New Alliance Raid is really undertuned

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Originally Posted by Llynethil

Not really, even without the veteran raiders, raids get progressively easier and easier as weeks go by because people in general get better gear and more accustomed to what happens during fights.

Happened last raid, happened with the pandaemonium raids, happened with the eden and nier ones too.

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Exactly, rarely have an issue in Nier raids or Ivalice raids. If anything, I see more deaths in the recent raids due to laziness from "vets" twiddling their thumbs at the not so engaging encounters, only here for some alt loot. Given how easy the raids are it's not surprising.

I thought alliance raids are positioned as something that people can just go in and have fun. It is not supposed to be challenging content. This was known all the way back when the first alliance raid was introduced. I think it's tuned perfectly.

You're not supposed to wipe to mistakes in alliance raids. It's supposed to be content that can be easily and leisurely done. If you want things that can wipe you or require you to pay attention to both the mechanics and your rotation and perform at your best, you're looking at the wrong content.

While yes its not meant to be teeth grinding hard they should not be target dummies either, the fights are so undertuned you dont even see LB 3 and not even LB 2 on certain ones.
The entire thing feels just really short, besides the "haha now in reverse" on our first pull i've yet to see a single wipe.

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Originally Posted by Voidedge_Ragna

While yes its not meant to be teeth grinding hard they should not be target dummies either, the fights are so undertuned you dont even see LB 3 and not even LB 2 on certain ones.
The entire thing feels just really short, besides the "haha now in reverse" on our first pull i've yet to see a single wipe.

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I see people brining up wipes constantly, but the content is supposed to be easy, it's supposed to be leisure fun, you're not supposed to wipe. At least that's how I understand as the purpose of even having these alliance raids: to just have some light-hearted fun with a bunch of people.

I suppose I don't mind tuning it up a little. Just off the top of my head:

• Crystal Tower: LotA and ST are so severely undertuned nowadays it's become standard to skip most mechanics that can be skipped in there now. WoD is still good entertainment sometimes.
• Mhach: get it very infrequently and thought it not really memorable, but I do remember feeling the Diabolos fight to be too boringly long.
• Ivalice: packed with mechanics and I never mind getting that place.
• YoRHa: I love Nier:Automata so I'm biased, but I feel the tuning here is perfect.

Now that I think back, yeah the Myths alliance raids are undertuned compared to the previous expansions. Although I still do think it's not necessarily a bad thing. At least it's not Crystal Tower undertuned. CT really could use an overhaul.

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Originally Posted by Zfz

I see people brining up wipes constantly, but the content is supposed to be easy, it's supposed to be leisure fun, you're not supposed to wipe. At least that's how I understand as the purpose of even having these alliance raids: to just have some light-hearted fun with a bunch of people.

I suppose I don't mind tuning it up a little. Just off the top of my head:

• Crystal Tower: LotA and ST are so severely undertuned nowadays it's become standard to skip most mechanics that can be skipped in there now. WoD is still good entertainment sometimes.
• Mhach: get it very infrequently and thought it not really memorable, but I do remember feeling the Diabolos fight to be too boringly long.
• Ivalice: packed with mechanics and I never mind getting that place.
• YoRHa: I love Nier:Automata so I'm biased, but I feel the tuning here is perfect.

Now that I think back, yeah the Myths alliance raids are undertuned compared to the previous expansions. Although I still do think it's not necessarily a bad thing. At least it's not Crystal Tower undertuned. CT really could use an overhaul.

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This didn't used to be the case. Months into its lifecycle and Ozma would still wipe groups who didn't know his mechanics. Thunder God Cid was notorious for causing no small amount of wipes. Just because the content is easy and meant to be beatable doesn't mean we can't see the occasional wipe if people aren't respecting mechanics. The absence of said wipes robs these fights of any intention. Menphina is so comically undertuned you won't even see LB3 and she does practically nothing remotely threatening. Even Halone, the hardest of the four, does little more than out/in and cleaves. It's all flash and little substance. Now I still enjoy the fights for what they are but having played since HW, I can't deny it being a very noticeable downgrade from the older 24 mans.

Just to address your listing of each raid series:

• Crystal Tower: This is less to do with undertuning and more them syncing us to i130 when the raids themselves are i50, i70 and i90, respectively. We're comically overpowered for no real reason. In the case of LotA, we're nearly triple the level of the bosses.
• Mhach: As noted, before the inevitable power creep, Weeping City and Dun Scaith were notorious for causing wipes, in particular Forgall, Ozma and Diabolos. Scathach was no slouch either. Nowadays, the lack of balance adjustments in lower level content has rendered all of these fights a breeze.
• Ivalice: While they've all be subject to similar power creep, Ridorana still holds up. Orbonne, specifically Thunder God Cid, was infamous causing mass wipes. Sadly, both Echo and a straight nerf has reduced his fight to being a glorified target dummy. He barely even does damage nowadays.
• YoRHa: I'd have to disagree. Nier raids on the whole fight like damage sponges. I liked several fights from the series but they didn't wow me. Personal opinion, of course. Red Girl is the clear winner, and really the only boss of the whole series with some bite.

Myth is arguably on the same level as YoRHa, which was outright stated to be intentionally undertuned due to Nier fans possibly being new to the game. Both are a sharp decline from Mhach and Ivalice in terms of difficulty.

Yeah, these raids are severely undertuned in my opinion. The bosses spend more time feeding you appetisers instead of giving you the main course (and when they do, they're almost dead). Nald'thal is extremely guilty of this, especially now. Would not be surprised if we skip the scales completely in 6.4-5 (yesterday the alliance got him down to 12% before he started the scales phase). If SE don't want the bosses to be damage sponges, then maybe they should have them "get serious" between 50-60%HP.

Ivalice is where SE peaked with alliance raids imo.

I also want to add that even at minimum ilevel, the Crystal Tower raids are undertuned. LotA used to require 6 tanks, but now has 3 (so more DPS = more damage), Syrcus Tower, even at min-ilvl, can still have you skip Scylla and Glasya's main mechanics due to potency changes in Job actions (Scylla's Petrifaction + add phase, Glasya's outside platforms. Pretty sure this was possible even in 2.3, when it came out). WoD is mostly fine, though Cerberus dies pretty fast and Cloud of Darkness was a disappointing fight on release as she spent more time inhaling clouds than doing actual damage (Angry Mayo is the hardest fight in the CT raids overall).

This raid is so undertuned, it's got people requesting a "savage/extreme" level 24-man raid. I've never seen the idea suggested before, let alone so often. That's just how baby-mode this raid is. They messed up IMO.