player can't get one, this is not "Entitlement", this is insane.

yea people gotta stop assuming that what happens on a small server, like faerie, is verbatim whats happening on every other server.

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Originally Posted by TouchandFeel

^^^

Exactly. You can't debate with someone when their platform for argument is "you don't see it my way and are therefore wrong."

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Pretty much, the only way they'll learn and see why people are upset will be the inevitable time SE does release functions they're interested in and want to use. Only to find out they can't cos they either have no house or that small 8 plot FC garden or whatever gets added between then has a seven month long waiting list before they can use it. We saw it with crafting, we saw it with chocobo dyeing and its safe to assume SE is going to come up with some over exasperated system of chocobo speed and stat allocations for Gold Saucer racing all tied to gardening. More to come in the future and eventually they will want something and then the tune will change.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

Why is it we hear about people buying up 4 small houses instead of sharing and building a FC that can buy the 1 big one?

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The person in question who bought 4 houses actually also has 4 rank 6+ Free companies all with houses already.

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Originally Posted by Rhas

According to several people I've talked to, 1 person bought up 4 houses on our server alone while they were still available.

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This is referring to the same person as above, and I can confirm they have 4 houses. They are in the same ward as a friend in my FC. :3

I've got nothing against the player with 8+ total houses. They're a nice person. I personally think it's a bit unfair that they can take advantage of the limited housing this way at the disadvantage of other players. That's a LOT of gardening space.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

Solo players should not get priority over the FC.

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While I don't agree with much else that you've said, this is one point that I think you got right.

Individuals shouldn't get priority over FCs because they should never have been placed in competition with each other in the first place. We should be able to have both personal housing and FC housing and they shouldn't be fighting each other over access to the same houses. Personal housing and FC housing serve different purposes. Personal housing is so you can have a place you control, where you can decorate and garden and raise your chocobo and whatever else they decide to put there. FC housing is a place to gather together with your friends. (Essentially, personal housing is your character's home. FC housing is their community rec center.)

Right now, while both are using the same houses, FC's are at a disadvantage by needing to rank up to FC rank 6 before they can buy a house, whereas individuals only need to reach the top GC rank, which is a much easier requirement. At the same time, individuals are at a disadvantage financially because they have to accumulate the same amount of gil by themselves as an FC needs, even though the latter can pool together resources from all its members. It's a system that's screwed up in both directions.

Now, not only do FCs need to rank up to 6 (which was already a rather daunting task for new FCs), but they need to do it before all the houses sell out. Since I'm now in a small FC, it's taking a long time to rank up, but I had accepted that, looking at it as a long-term goal. Now that SE has added the difficulty of not only reaching rank 6 but reaching it at a point when there are houses available, however, I can no longer count on that goal being achievable at all. (Ok, that availability requirement actually already existed, but it's become a much bigger issue now that we have such a housing shortage.) The way personal housing was implemented means we're likely to never get an FC house, even once we're eligible for one.

Personal housing should be readily available to everyone at a price that's reasonable for a single individual. FC housing should be a viable long-term goal for FCs to work together towards. And neither should be competing with each other for the same space.

Some differences between what each should have:

• Personal housing should only have the small houses. If they want to include multiple size options, it could be between the way small houses were originally implemented (without a basement) and the way the current small houses are, but there's no reason for a single individual to have a medium or large house. Those sizes are designed to give more space for gatherings, and that's something that's geared towards the larger FCs.
• FC housing should not have gardens, at least not as currently implemented. The gardens in this game are designed to only be used by a single individual, so they belong in personal housing. (I did see a suggestion, however, for a greenhouse that would essentially be an FC compatible gardening area where each member would see their own garden there. If SE adopts something like that, it could go in FC housing.)
• The ward system, where your house is amongst multiple other houses, is designed to give a sense of a vibrant community, but that only works if they're all FC houses. Personal houses will never provide a system where you're likely to see your neighbors, simply due to the percentage of time an individual is there, so they belong in an individually instanced system, leaving the more community-oriented wards for FCs.

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Originally Posted by scarebearz

You are on a Tiny server, on the medium/larger populated servers, the small houses have sold out.
....

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Last I check, at 97K population is certainly bigger than balmung. See:http://xivsoul.com/

It is actually the 5th most populated NA server, hardly count as tiny.

lets just all agree that medium and large houses should not be ownable by fc's consisting of below 10 members, and that the personal house system should permit sharing with friends regardless of fc.

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FC housing is a place to gather together with your friends.

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Disagree.

not all friends are in the same FC and not everyone within an FC are friends.

do agree that the wards should not be combined.... each of the cities had a residental area that could have been opened up and used for this.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

Last I check, at 97K population is certainly bigger than balmung. See:http://xivsoul.com/

It is actually the 5th most populated NA server, hardly count as tiny.

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So I looked into the numbers from xivsoul to try and figure out why Faerie might still have housing available at 97k population, and Balmung does not, at 81k population. I think the reason (and this could apply to my server excalibur as well) is that on Faerie there are 97,300 people and 1200 Free Companies. On Balmung, there are 80,800 people, but 1800 Free Companies. On excalibur, there are 63,800 people to 1400 FC. So it seems like the people on Balmung and Excalibur are more organized into Free Companies, and might have more organized resources to collectively put towards a house. Whereas, on Faerie, its more driven by the individual, who might still be gated by the hefty pricetags, thus you still have housing available.

Of course all of this could have been circumvented if FC HOUSING AND PERSONAL HOUSING WERE NOT THE SAME THING.

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Originally Posted by NyneAlexander

... I think the reason (and this could apply to my server excalibur as well) is that on Faerie there are 97,300 people and 1200 Free Companies. On Balmung, there are 80,800 people, but 1800 Free Companies. On excalibur, there are 63,800 people to 1400 FC. ...

