Linkshell Management Recognition

Bump!! We need the dev teams response in detail on why this is not a issue to them or the dev team. At least it seems that way

I agree that the dev team really needs to respond to this huge issue in the game. I currently run a LS on Palamecia server and have had to break the shell twice just to remove the inactives. Dev team please PLEASE respond to us concerning the LS administration tools or lack there of. We need at least the ability to remove inactive members regardless of there online status or location in the world.

Keep fighting the good fight, Rhomagus. Eventually our voices will be heard.

I am on my 3rd Re-pearl 4th within the weeks to follow unless change happens and happens now this is a dire issue which needs change. we don't need gear color, we don't need 50 ways to target 1 mob hell they can stay the same size let me manage the men and women i play the game with i love so much. Is all i and we ask.

I just wanted to throw my support behind this thread, too. I'm not a LS leader but there are a few things we've been wishing for... It's all pretty much been said. If anybody wants to know my personal thoughts I sum it up here: Fan Service: Communication Breakdown

So while reviewing this thread I saw this:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AlexiaKidd

I still believe that the reason they are so quiet on the LS front is that they are going to be replaced with Player Companies when the Public Companies system is added. I think LS's were never meant to be in the game but as the Company system was not ready then they needed to knock something together fast and this is what we have.

I believe Player Companies where supposed to be so much more than just a LS with Housing, Transport your own mission structure and so on. I'm sure they said at some point during all this that you would be able to own Boats and Airships. So you can see why they may be dragging their heals with this issue, is it excusable no but if they can pull off Player Companies like they originally set out in the June update or whenever then all this will be water under the bridge very quickly.

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I wondered this as well... So I guess we'll see. :/

I wouldn't even care about the "kick offline players" IF they didn't show up in the list.
Not to bang the ffxi drum, but if you reached maximum capacity then whoever tried to equip their linkpearl would get some kind of message that it was currently full.
That said, I'm okay with the cap at 100-something, but don't count offline people toward that total.

;)

and now for a little drum-beating diddy >.>
Come, SE told me... parrrummm-pa-pum-pum
Play FF14...parrrummm-pa-pum-pum
But linkshell management is cumbersome :( ...parrrummm-pa-pum-pum
So We Beat Loudly On Our Drrrummm!!...parrrummm-pa-pum-pum~ rrrummm-pa-pum-pum~ rrrummm-pa-pum-pum!!!
:p
okie~ shutting up now :x lol

That would make a lot of sense.

Not to spam or anything, but I'm going to copypasta my bump to the Linkshell Administration thread in UI - if Companies end up being the new linkshells, I would hope they incorporate more improvements upon the original XI design.

Quote:

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Additional rank levels - It'd be nice to have one or two more levels of granularity between "shellholder" and "sackholder". You might want to give some people the right to issue pearls but not to break them. Keeping with the "pearled" theme, you might move sackholder to the recruitment tier, and add in Pearlbinder and Pearlkeeper or the like. Further...
Moderated chat - Allows members of a specific rank or higher to "quiet" the channel so that they can speak to everyone without being interrupted. This is pretty important for larger-scale events. I'm sure everyone is familiar with the "STFU WE'RE IN DYNAMIS" type of situation. In moderated chat mode, if the original individual that set moderated chat logs off, the chatmode returns to normal (so as not to mute a shell for an indefinite period of time). If someone sets moderated and leaves it on without freeing it, players are free to /tell another officer asking them to disable it.
Rank list - Since it seems that XIV retains the linkshell member list while people are offline, it would be useful to be able to view the members of a particular rank at any given time, in case you need to contact an officer with a question or concern.
Transfer ownership - If LSes will have persistent space in XIV (see the Lodestone), then the LS itself should be able to persist through a player's departure. The owner should have the ability to hand the shell over to another player. OR...
Decentralized leadership - Perhaps the best solution to the idea of being unable to transfer a linkshell would be the ability for a shellholder to promote people into shellholders, allowing for multiple people to be fully "in charge". That way if a shellholder goes MIA, the linkshell does not have to dissolve. Some groups may be more oriented toward this style of leadership anyway.

Given the implementation of achievements and their integration into the Lodestone, and Linkshell integration into the Lodestone, I feel rather positive that there will also be Linkshell-oriented achievements coming, and so there may be a package of changes that will encompass some of these requests in the future.

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To clarify on that last bit, WOW has guild achievements, so I wouldn't be surprised to see them make their way into XIV.

