No offense, but I think most would agree that you tend the see the glass as being half empty. It's like, nothing is ever good enough for you. I'm sure it's just your opinion, but you kind of project your personal feelings onto everyone else including the developers of this game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elexia
ARR will fail if it's not a good game that draws people into paying money to play it. I don't think that hinges on what we say in the forums. They can take much of what we say to heart to make modifications which in the end serve to make the game better, but ultimately the ball is in their court. NAs are no worse than JPs; they're are just more people in the world outside of Japan believe it or not; the community is much larger.
I know people often say "this is still Alpha", but it really is. From now until release they may decide to remove jumping. Any number of changes will occur. Pray it goes for the best and stop this negative take on everything you seem to have. It's really not helping either.
Between the awfulness of 1.0 and what they've learned, I think they'll do a super job on ARR. Whether jump is included or not, to me, is largely irrelevant since that's just a tiny aspect of our gameplay. If you're obsessing over jumping this early, you are doing it wrong.
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11-23-2012, 02:03 AMEinSoFZ
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11-23-2012, 02:04 AMDelsusNo what I am saying is post in the existing threads not in 18727201 different threads, I have seen at least 20 on Jumping, with fragmented posts all over, you don't get anything purposely making rep's and devs lives hard, that's a surefire way of ensuring the game will fail. The mass of trolling doesn't help either (yes by you as well).Quote:
Originally Posted by Elexia
Again all I see from you is "ARR will fail" "FFXIV sucks" etc etc with no feedback. give constructive feedback for the devs they can use, I have given my fair share of feedback, but you definitely haven't.
I love how you left that part (a good argument) out of your quote. -
11-23-2012, 02:17 AMElexiaExactly, since we know above all that Yoshida wants to take all feedback to heart, if you're telling people to not complain or show concerns..they won't realistically get the feedback they'll need if you're trying to overpower the other side of the argument.Quote:
Originally Posted by EinSoFZ
This is the main thing some people haven't really thought about, they can change anything at any time, but Yoshida always says: "Please tell me(us) how you feel about (x)", yet you have some people saying they're not allow to tell them how they feel unless it's absolutely positive or else it's considered trolling.Quote:
Any number of changes will occur
No one can deny if you tell people to "shut up" about issues things won't always end up well, which is exactly what alpha and beta are for, which is why when they post alpha videos they say, in the post itself, to leave feedback and tell them what you think.
It's all on the same coin. This is why we always end up with MMOs with bad launches besides technical aspects, because you always get that group of players who tell people they aren't allowed to show concern lol. While to be fair it doesn't help developers make testing as demos nowadays, you rarely see people showing concern simply because of their excitement for wanting to play it.
Honestly, if you're obsessing over anything at any state you're simply showing concern. If you read Yoshida's latest words, even for an Alpha they wanted it to be really polished, which means it's open to be critiqued, which is why aside jumping because thats purely a personal matter, concerns about animations for example you have people shoot down because "it's just alpha"..usually by now you have the gist of what they're doing with it, usually only shaders and base animations are missing from alpha and sometimes beta..however we also heard they purposefully removed animations especially for PvP, this is why people show concern, because SE is willingly to axe assets so what do you determine is because it's "just alpha" or that's really how they want it to be?Quote:
If you're obsessing over jumping this early, you are doing it wrong.
That's why you show concern even early on and hope they will actually respond to you. -
11-23-2012, 02:57 AMEinSoFZI myself wouldn't tell people not to complain, but I would say they should be very direct with their complaints and less vague about them. That the criticism is constructive is important above all. Often what we're getting is people complaining to complain. I suppose that makes them feel better, but it doesn't tell Yoshi how to improve the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elexia
Rather than say "I don't like x thing I saw", state why and be detailed in describing what could be done to improve it. Stating that you think something looks silly isn't really a valid criticism at all and too many people have opinions based on no more than a comment like that.
Point? There's a proper way to show or voice concerns.
