Frontlines 7.1

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Originally Posted by Bonoki

I can absolutely confirm this. I’m in a Discord server where people treat PvP like it’s parsing in PvE, prioritizing padding their stats over actually winning the match. To them, having the highest number of kills or the most damage is what matters because it makes them look like they contributed more and, by extension, look better than everyone else. Winning the match has become secondary to boosting their own numbers. When I first got invited to the server, I was genuinely shocked by how widespread this mindset is. It’s not just a few players—it’s a significant number, and they even run premade groups nightly with this exact goal in mind. It’s like parsing culture bleeding straight into PvP.

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I've seen a plethora of premades who just go in to pack as many people and aoe them down, disregarding objectives all the time. They're just doing pve in pvp on pve players who pve the nodes, nothing new in mmo pvp. Still, I'd rather fight them than the objectives-focused premades. At least there's more counterplay.

After diving into ranked (plat) and frontlines 7.1 for the past few days I feel like the "I'm just here for the exp" is going to be on the rise with players actions being much less impactful in a casual sense when soloing. For pre made groups this may be amazing for some with the recent returning astro stacking allowing people to just nuke teams lately. Now don't get me wrong nuking teams is great BUT when all other jobs hit like a nerf gun in comparison it pushes a lot of people away. We have now come full circle with additional problems now. Season 1 had LB spam sum with Ninja and Sam going wild but were adjusted respectfully. Now our newer issue as of late is a more frequent aoe from astro and with new hp and hit reg ninja and sam made a come back for easiest way to remove players again. I've gotten off of almost all my main roles this update and play whm now for cc and mch for frontlines due to the whole everyone runs away theme that is going on now because they just can with less punishment. Now on the flip side of these complaints it does feel a lot like feast in terms of rules of engagement working together to focus people down but if that is the direction we are aiming for astro and red mage will need some nerfs OR buff the jobs falling behind. All I do know is this is the most negative reaction I've seen to pvp since my time starting in shadowbringers hopefully square makes a comeback.

I would much have preferred they address the root cause of the issue itself, rather than making everything feel so much slower.


Cap targets pulled by DRK to 5. Cap AoE targets to 5 with diminishing damage for subsequent targets, e.g., 100% damage for first target, 75% for second and third, and 50% for remaining two or something.

None of the developers care for feedback. This is just pure arrogance at a whole new level. They delayed the "PvP" update until 7.2 so we're stuck with whatever "This" is for the forseeable future. Same old maps. Same old problems, same lack of communication from those above. The only thing new here are the jobs that got butchered or buffed into the stratosphere.

Some things are better. I like there being more abilities that punch through guard and reduce its effectiveness. The general addition of more AoE I don't necessarily see as a negative, but its pushing the game towards meta stacking, and deathballing which I find just encourages brain dead "Follow the leader" gameplay.

A lot of the changes are absolute bullshit, to the point where you have to ask if the people making PvP have ever touched the mode in their lives. Monk has been completely gutted and thrown into the trash bin and set on fire. Gunbreaker and RDM no longer feel special, and what in the hells have they done with my Black mage? (These are just the jobs I've had time to play with. I'm sure theres even more f**** afoot on other jobs I don't usually play.) Nobody really should have been surprised by this. The warning signs that they had no idea what they are doing, and that they are incapable of making compelling, and enjoyable PvP has been there for quite awhile.

I don't like the direction that PvP is going, or the game in general. I am not the target audience for this game, and thats probably the case for a lot of us who genuinely enjoy PvP. I will be treating PVP as a daily roulette grind from here on out, probably as the devs intended. I don't enjoy playing it, and I don't have faith that either Yoshi P, the devs, or SE care for anything that has been said for years about this game mode, even the JP audience is ignored. There are better games which are more rewarding with my time and I will be spending my time on those titles instead.

FL is a mess. As a dumb turn my brain off mode it is amazing. But:

* Too many players. There is no thinking from 90% of the players. It is ball up and smash skills. Those of us who play it tactically solo, often find great success, but it is sad feeling like I am culling preschoolers instead of actual adult players because of how brainless they play. Current favorite strat seems to be pick Astro and spam Gravity from the smooth crowd.

* Too much DR: I have lived numerous times with half a dozen people hitting me because the DR baseline is so bonkers. I understand why it HAS to be this way, see point #1.

* Low EXP: Short of the daily bonus, there is basically no reason to play this mode.

Don't match premades with players who queue solo.

Remove Salted Earth.

Prevent players from putting markers on themselves or allies.

Prevent waymarks from being placed within 10 seconds of one another.

Disable sound effects from chat.

Bonus radical idea: don't match players with someone they blacklisted.

This would eliminate the imbalance premades introduce to FL.

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Originally Posted by HyperSMB

FL is a mess. As a dumb turn my brain off mode it is amazing. But:

* Too many players. There is no thinking from 90% of the players. It is ball up and smash skills. Those of us who play it tactically solo, often find great success, but it is sad feeling like I am culling preschoolers instead of actual adult players because of how brainless they play. Current favorite strat seems to be pick Astro and spam Gravity from the smooth crowd.

* Too much DR: I have lived numerous times with half a dozen people hitting me because the DR baseline is so bonkers. I understand why it HAS to be this way, see point #1.

* Low EXP: Short of the daily bonus, there is basically no reason to play this mode.

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Here is a simple fix: remove FL roulette, put CC one match roulette in it's place (pref. ranked one).

Here is even more simpler fix: remove pvp from the game, one mode is a trade win for rank 1 fiesta, the other is an unbalanced snoozefest.

People who do work on pvp right now (i mean for the past how many years since CC release?) are lazy individuals, who do not deserve any % of sub money and should be shamed in the japanese fashion.

Not sure if it's because a lot people have just quit playing FL, but the quality of commanding on Aether is at an all-time low.

Example from today that is characteristic. Early in the match an A and B popped next to our spawn in cave. We grab them. The other two teams are locked in battle on the east of the map presenting a pinch opportunity. The team begins moving in the obvious and correct direction when the shot-caller insists: hold these. don't push. I guess half the team realized this was dumb because we kept pushing only to be ordered once again back to base. We subsequently pay for this as we have no BH and lose.

"Commanding" requires a rudimentary understanding of map control. It's not just yelling at people.

If all the commanders and experienced players are in a similar boat to me, it isn't worth the investment into Frontlines anymore. It's not fun, there are other games out there that do PvP better, so nobody is doing Frontlines who either isn't a masochist, or still has FoMo/Achievement grinds to do.

I think a lot of "Bad Commanding" is coming from DRK no longer being the juggernaut it was, and premades no longer being capable of carrying the team as much as they did in the past. Now it is a team wide effort, and with melee being instantly destroyed in every engagement it's hard to convince people to push.

Playing as a melee oneself and setting the tone - rushing in, pulling back etc - does a lot of good encouragement for others to do the same. Sometimes you zoom in and wipe because everyone else hung back, but that's life. I'd say it happens less frequently than zooming in and out to zero overall effect, and that less than getting some kills or assists.