Day #12 June 3, 2011

Sorry for not posting yesterday. I had a huge headache that wouldn't go away so I decided to take a short nap. Turns out my short nap turned into a 3 hour snooze and, yesterday is now today. Anyways, my post this time will be significantly short than usual as I really should get back to bed.

Today's post jumps from what I talked a bit about in Day #10's post. I mentioned that there was a thread that had 0 responses. That thread was made by Flower. What I like about it is that the title was properly formatted with the [suggestion] tag, it's to the point, and lacks an abrasive tone.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Flower

[Suggestion] Linkshell Permissions

This is something I am sure all of us are hoping you guys fix. The ability to kick members from the linkshell whether they are online or offline. Same goes for the ability to promote or retire officers. Also just in case this situation ever comes up, the ability to transfer leadership of a linkshell to another person.

It would also be nice if you guys added more linkshell crests to set all the thousands of linkshells apart from each other.

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This post was created 6 days after the post I'd mentioned in Day #10 by Nicodemus. As to why there was no response to it I could only guess at 2 possible reasons.

1.) It fell off the first page of the UI forums.
- This seems to be a death sentence for almost any topic that isn't in General Discussion. General Discussion can usually survive the 2nd page, but topics begin to hit the graveyard at page 2 on any other forum it seems. The bright side is that there's only 10 pages to look into on the UI forums. You could see that as a positive in some lights or negative, but it certainly makes it easier to see if there's already been a thread made on the subject you're talking about.

2.) People already felt they've put in their two cents on the issue.
- Once someone has already posted about an issue once, they feel that's all that's necessary. Granted at the time of my post yesterday, there were less posts in Nicodemus's thread than there were thread topics in UI on Linkshell tools. I haven't yet figured out what the oldest post is in regards to this issue.

As I've said before, Linkshell tools is one of the few thread topics in the UI forums which I've noticed there to be multiple iterations. The main reason as to why it gets repeated creations I could only chalk up to people not being able to find threads on the subject on the first page. If we stay vigilant on a thread topic I think it has a higher chance of getting a rep/dev response. Regardless, I am a firm believe that this particular issue doesn't need to be dragged out for as long as it's slated too. I don't see why this couldn't be included into 1.18 as we've seen changes happen quickly and without provocation on other UI related features.

Good night. Even though it's actually morning here.

If what Amarita quoted would be true why wouldnt SE come out and say that is what is going to happen. They have to know the LS system is flawed, and why wouldnt SE let us know that public companies are going to be the new system (WITH ADMIN TOOLS!!! lol).

I hope that companies are going to be our answer, but the way SE does things I really dont see it happening until fall maybe winter. :(

I think my thread was the oldest one on this topic, I made it in the site suggestions section day 1 of forum launch. deleted it to remake in general discussion after getting bagged on. then moved it to gameplay - others when the new sections opened up.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Keith_Dragoon

I think my thread was the oldest one on this topic, I made it in the site suggestions section day 1 of forum launch. deleted it to remake in general discussion after getting bagged on. then moved it to gameplay - others when the new sections opened up.

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Possibly but sad it is that it is now June and still no concrete response from SE to an Obviously BIG issue, then again i guess adding in new races or jump or making the mobs bigger is more important.

@ Poppa - You certainly have a point. I read that and thought, okay it's a plausible excuse for the sad shape linkshells are in at the moment. Maybe they're not saying anything because they want it to be a knock-your-socks-off surprise? Maybe? ...I hope ; ;

It is really weird that we keep bringing up the linkshell issue and nothing is being done about it, but we got that show/hide head gear toggle. :/ (Don't get me wrong, I like it, but I would trade it for better linkshell management any day :3)
I'm glad they're being honorable and letting us play for free until things are "fixed" (whatever that may be).^_^

The SE reps probably tired of everyone's QQing (although its a completely valid issue), they probably don't even read these threads anymore D:

If Public Companies are to be the "new LS" then they had better not make the same mistake in totally disregarding the need for administration options.... I can just imagine the whole thing repeating and Companies having to re-make a "pearl" due to the same issues :(

I find the fact that this is being totally ignored because the team are busy with battle improvements etc extremely frustrating...

If you want people to socialize and work together in this game where they will want to battle and do Company events and "endgame" as a team, then don't make it such hard work (especially for something that can be easily rectified).
I don't want to have to run around every few months handing out new LS pearls, I want to be able to play in the spare time I have in the evenings and enjoy it :(

*stamps foot like a petulant child* .....

