I'm mad about something, and you should hear about it.

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Originally Posted by Kazamoto

Diabolos is going to be a boss in the Lost City of Amdapor.

This means with 95% certainty he is not a primal.

This means we will not be able to summon a Diabolo-Egi.

Diabolos is a summon, not a trashy dungeon boss.

Thank you.

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Siren was a just a trashy dungeon boss too.

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Originally Posted by Wilan

And this is bad why?

Diablos is a minor summon, mostly famous for FFVIII and a bit for FFXI too.
Siren is, too. Siren has been given a place in Eorzea's lore with her own dungeon, and Diablos is getting the same. We can't have the summoner class being able to summon every single one of the dozen summons of the saga, but it's nice that even the minor ones find a place somehow.

BUT NO, LET'S COMPLAIN ABOUT IT AND LET'S HAVE THE WHOLE FORUM LISTEN TO MY WHINING okay.

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Alright I will listen

What about Neo Bahamut and Bahamut Zero from FFVII, those were pretty strong summons in FFVII

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Originally Posted by Esmian

The question is just exactly how many egi's that will inevitably do almost the same things functionally do you people actually want? It's getting a little silly.

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That's probably because elemental weakness/resistance didn't matter much in ARR. In past FF titles including XI, each summon represent their specialize element and should be summoned properly on mobs/nm that matches their strong/weaknesses.

Unfortunately in ARR, SMN somehow got mixed up function here and too generalize. Ifrit/Garuda egi for dps and Titan for tanking purpose, and a bunch of debuff spells that used to belong on black mage class. And likewise, BLM also suffers from generalization here.

Too bad that in the end, I guess majority players already getting used to this since old ways are too complicated, which is one of reason why 1.0 kinda failed I guess.

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Originally Posted by BobbinT

That's probably because elemental weakness/resistance didn't matter much in ARR. In past FF titles including XI, each summon represent their specialize element and should be summoned properly on mobs/nm that matches their strong/weaknesses.

Unfortunately in ARR, SMN somehow got mixed up function here and too generalize. Ifrit/Garuda egi for dps and Titan for tanking purpose, and a bunch of debuff spells that used to belong on black mage class. And likewise, BLM also suffers from generalization here.

Too bad that in the end, I guess majority players already getting used to this since old ways are too complicated, which is one of reason why 1.0 kinda failed I guess.

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Generally how I feel even if I mostly play Paladin. FF has always had an elemental wheel and it got destroyed because it was considered "too complicated" and given reasons for destruction were jobs would be left out because of elemental advantage. What jobs? Mages are the only ones affected by elemental wheel and it's simple BLM's Fire, Blizzard, and Thunder would have been on equal potency. Jobs are always going to be left out by "advantages" look at how we want a Melee LB for certain content or a Caster LB for others. It's the fight mechanics themselves that limit jobs not an elemental wheel. As in current content Bard gets taken everywhere not because of Ballad for the WHM but because it can dodge all the AOE and keep on attacking. It's the "safest" bet and things become generalized. "Oh Titan EX is all about dodging and BLM has to sit still to cast...rather have a Bard." I really hope the elemental wheel comes back in to play down the road, it just feels wrong attacking Ifrit with Fire.

As Esmian said what roles can any other Egi really offer. People always mention Leviathan as a healer cause of the spell in XI but SCH's job is the pet healer. We have a caster DPS (Garuda), Melee DPS (Ifrit), and a Tank (Titan, which how often is this really used honestly). A support/healer Egi just doesn't go with Summoner being a DPS. With that said, so sad that Summoner is stuck in a DoT role and is barely about the Summons themselves. I think it's sad that people are "getting used to" as you say BobbinT. I'd like to see Summoners be about the Summons. Bring on the posts about how Summoner in XI was wrong blah blah. At least in XI the Avatars were vastly different from one another. Another reason why I'd like the elemental wheel back for Summons to be used in different situations. Ah well, a lot of personal judgments that ultimately won't change anything.

With how FFXIV's jobs are structured, we wouldn't be seeing Diabolos as an Egi for a LONG time even if he were to be a Primal. As it is, we still have yet to obtain Egi's for Leviathan, Ramuh or Shiva. It has been stated before that new Egis will only be introduced with increased level caps and/or expansions. By the time we get Shiva (if she gets implemented), we could very well be on expansion #3.

lol

Diabolos in XI are introduced on 2nd expansion, so... you're not very far off. ARR are still young, let's give it time and see how it goes.

Diabolos was an optional FFVIII boss, whose defeat resulted in his use as a summon.
Diabolos was in CoP as a dungeon boss. Much later, he became a summon, in an unrelated side story.
Valefor used to be a summon in FFX, and now he is an undead dragon in CT.

Lesson: don't expect everything to work out the same way from title to title.

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Originally Posted by NoloeTazier

As Esmian said what roles can any other Egi really offer.

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There's another alternative and that's Cosmetics and allowing for some other form of diversity.

From my perspective with how the game is currently designed there some forms to go about this.

One form is simply cosmetics. By allowing some way for Odin and Diabolos to be implemented to Summon III and Leviathan to Summon I. As well as add Summon IV to be were support/heal egi's would be placed such as Siren and King Moogle Mog.
The only downside here is that when a new Summon is added and it's gonna try and be unique a new Summon # action will have to be added which will make it very crowded once Summon VIII gets introduced.

Another form would be to allow Summoners egi to partake in the companion section. Where the egi's would have their own set of skill trees that we can customize them into but stay within a certain parameter on what they are meant to accomplish. In a sense Ifrit and Titan can specialize in either DPS/Tank and Garuda can specialize in DPS/Heal. The Egi's that get implemented later can have their own trees.

The positive from this is that we could potentially add barding to egis later on. The only downside here however would be trying to manage all of that when more summons get added.

I have no idea what Square-Enix is planning nor what approach would meet every summoners need. Yet for me having summons get a spot in the companions tab and allow us to customize the limit break so there can be justice for our summons is my dream.

Yet it's up in the air and anything can happen. I can only dream and that I shall continue to do.

according to the quest details he could be a summon called by the people of amdapor. they said something about a dark presence welling up in there meaning that he had to have manifest within the place and not just like "arrived" there