Tank Roles, DPS Roles, Healer Roles... No Support Roles?

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Originally Posted by Asiaine

And one of the hallmarks of all Final Fantasy games is some sort of support role.

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I'm having trouble figuring out who the support character was in FF1, FF2, FF4, FF6, FF7, FF8, FF9, or FF10. Unless you're lumping healer in with support.

Support is spells like Protect, which the Conjurer has. Stoneskin, which the Conjurer has. And songs, like the Bard has.

Bard and Healers are the Supports. The Supports in games now have become the Healers. Most Final Fantasy Titles are the same way, FF13 is the only game that really comes to mind that has a Role set to Debuffing and Buffing, and even then they weren't used long term. A few moments in a fight and then they're made useless until later. In an MMO, usually Healers bring that kind of stuff now. They're in charge of getting rid of the debuffs now, they're in charge of making sure the party has the good stuff on them.

All you would need to make a proper support class would have buffs and debuffs with short timers that you need bring into play via a rotation similar to other classes. Off the top of my head, maybe having a time mage doing a constant rotation to gradually increase the combat speed of your party. Once you cap the attack/movement speed you move onto debuffing the mob if it isn't resistant and by the time you finish that move onto the next buff/debuff.

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Originally Posted by Urthdigger

I'm having trouble figuring out who the support character was in ff.

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Final fantasyTactics had like 5 support jobs

ffv is where dancer made its first appearance and it was a support job

ff9

Adelbert Steiner was suppor by having the ability to adsorb more damage then any player so in case all your player die he would be standing to raise some 1 so it wont be endgame,

Quina Quen was blue mage that had alot of ability that will help you against monster damage, for example there a boss fight where boss would cast earthquake and do massive damage well quina has a spell that would keep you off the ground so you would take 0 damage.

and last was Eiko Carol the smn, her smn had ability to add buff to other caracter like adding element damage to your attacks

i can keep on going with a huge list.... support jobs is part of the final fantasy franchise just like every single story on ff is based on a crystal

I like support classes.

Seriously doubt SE will implement it though. I seriously doubt they'd even consider it. It's very clear that they wanted to redesign 1.0 into a mainstream MMO. I don't think they'll change directions into making this more of a unique game, especially after the alleged success 2.0 has been.

Like I said, I'd love to see it. It's just not likely at all.

Now, if it could happen, I'd love to see it like this.

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Originally Posted by Pots_Talos

All you would need to make a proper support class would have buffs and debuffs with short timers that you need bring into play via a rotation similar to other classes. Off the top of my head, maybe having a time mage doing a constant rotation to gradually increase the combat speed of your party. Once you cap the attack/movement speed you move onto debuffing the mob if it isn't resistant and by the time you finish that move onto the next buff/debuff.

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Also, who else would like to see some 5-6 man dungeons? Tank, Healer, DD + DD + DD, Support. Like in XI, would be neat, I think.

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Originally Posted by Drakent

stuff

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I know tactics and 5 had support jobs. That's why I didn't list them. As for 9, this thread is about how FF14 has no jobs that are PRIMARILY support, where that is the primary function. If the examples from 9 are valid, then we can go ahead and call WHM a support job instead of a healer due to stoneskin, protect, and regen.

Steiner was a tank. Quina was primarily DPS, with Quina only having two buffs, and four debuffs (All of which either had a low success rate or hit the party as well), and the rest of her blue magic being either damage or Death of some kind. Eiko was primarily a healer, being able to cast white magic, while her summons were all damage of some kind with the exception of Carbuncle. Heck... of the support abilities they have, you didn't even manage to get them right :/

My point is, the vast majority of FF games do not have a dedicated support job, such as what's being asked for in this thread. Typically, support is a secondary role of black mage or white mage. No, support roles are not as big a part of the FF franchise as the Crystals. They're more like the Buster Sword: Some FF games have it. The majority do not.

Support is spread out across nearly all jobs. A little slow here, a little protect there. I find that a lot more useful than a designated support class (and remember that cross-classing allows a person to specialize more in support by picking up those support skills). The way it is set up you can have 8 people run into a room and in three turns bang out 12 buff/debuff skills. Insofar as debuffs go, I'm very satisfied.

I only wish we had more pre-game buffs like protect to pass around. Maybe they'll add those in with a new level cap or additional jobs. Anyone else hopeful that the two jobs for one class thing is going to get passed around beyond Arcanist?

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Originally Posted by Urthdigger

I'm having trouble figuring out who the support character was in FF1, FF2, FF4, FF6, FF7, FF8, FF9, or FF10. Unless you're lumping healer in with support.

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Final Fantasy XIV utilizes a job/class system so it should only be compared to other Final Fantasy games that have them. So in that regard, yes, it should have a support role.

As a side note, I recently ran through FF1 again and played with Fighter, Thief, Black Belt, and Red Mage. I found Red Mage in that game did subpar damage all around, be it from spells or swords. Know what he excelled at doing? Being support, casting Fast, Ruse, Saber, ect...
Also, Edward from FF4 would be considered support with his bard spells. In my opinion Blue Mage is support, which would knock out most if not all of the other titles from the list (of course this is just my opinion).

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Originally Posted by Lyein

I only wish we had more pre-game buffs like protect to pass around. Maybe they'll add those in with a new level cap or additional jobs.

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Primary stat buffs are usually in that category, but XIV blended those in through the mere presence of a class in your party (and was also to encourage people to make balanced parties instead of stacking classes).

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Originally Posted by Urthdigger

My point is, the vast majority of FF games do not have a dedicated support job, such as what's being asked for in this thread. Typically, support is a secondary role of black mage or white mage. No, support roles are not as big a part of the FF franchise as the Crystals. They're more like the Buster Sword: Some FF games have it. The majority do not.

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Someone that gets it.

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The HMS Support sailed when Yoshida made Bard sprout from the archer class, resulting in the ranged DPS with group cooldowns we currently have.

A class entirely dedicated to buffing and debuffing doesn't work in a modern MMORPG, as the game and playerbase lack the dynamics seen in the old EQ days where you could justify a class that no one liked playing. Let's not pretend it was different in FFXI, because it was not; "support" classes have always been unpopular when the entire class is built on buff/debuffs, have always been seriously outnumbered by people who played other roles and as such had an insane amount of pull and leverage in groups (the culmination of this disgusting display being FFXI's princess Bard and princess Red Mage).