Linkshell tools with: MODERN, INTUITIVE, interfaces are a must in today's highly organized mmo communities. The fact this issue has not been addressed, is sheer grotesque oversight.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Elkwood

Possibly but sad it is that it is now June and still no concrete response from SE to an Obviously BIG issue, then again i guess adding in new races or jump or making the mobs bigger is more important.

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Yea I have been bringing this issue up ever since beta forums, back then all I got from ppl was "Dude its beta quit ur bitchin and deal with it!". Now look at us, coming up on a year since launch and i am still marching around waving my flag trying to get attention to this matter.

The least that could be done would be to implement /commands for LS leaders.

There would be no need to rework the UI right away. There could just be a list of /commands that LS leaders could use to /recruit, /expel, /promote, and /lsmes. This would eliminate the need to run around to hand out pearls, and the need to reform the shell once the shell population gets close to cap.

My shell just reformed last month. It went fairly smoothly, but the process could have been completely avoided if the current LS system just followed the standards set by every MMO, ever. Even Ragnarok Online has had a better system than this since launch. I don't understand how LS's were implemented in the state that they're in when SE could have looked at FFXI, and dozens of other MMOs for example of basic features that this system needs.

Day #12 June 3, 2011

Super tired. Submitting this just prior to deadline. I agree on the need of a highly intuitive interface, but functionality come before aesthetics and we have neither. It's surprising that the two concepts weren't developed from the ground up together. Often times the UI aesthetics are hindered by the rigid quick implementation like /commands. Soon after awhile, the player base gets used to it, at least those that didn't quit in frustration, and then /commands become the de facto standard in the game.

It's unfortunate that they didn't have it planned from the ground up to have a good looking and responsive interface. I think more often then not they put form over function which can become and incredibly daunting task for creating a decently playable game.

A lot of this is off track as I'm increditired, not that I don't aimlessly rant anyways. As I've said before, the kind demeanor has devolved into a mob demand, and further devolved into a mere plea for one feature, into a faint whimper of recognition of the issue. It never should've devolved into that and it's what contributes to the sting and begs the question that no player should have to ask themselves.

What exactly am I doing here again?

As of the time I'm typing this reply, the original post has 34 likes. I know there are many more people who believe that this is a priority issue.

If you agree, please 'Like' the OP and get it some attention!

I guess folks are distracted by the mention of materia etc... :(

I know most linkshells have forums outside the game, but my LS has a couple of really cool people who are also casual players in the sense that they have zero desire to check any outside forum for LS happenings.

So I'm raising my /LSMES flag again...

Dire need for "Linkshell Message"!

...getting tired of re-asking for stuff that was already in ffxi... it's okay to copy the good stuff, dev's. :3

Topic salvaged from the Second Page. Hopefully we get some feedback on this sooner rather than later.

We probably won't get any feedback other then what we already got. I mean, this is SE we're talking about, strict and unresponsive.

They have gotten A LOT BETTER. I am happy to give them credit for reaching out to the player base.

I will be even happier when the huge outcry about linkshell issues is addressed.

I will be doing /joy IRL when we get /lsmes "Linkshell Message".

>^.^<

Let's keep fighting the good fight people.

It's better to die side by side in the face of adversity, rather than to die alone fleeing the incoming onslaught!

I swear this is a positive thing. I mean the good guys always make it to the end of a FF series... Oh wait.


But in all seriousness, it makes my old bitter heart swell with pride when I see how well we can work together. Even if we don't get a better LS system, what we've achieved from this unity is respect for ourselves and one another.

And no one can put a price tag on that. (2 Chocobos and a dash of Mooglish magic)

Agreed let's putt this in there face and let it be known i tried with spamming multi threads got allot of heat on my end but i did get it in peoples heads and it did get attention from some sites so the steps are being taken and more need to be set afoot! lets do this!

Bumping topic fell to 3rd page

It seems no one really care how we need a global kick feature?

Not one damn dev comment.

Implementation of a LS kick feature means that people are leaving, and I guess of for now SE does not want to realize that.

"everything'll be sugar and rainbows?!"
—Sazh to Vanille
Disclaimer : Quote may have been taken out of context & edited, turning it into a positive quote.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Joeking

"everything'll be sugar and rainbows?!"

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Rainbows, hearts and unicorn farts!

Day #17 June 8, 2011

I apologize for my extended absence as of late. I've been meaning to get back to this thread but I've been involved in some more real life stuff lately and it's quite refreshing. I'm digging the change of pace, and I think I just needed a break from the monotony. What caused me to seriously look at my playing habits was an article I read in a May issue of EDGE magazine.

