Some of the Paladin changes I'll like to see in 8.0..

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Originally Posted by Asako

Pointless buttons just need purged.

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Oh I could not possibly disagree with this more, if anything I think Jobs need more pointless buttons, things that aren't important or are so absurdly niche that they rarely get used, but it is still a funny thing the Job can do by applying its skills, it's a great way to add flavor to the Jobs, and we need more of that, not less.

I think there needs to be a middle ground, pointless flavour buttons should be encouraged and present but it has to come with pruning of overbloated “this button’s purpose is to do damage/heal” first to make room for flavour

PLD is probably the job already closest to this but nowhere near enough

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

I think there needs to be a middle ground, pointless flavour buttons should be encouraged and present but it has to come with pruning of overbloated “this button’s purpose is to do damage/heal” first to make room for flavour

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This is true but the poster in question was talking about Shield Bash and Clemency, two buttons a PLD could not even have in their hotbar and still be an excellent player, Clemency does have niche uses, but it is very much a button that ideally the PLD would never use, so I think it is fair to consider it in that category.

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Originally Posted by VeyaAkemi

This is true but the poster in question was talking about Shield Bash and Clemency, two buttons a PLD could not even have in their hotbar and still be an excellent player, Clemency does have niche uses, but it is very much a button that ideally the PLD would never use, so I think it is fair to consider it in that category.

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My issue with Clemency and Shield bash is we already have better alternatives as buttons. We already have an OGCD stun and an OCGD Regen. I'll happily take more Job flavoured buttons if they had reasonable use. You're never going to use Shield Bash, and you really really should not be using Clemency either.

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Originally Posted by Asako

My issue with Clemency and Shield bash is we already have better alternatives as buttons. We already have an OGCD stun and an OCGD Regen. I'll happily take more Job flavoured buttons if they had reasonable use. You're never going to use Shield Bash, and you really really should not be using Clemency either.

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Shield bash is an absolute god send in deep dungeons as an example and clemency is a better flavour option for PLD white magic than passive healing on the unlimited blade works combo

I actively want more shield bashes not less

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Originally Posted by Asako

My issue with Clemency and Shield bash is we already have better alternatives as buttons. We already have an OGCD stun and an OCGD Regen. I'll happily take more Job flavoured buttons if they had reasonable use. You're never going to use Shield Bash, and you really really should not be using Clemency either.

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Shield Bash is kind of a sidegrade as is on the GCD but doesn't have a separate cooldown, while Low Blow is oGCD has it's 25s CD.

The Regen on Holy Sheltron and Intervention should just be removed.

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Originally Posted by Asako

Remove Shield Bash... Remove Clemency too. Pointless buttons just need purged.

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Clemency is far from a pointless button in any content capable of the slightest step out of rigidity, and Shield Bash does no harm to you in that PLD isn't in any way tuned around its presence and, if you have no use for it, you could just not bother putting it (or Clemency, for that matter) on your bar.

"Boring Blade" and Circle of Scorn (and/or Spirits Within+) could use rehauls or replacement, sure, but... why remove situationally interesting skills for those who do content that'd actually use them?

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Clemency is far from a pointless button in any content capable of the slightest step out of rigidity

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In casual content you don't want to use Clemency either. For 99.999% of the time, using Clemency is taking over for healers, and creates a net negative compared to letting the healer do their thing.

That is exactly why Clemency isn't a problematic ability. It's never useful, until you get to a point where any optimizations are out of the window anyway.

Again, my issue is more with these moves being not really useful, I do in fact not have either of them on my hotbar. I'd just rather the devs came up with more interesting ways to fill out the role.

Honestly I still wished they just gave us GLA Jobstones [and Jobstones for all the OG Classes] so we could play a different style of the same Tank. It's never gonna happen but it would have been nice to have variations of the same jobs. Archer and Bard are in the same boat. I'd love a more Ranger style of play instead of the music aspect of Ranged DPS. Topic for a different time.

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Originally Posted by aiqa

In casual content you don't want to use Clemency either. For 99.999% of the time, using Clemency is taking over for healers, and creates a net negative compared to letting the healer do their thing.

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I never said anything about it being optimal, only situationally useful, which is reason enough to retain the skill, even if others may happily drop it from their bars. The latter group needn't necessitate the skill's complete removal.