What Zero Could've Been

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

Yotusyu had good on screen presence. Hence why I cited her interesting personality along with her looks that give her behavior a pass.

As for the rest, I'm not interested in arguments that amount to little more than pointing where the rules said no. Nothing is stopping us from making deals with Bayonetta-like Voidsent.

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"Its ok to be insane and want to torture/murder your nations people if I find you attractive and think you are interesting" - man what a take this is.

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Originally Posted by MagiusNecros

It's called shit writing. But that's kinda been a problem the whole expansion.

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Well, i'm not gonna go there any further, wouldn't want the subject to get derailed.
As for Zero, i'm eager to see what she will be like once her arc is complete.

I'm happy that she isn't a scholar or someone from Sharlayan, and is a pure fighter. If she stay for ride in 7.0 there's potential for her to get a nice story arc tied to the expansion thematically. And it will be good to not be the only character who is clueless while everyone else explains things they already know.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Clearly you and I have very different ideas of what is and is not attractive.

And how the heck do you think yotsuyu has charisma.....

She rules through fear and punishment, not charisma...

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The OP being who they are explains about 90% of it. Sometimes I agree with some of the things they say, sometimes I do not. When I don't, however, it's usually because they have some pretty hot takes. And that is pretty common.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

I'm not sure I understand. Mocking a man trying to flirt with her takes a certain non-blandness in a female character?

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same here, tells you everything about the op

gives me "men drawing women" vibes

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

I just wish the sort of attitude and dynamic she brings could've gone to a male cast member instead. FFXIV women are oftentimes too "strong" without a sufficient arc leading up to that level of empowerment or confidence while the men are either jokes or hung up on a set of emotions like Vrtra is, and it's not doing anyone any favors.

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Female characters need story arcs to explain why they're not all dainty princesses? What?

The OP just doesn't like smart women. Or women who talk back or a little sassy.

Every post he goes on about, all women need to be "kind", "nurturing", the yes-man to men, stay in the kitchen types. Basically doormat women who's only purpose is to uplift the man into a higher position.

Now there is nothing wrong with these types of women. In the right settings, these types can be very good and a great support. However, the Scions is not the settings for this. They are a group that delves into the world's problems, need to be headstrong and hold their own. They can be kind, yes, but not a doormat.

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

Female characters need story arcs to explain why they're not all dainty princesses? What?

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Yes. They should have on-screen development that leads up to the strength they find instead of just starting out all cool and powerful. The lack of these arcs doesn't make for a compelling story, it's just putting a Mary Sue in front of my face and expecting me to like her based off how cool she looks. That isn't what stories should be doing.

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Originally Posted by Kazemon15

The OP just doesn't like smart women. Or women who talk back or a little sassy.

Every post he goes on about, all women need to be "kind", "nurturing", the yes-man to men, stay in the kitchen types. Basically doormat women who's only purpose is to uplift the man into a higher position.

Now there is nothing wrong with these types of women. In the right settings, these types can be very good and a great support. However, the Scions is not the settings for this. They are a group that delves into the world's problems, need to be headstrong and hold their own. They can be kind, yes, but not a doormat.

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Zero's honestly my favorite type of character. I love mercenary types. Even if she softens up a bit, I hope that she maintains a bit of her cold and distant nature.

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

Yes. They should have on-screen development that leads up to the strength they find instead of just starting out all cool and powerful. The lack of these arcs doesn't make for a compelling story, it's just putting a Mary Sue in front of my face and expecting me to like her based off how cool she looks. That isn't what stories should be doing.

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I mean, Estinien started all cool and powerful, and still got a compelling story arc by 3.3. People even liked him for it.

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

Female characters need story arcs to explain why they're not all dainty princesses? What?

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Yes. They should have on-screen development that leads up to the strength they find instead of just starting out all cool and powerful. The lack of these arcs doesn't make for a compelling story, it's just putting a Mary Sue in front of my face and expecting me to like her based off how cool she looks. That isn't what stories should be doing.

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Originally Posted by Nuki

same here, tells you everything about the op

gives me "men drawing women" vibes

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Men and women have both selected for specific traits in the other gender throughout all history. There are some that are more selected for than others.

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Originally Posted by Kazemon15

The OP just doesn't like smart women. Or women who talk back or a little sassy.

Every post he goes on about, all women need to be "kind", "nurturing", the yes-man to men, stay in the kitchen types. Basically doormat women who's only purpose is to uplift the man into a higher position.

Now there is nothing wrong with these types of women. In the right settings, these types can be very good and a great support. However, the Scions is not the settings for this. They are a group that delves into the world's problems, need to be headstrong and hold their own. They can be kind, yes, but not a doormat.

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You already have your strong woman type with Y'shtola, why did Zero have to take after her in regards to being stoic and having a power level that isn't really built up to over the course of the story? Like Venat, it's just sort of "there." I do not appreciate you misrepresenting me this way. The Scions could use a woman on their side that is actually friendly and likeable, neither quality which I'd describe Y'shtola as.

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Originally Posted by RukoBoshi

I mean, Estinien started all cool and powerful, and still got a compelling story arc by 3.3. People even liked him for it.

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What Estinien went through throughout Heavensward was more than what Y'shtola underwent over the last 10 years in terms of character development and actual lessons learned. However with Y'shtola she just shows up, explains things, does forbidden magic, and not much else. She doesn't bring as much to the story as he did, and even Estinien's paused development is problematic for the game's future unless he begins to evolve enough to justify his continued presence.

Ongoing stories like this one should not have a main cast that's so stagnant.