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I don't know how you are getting the counts for FCs. But from what it seems, lower population with more FCs means, that there are people forming solo FCs with the sole intent of get getting around the FC system to get that solo house before 2.38, and those server have the the same trouble maker doing the same thing again right after 2.38. Form a FC bring people into your FC and share and build a community, that should be how it is. But those trouble makers are probably busy buying the up the lots and then trying to get people to pay to relinquish them and making a profit.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

I don't know how you are getting the counts for FCs. But from what it seems, lower population with more FCs means, that there are people forming solo FCs with the sole intent of get getting around the FC system to get that solo house before 2.38, and those server have the the same trouble maker doing the same thing again right after 2.38. Form a FC bring people into your FC and share and build a community, that should be how it is. But those trouble makers are probably busy buying the up the lots and then trying to get people to pay to relinquish them and making a profit.

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If you click on the server on xivsoul, the text in the header will tell you the population as well as the number of free companies.

Add a way to grow personal plants in my room and I'll be golden.

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Originally Posted by AmalahRose

What I didn't like was every small plot being sold out within 10 minutes of the servers going up [...] this was poorly thought out. Personal houses should have been separate instances.

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EXACTLY. I was under the impression that square was working to ADD personal housing. This is not an addition, this is like they just got mad and gave up and said "Here you go! Personal housing TADAH!" I understand the strain on servers adding a separate area where people could purchase personal houses would have caused, but this is kind of a half-baked alternative. Letting individuals buy houses that were originally designated for Free Companies means that those Free Companies that are struggling to get the money for them are now out of luck, because the market mongers have have already bought them or will buy them up as soon as more become available. It's like, why not just have allowed this from the beginning then, if this was the final result of months of planning?

Has anyone pointed out the irony of people on legacy servers saying that the houses were too expensive and that they sold out "10 minutes after server up"?

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

Last I check, at 97K population is certainly bigger than balmung. See:http://xivsoul.com/

It is actually the 5th most populated NA server, hardly count as tiny.

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Thanks for the link. Since all the most populated servers are EU and then NA and the JP are relatively sparsely populated I expect the next announcement will be that new housing wards are added on JP servers only since clearly SE has no problem investing in infrastructure in JP compared to the rest of thew world. Obviously they couldn't care less about the lag and other issues the overcrowding is causing outside of JP.

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Originally Posted by StouterTaru

Has anyone pointed out the irony of people on legacy servers saying that the houses were too expensive and that they sold out "10 minutes after server up"?

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Because not everyone playing on a Legacy server is from 1.0?

Because not everyone playing on a Legacy server back in 1.0 are hoarding massive amount of gil?

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Originally Posted by HumsterMKX

Because not everyone playing on a Legacy server is from 1.0?

Because not everyone playing on a Legacy server back in 1.0 are hoarding massive amount of gil?

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The point isn't that everyone has tons of gil, it's that enough people do for the houses to sell out quickly. The prices should have started out higher, so the reverse auction could actually mean something.

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Originally Posted by StouterTaru

The point isn't that everyone has tons of gil, it's that enough people do for the houses to sell out quickly. The prices should have started out higher, so the reverse auction could actually mean something.

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then people would have complained about the prices.

hell, they still did.

Holy Moly! That guy on Excalibur has eight houses now. I even found a webpage where he claims to be conquering Eorzea.

http://xhfl.guildwork.com/

I hope you guys are ready to worship Apkallus.

He must be stopped at all costs.

Square enix must enable server guesting!
and PK.

and then when 2.4 comes... we shall take that little lala down!!

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Originally Posted by Katsaria

Holy Moly! That guy on Excalibur has eight houses now. I even found a webpage where he claims to be conquering Eorzea.

http://xhfl.guildwork.com/

I hope you guys are ready to worship Apkallus.

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I am sickened and dismayed. . . .

If an FC is not allowed to own more than one house, then individual players should not be allowed to own more than one house. Does everyone remember this: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post1685344
and this quote specifically:
"Personal Housing
While I cannot give a specific date on when personal housing will be implemented, I can say that prices will be completely separate from free company housing, and, naturally, far more affordable"

*sigh*. . . Seriously. . . They need to fix this. . . but it's so far gone, I don't think they can do anything about it now. . . completely and utterly broken.

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Originally Posted by Katsaria

Holy Moly! That guy on Excalibur has eight houses now. I even found a webpage where he claims to be conquering Eorzea.

http://xhfl.guildwork.com/

I hope you guys are ready to worship Apkallus.

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This guy obviously isn't part of the community. He's against it!

Hello Friends,

I am pleased to see you have found my FC but am disappointed that you are unsatisfied with my houses.
Please understand; the XHFL empire is like a giant hungry Apkallu who likes to eat up empty housing plots
and poop out gardens... it cannot be stopped!
Please stop being mean to it or it will waddle over to your servers and gobble up all your empty housing plots as well!

XHFL is also a part of the community! We have 4 active members and over 150 Apkallu :)

Thank You,
-X

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Originally Posted by Xenora

Hello Friends,

I am pleased to see you have found my FC but am disappointed that you are unsatisfied with my houses.
Please understand; the XHFL empire is like a giant hungry Apkallu who likes to eat up empty housing plots
and poop out gardens... it cannot be stopped!
Please stop being mean to it or it will waddle over to your servers and gobble up all your empty housing plots as well!

XHFL is also a part of the community! We have 4 active members and over 150 Apkallu :)

Thank You,
-X

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Go ahead, and you'll be reported for harassment, which is what your behaviour is by THREATENING to further reduce other users experience.

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3.2 Disruption. You may not in any way disrupt or interfere with the Game experience of other players, including the disruption of Square Enix's computers and servers.

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