Sightseeing Log - Its just not happening.

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Originally Posted by Nalien

How about the people who did enjoy it and have got their Log filled just avoid these threads, instead? I'll defend my points, if you've already cleared the content I don't really see why you're here or care.

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And what is your point exactly? I had a subjective experience that I enjoyed the log and you're saying that my opinion is either wrong or doesn't matter? I would like to see an expansion of the sightseeing log in future updates because I thought it was good. You seem to dislike it and want it to go away. I am of the opinion that content is always better than not-content so I'm going to object to your proposal to remove it and/or not expand it in the future.

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Originally Posted by Nalien

Waiting is not content. Waiting is waiting.

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Do you wait all day in the forest or in the Coertas like an idiot to see if Behemot/Odin are going to pop?
No. Obviously not. You just get in the train if you see it coming by chance. Exactly like doing casual Hunt, you just hop in when it's there.

So why can't you see the Sightseeing Log like that as well? Because I can ensure you that it was not designed to be completed by waiting all day on the same spot, doing nothing.
You just have to check the weather from time to time and go for it if you see an open opportunity. That's all you have to do... but you are still missing it.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

sinp

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You could probably do with going back and reading the entirety of the "discussion".

Human beings have this odd ability to multitask. I might be crafting at the moment, but that doesn't mean I'm still not waiting for the RNG to bless me with a Log entry.

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Originally Posted by axemtitanium

You seem to dislike it and want it to go away.

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Actually, I like it and want the pointless time sink to go away. Jesus Christ, how are people still not getting this?

I would enjoy and have no complains about Sightseeing if it wasn't mired in consistent and pointless time sinks, just like I enjoyed the Hildibrand, Riddles, and Mail Mog quests; none of which had me waiting for the RNG.

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

Because it sounds like you're doing nothing more than whining about being unable to do the whole thing in a weekend. People aren't sympathizing with you because they disagree. You continue to fail to understand that.

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We've had this debate.

I'm not using a guide like you.

I'm not going to finish this content in a weekend even if they remove the RNG requirements.

Stop with the strawman arguments for Christs sake.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

And yet, you're still focused on it while you shouldn't.
Stop being obsesed by it, you're doing it wrong.Because it would completly defeat the point of the Sightseeing Log. Jesus Christ, how are you still not getting this?

"Yay! I completed my log in half day! What an achievement!" - said no one ever.

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Oh look, more straw.

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

Would help if you knew what strawman meant.

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Despite the fact that you know full well how I'm going about completing this content, and how long that would take, you insist on claiming I want to burn through it in a couple of days. Strawman, trolling, sheer stupidity. Take your pick.

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

Disagreeing with you is none of those things. I'm not even the only one.

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I'll let Oxford University Press know they need to change the definition of "Disagreeing" to "Insinuating false claims in an attempt to discredit someones argument". Oh wait, I did that bit already...

Anyone who has been reading my posts as long as you have would know I would not blow through this in a weekend, but here you are insisting that is exactly what my motivation behind removing the time sink is. Pathetic.

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

You're right bud. Keep focusing on the one small 3 word snippet of hyperbole instead of literally everything else I said. That makes your argument seem more sound and clearly makes you out to be less silly.

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You're aware that insanity remark can be thrown right back at you, right? You defended #009 requiring weather and a specific time, I'm not ignoring everything else you've said; I'm pissing my pants laughing at it.

@Fyce: I do not want to burn through this content in a day. I want to log on, see nobody is else is on/finish other content early and still have some time left/etc. and go "I guess I'll do some Sightseeing", then go "Where is this one? Here? There? Ah! Here it is, yay!" and then finish for the afternoon and perhaps do the same thing the next day.

If I was following Tiggy's fabulous advice and using a guide, I'd be going "Lets check the Weather NPC, now go down this list online... OK, these one and this one will be open, lets go get them".

There is a pretty stark difference in attitude there, I think. Like axemtitanium I would like to see more of this content in the future; other content like it is great, I've already listed them before. The only issue I have is with the time sink, because the time sink effectively makes Sightseeing play out like this; "Oh, I found a Vista... And got no credit.... Guess I'll come back another time...". It does nothing but encourage the use of a guide and waste time.

Because it sounds like you're doing nothing more than whining about being unable to do the whole thing in a weekend. People aren't sympathizing with you because they disagree. You continue to fail to understand that.

*edit* When you go on and on and on and on about how you're waiting and you complain over and over about the timesink then it is in no way a straw man for me to take from your argument that all you want to do is get it done quickly, or in my hyperbole "in a weekend."

Would help if you knew what strawman meant.

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Originally Posted by Nalien

Human beings have this odd ability to multitask. I might be crafting at the moment, but that doesn't mean I'm still not waiting for the RNG to bless me with a Log entry.

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And yet, you're still focused on it while you shouldn't.
Stop being obsesed by it, you're doing it wrong.