The article covered an online game I'd never heard of by the name of Cow Clicker. I'm not saying it's not a popular game, I'm just saying I've never heard of it which are two very different things and is kind of the source of my anxiety. Anyways, the game was created as a satirical criticism of social gaming. Normally I would've laughed at what I was reading but it really got me to thinking about myself in contrast to online gaming.

One particular part of the article struck a cord with me:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EDGE staff

So, for example, his players implored him to create and offer Cowthulu, a cute-looking cow with tentacles modelled after the HP Lovecraft beast of abject horror. When Bogost finally crafted the cow, he made it so that you couldn’t buy it with accumulated clicks. Instead, you had to spend real money. And the players hated him for it. At the thought of frustrating his players, Bogost chuckles, relishing this object lesson in making wishes and getting what you wished for, even if it wasn’t what you wanted. But, much to his surprise, the players kept on playing, and kept on enjoying his increasingly problematic cow game. “No matter how much shit you throw at people, they rise above it. It’s incredible how resilient people are.”

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So I noticed I'd found myself in a Cowthulu conundrum. I've already sketched out the digression of wanting linkshell features implemented to that of merely the recognition of an easily fixed issue that everyone agrees on, except for one person. While I don't think we'll be getting charged for linkshell administration options when they are finally implemented, I'm of the opinion it's more difficult to create a Cowthulu than it is to allow linkshell leaders to kick offline members from their linkshell. If it's not, this game has much bigger problems from a standpoint in which I have no expertise, but I'd venture to guess it's the underlying engine making everything needlessly complicated.

I've started to notice that I don't really game much anymore. I've FFXI'd a lot for the past 7 years, but I haven't gamed. I don't involve myself with gaming anymore. I involve myself in FFXIV, and I'm beginning to really question that. I was never one to think of this issue as being a microcosm of the game itself until I started reading a lot of other people's comments on this board.

In closing, I apologize a second time for not posting as aggressively as I'd determined originally, but I've been paying a little more attention to my real life. I don't think that requires an apology.

If you'd like to read the whole article that I quoted from you can find it here

Add a text command to kick players without a proximity requirement. This is the only thing needed now to solve this thread. The other features to chat in channels /L1 /L2 etc and to have a fancy UI are not important right now. This small feature would solve the hundreds of comments listed here and make linkshell management much easier.

Can't let this thread get lost beyond the pages.
I agree with Tachi, we also need ways to communicate with other linkshells without going into our menus and click on a linkshell that I want to chat with. Another issue about chatting with multiple linkshells is when I was crafting: I have to finish what I had started, exit synthing, go to menu, go to linkshell and click on the name, then go back synthing again until I have to respond to another chat from a different linkshell. It's really annoying to do all those steps just to chat.

If controlling Linkshell management within the game itself is "too difficult", then why not implement it through the Lodestone? The Lodestone already operates as an interface for viewing game statistics online and includes the ability to view Linkshell memberships, utilizing these memberships to provide access and post within a Linkshell's own personal forum of sorts.

It would not be a huge extention to develop this interface further. Furthermore, it would take at least some of the workload for this task away from the UI team and relegate it to the Web/Lodestone team.

I'm sure there are other ideas outside the box as well.

Thing is, most of the functionality is there, for LS commands, all they have to do is comment out a few checks a la

if (lsLeader.Pos == lsMember.Pos)
kick(lsMember);
(yes, it's a very simplified example)

and it would already make people happy - for now.

Additional features like the LS message would only involve adding a command which sets a message to show in LS_CHAT_COLOR to players. There is already a server message displayed on logon, so all they would have to do is show the message depending on LS membership, that shouldn't be too hard either.

The "bonus" things like a GUI can wait, commands would already be enough

Bump for justice and recognition, I will never give up!

Page 11..... just wow...

As we saw in the 1 to 50 thread, if we get someone to draw a picture of the most BASIC things we need in this game, then we'll get an answer. Sooooo, someone draw up......LS...management? LOL /shrug

Dear SE...

O yeah I brought this one back as well

As I posted in other topic...

Back from Distant Worlds Chicago and sad to see 14 got more love and attention there then it has here.

Just searched for this thread. I was just listening to the last episode of the podcast that I'm in and I mentioned the creation of this thread. Most of that episode was spent bitching about just this topic. I've read the updates in regards to this issue and it's pretty much the same story since I started it, only now it's been added with an "it's very hard".

Really didn't want to necrobump it, but I definitely didn't want to create another thread on this topic.