Misleading English translation of a major story element in the 7.4 MSQ (Big Spoilers)

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Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard

The localizers are just making their own story instead of translating.

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This. I meander around N2 in terms of listening comprehension in JP, and while the dialogue in the English script may appeal to the average American specifically, as well as people who don't like JRPGs, several other people play the game in English as well. The localization divorces the storyline from its own messaging and makes it, at times, feel more like a WRPG rather than a JRPG, solely because it insists on localizing the stupidest nonsense. Memes in achievement names? I think they're cringe, but they don't affect the story, so whatever. Dialogue left and right getting fucked over, Urianger's speech, Haurchefant as a concept, loads of major terminology... It just sucks, and it used to be better than this. Well, in the MSQ that is, the battle TL has always been ass.

e/: And yeah, changing things for the sake of changing things. Meso Terminal?????

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Originally Posted by Espon

Just another person that doesn't understand that localization isn't simply translating things word for word from one language from another and that Google Translate is perfect. Japanese is structured in such a way that makes it impossible to directly translate to English.

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Yes, thank you. I know what localization is. Some people like to say silly things like "we want translation, not localization!" but fortunately I have never made this claim. What I want is good localization that provides an equivalent experience and doesn't make unnecessary changes that mislead the playerbase for years on end.

For example, vast swathes of English-speaking players still don't realize that the aetherial sea and "the lifestream" (actually the earth veins/currents) are totally separate concepts because the English script got them mixed up. Or for a closer parallel, the whole "Y'shtola's aether sight is killing her" debacle. Phrasing is important.

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Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

The more important point in the 7.4 ending would be if the phrase about a certain apocalyptic voice is mentioned in all languages.

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Do you mean the "It's nature's proclamation. Can't you hear it?" part?

If so, here's a JP/EN comparison for that:

EN:
Calyx: That's your ominous prediction, is it?
Halmarut: No, it's nature's proclamation. Can't you hear it?
Halmarut: It echoes in the silence left by the will of the star.

JP:
Calyx: それはお前の見立てか?
Halmarut: いいえ。告げているんです
Halmarut: 星の意志に代わる、理が。

JP, roughly machine translated:
Calyx: Is that your opinion?
Halmarut: No. I'm telling you.
Halmarut: Reason* replaces the will of the star.

*For context; the word translated as "reason" here is 理 (kotowari) which has a number of meanings, but in this context probably means something like "the natural order".

Assuming that's correct, the EN is mostly fine if overly flowery - but the "Can't you hear it?" part is made up. There is no voice.

It doesn't really seem to change the intention much? Things wither in the winter. Something big is coming. The message is still getting through.

Localization and translation creating different dialogue and story than the source material? In My FFXIV? Its more likely than you think.

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Originally Posted by Underscore

Right, but that's not what the original script said, and the term "withering" is not exclusive to winter. Things can wither for plenty of reasons.

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Understandable. But still, due to the nature of languages and difference/nuances between them. The winterer -> wither honestly flows better without changing the context than winter winter which might sound overly repetitious.

Ultimately this is a negligible change since the context is the same. An apocalyptic event is coming that we, the hero, don't really know anything about. Fire? Ice? It's irrelevant in context of our player character.

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Originally Posted by Underscore

Right, but that's not what the original script said, and the term "withering" is not exclusive to winter. Things can wither for plenty of reasons.

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I don't think it particularly matters whether there is some ambiguity now, so long as that when the vaguely-foreshadowed bad thing happens, it fits with the term that was used to foreshadow it. Until then it doesn't entirely matter if different audiences make different guesses about what will come.

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Originally Posted by Underscore

Assuming that's correct, the EN is mostly fine if overly flowery - but the "Can't you hear it?" part is made up. There is no voice.

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I don't take the phrase "can't you hear it?" as implying there is a real voice at all. It's the second half of the same metaphor of describing a natural thing happening as "nature's proclamation". It certainly isn't attributing an actual voice to an entity.

Holy moly just play the game in one language and you won't even have to think about this.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I don't take the phrase "can't you hear it?" as implying there is a real voice at all. It's the second half of the same metaphor of describing a natural thing happening as "nature's proclamation". It certainly isn't attributing an actual voice to an entity.

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Yeah the way I took it is as a poetic way of saying, "Look, you should be able to figure out why this is happening too, you have the same information I do."

"Can't you hear it?" = "Can't you see it?"

Ironically, the exact reason localization probably chose to use the word 'withering' instead of 'winter' is precisely because English speakers might think winter = LITERAL winter. There's a whole lot of symbolism in the Japanese 'arrival of a harsh winter' - it's symbolic. Now mind you, there could be actual cold winter weather to accompany it.

They probably asked what is this winter actually doing to the world? And the answer in the broader narrative is: it drains life, hope, vitality, worlds themselves. Hence, we get withering.

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Originally Posted by Ykitooooo

Ironically, the exact reason localization probably chose to use the word 'withering' instead of 'winter' is precisely because English speakers might think winter = LITERAL winter.

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Good point too. You only need look at how many people heard the term "Winterers" and started assuming it meant we were either going somewhere cold, or going somewhere warm to get away from the cold.