While I agree with you, I don't really believe being told to shut-up actually results in people doing it. Online gaming communities are pretty open and people can express their points of view at any time. If another player tells you to shut up, you'd be a fool to sacrifice your rights just because someone told you to shut up. By that I'm trying to say I don't think being told to shut up effects very much.Quote:
This is the main thing some people haven't really thought about, they can change anything at any time, but Yoshida always says: "Please tell me(us) how you feel about (x)", yet you have some people saying they're not allow to tell them how they feel unless it's absolutely positive or else it's considered trolling.
No one can deny if you tell people to "shut up" about issues things won't always end up well, which is exactly what alpha and beta are for, which is why when they post alpha videos they say, in the post itself, to leave feedback and tell them what you think.
It's all on the same coin. This is why we always end up with MMOs with bad launches besides technical aspects, because you always get that group of players who tell people they aren't allowed to show concern lol. While to be fair it doesn't help developers make testing as demos nowadays, you rarely see people showing concern simply because of their excitement for wanting to play it.
To me, the only way ARR can fail is if Yoshi and crew don't take player concerns stemming from the beginning until now to heart. Player feedback is key but some of it is really shitty. Like, what were they smoking while they suggested this shitty? So they have to sift out the bad from the good as far as player feedback goes while understand that like tons of other products, sometimes people DO NOT WANT what they're asking for.
That I don't believe. I think obsessing over small details prematurely results in players being overly concerned about some issues and ignoring others because they are just in such a fury over whatever it is they've set their brain to focus on. Calm down, look at the big picture, analyze carefully what you see and experience, think about it for a while. Don't go seeing jumping(for example) and start readying your pitchforks! There is still plenty of time and the developers are listening. If they see 1 thread that is well done and 10 that are just kind of moaning, that 1 thread will a world of good better than the latter threads.Quote:
Honestly, if you're obsessing over anything at any state you're simply showing concern. If you read Yoshida's latest words, even for an Alpha they wanted it to be really polished, which means it's open to be critiqued, which is why aside jumping because thats purely a personal matter, concerns about animations for example you have people shoot down because "it's just alpha"..usually by now you have the gist of what they're doing with it, usually only shaders and base animations are missing from alpha and sometimes beta..however we also heard they purposefully removed animations especially for PvP, this is why people show concern, because SE is willingly to axe assets so what do you determine is because it's "just alpha" or that's really how they want it to be?
That's why you show concern even early on and hope they will actually respond to you.
I'm trying to spell out that after players have stated their concern, complaining and moaning and lamenting its existence will at some point be pointless; the devs understand your concern since they do read. You don't have to go full mode on it just yet.
Again, I'm not telling people to ignore problems or not bring them up...just to go about it the right way. SE doesn't have to listen to up but we hope that they will. To me the best changes come about when players can play the game and let the dev make changes slowly while we are able to play it and report accurately, over time, over feelings. FFXI wasn't great overnight and neither will ARR. -
11-23-2012, 03:12 AMAbriaelHilarious how you seem to so strongly wish for that at every post you make.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elexia
Luckily, judging from what we're seeing so far, this most probably isn't gonna happen. I wonder if you'll cry. -
11-23-2012, 03:14 AMGalliano
A thread complaining about people complaining... I might start a thread complaining about people complaining about people complaining!
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11-23-2012, 03:14 AMDelsusElexia will cry like a baby when ARR succeeds.Quote:
Originally Posted by Abriael
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11-23-2012, 03:19 AMEinSoFZI think secretly he/she wants it to succeed but is going forward with a mouth full of the sour grapes that was version 1.0Quote:
Originally Posted by Delsus
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11-23-2012, 03:21 AMDelsusIf that's the case, he/she will not have read anything, seen any trailers or read comments on fan sites, the game is getting as much hype as it did before Sept 2010, let's just hope it lives up to it this time.Quote:
Originally Posted by EinSoFZ
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11-23-2012, 03:23 AMsyntaxlies
I want to be able to jump, then glide through the air like in blade and soul