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Originally Posted by Nalien

Actually, I like it and want the pointless time sink to go away. Jesus Christ, how are people still not getting this?

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Because it would completly defeat the point of the Sightseeing Log. Jesus Christ, how are you still not getting this?

"Yay! I completed my log in half day! What an achievement!" - said no one ever.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bv05ehxCYAA3UZM.png

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Originally Posted by Nalien

Strawman, trolling, sheer stupidity. Take your pick.

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Disagreeing with you is none of those things. I'm not even the only one.

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
Albert Einstein, (attributed)

You're right bud. Keep focusing on the one small 3 word snippet of hyperbole instead of literally everything else I said. That makes your argument seem more sound and clearly makes you out to be less silly.

Goodness.. The word strawman everywhere... I thought there would be discussing but as I read farther it all I see.. Strawman this strawman that strawman..@_@

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Originally Posted by Nalien

@Fyce: I do not want to burn through this content in a day. I want to log on, see nobody is else is on/finish other content early and still have some time left/etc. and go "I guess I'll do some Sightseeing", then go "Where is this one? Here? There? Ah! Here it is, yay!" and then finish for the afternoon and perhaps do the same thing the next day.

If I was following Tiggy's fabulous advice and using a guide, I'd be going "Lets check the Weather NPC, now go down this list online... OK, these one and this one will be open, lets go get them".

There is a pretty stark difference in attitude there, I think. Like axemtitanium I would like to see more of this content in the future; other content like it is great, I've already listed them before. The only issue I have is with the time sink, because the time sink effectively makes Sightseeing play out like this; "Oh, I found a Vista... And got no credit.... Guess I'll come back another time...". It does nothing but encourage the use of a guide and waste time.

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The problem here, is that you want this content to change based on your personal experience. You don't have any logical or objective argument to make you point.
Basically, you're just saying "I don't like it that way so they have to change it".

But by doing this, you are ignoring the people who actually enjoy it.

If you remove the time/weather limitations, you make this content way more trivial and completly crush a big part of why people might enjoy that content.
People are currently seeing you as some kind of spoiled child because of that particular reason... which is why they are on the verge of just going full troll with you (myself included regarding my lastest posts).

Expressing your own personnal opinion is completly fine, but expecting a change out of entitlement is not.

You personnaly don't want to use guides/cheats to find a location, and your enjoyment will come from discovering the vista point on yourself? Well, that's sound all good indeed but... some others might just want to test their luck on the time/weather thing and get their enjoyment out of "being at the right place at the right time" by chance. Maybe they just want to check their ability to do the "jumping puzzle" without having any interest on the riddle itself?
Well, at least, currently the Sightseeing Log is built around the later, which is why I'll continue to say that if you change the weather/time limitations, you'll break the first intended design of the Sightseeing Log.

The best solution here, is not to break something, but to create an alternative for people to enjoy.
In short terms: instead of wanting a change on something some people actually enjoy, you would probably have better result asking for new content according to your needs.
Maybe a second set of harder riddles, but only based on the location and jumping puzzles (without time/weather limitation)? I can completly see that working while keeping the current content.

@Fyce This might be based on my biased perception of the multiple threads and posts made when the sightseeing log was released, but I'm pretty sure if the weather requirement was dropped a lot more people would enjoy this content, more than the <1% who currently own the minion.

The system as it is right now is really bad and it could use another dev review, dropping the weather requirement for most* (not all) logs would not change the core part of the system: sightseeing.

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Originally Posted by Alukah

@Fyce This might be based on my biased perception of the multiple threads and posts made when the sightseeing log was released, but I'm pretty sure if the weather requirement was dropped a lot more people would enjoy this content, more than the <1% who currently own the minion.

The system as it is right now is really bad and it could use another dev review, dropping the weather requirement for most* (not all) logs would not change the core part of the system: sightseeing.

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As I said earlier, if they'd of made it more exploration based like GW2 rather than time/weather based, it would have been a much more entertaining thing for most people.

Trying to discover the right path to get to the location is far more engaging than sitting around waiting for the weather to change. It lets the player be active instead of reactive.

This is probably one of the most disappointing features of this game. What could have been a simple and fun diversion became a chore and then got completely ignored. I haven't touched it since grinding through the first 6 or so. As much as I like reading the extra lore tidbits, it just isn't worth it.

Sightseeing in my opinion is not about the reward. It's for people who want to explore lore more. You can visit anywhere anytime of the day or night. The purpose of this is someone telling an experience that happened at a certain time, in a certain place, in a certain circumstance. It's content for a role player.

The content itself isn't necessarily supposed to be fun. They should make a system that players could design their own and share experiences. So they could share in game and not just on lodestone or some other forum.

Do you know what idle games are?
Even those are more fun than current Sightseeing!
The main difference to those is that in idle games you have progress when waiting while in ffxiv you dont...

Edit: Let Players gain XP while waiting after finding the correct position, depending which one it is more or less xp (one example to make it more like a idle game)