New Dancer feels TERRIBLE and weak

I have lost count of the number of times I've been in a Frontlines engagement and been burned down because I couldn't do anything due to DNC LB. It can't be cleansed or guarded against, all you can do is hope you have healing and shields.

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Originally Posted by Mercury_Grey

BLM doesn't need a buff they jstu got one in teh last rotation of PVP buffs. IF they buff it more then they should lose their umbral deep freeze

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Umbral Deep Freeze requires either being hit with ice and then Paradox (single target only) and then Superflare OR being hit by Freeze 3 times (hard to do at range) and then being hit by Superflare. And on top of all that there's functionally very little difference between lv2 Bind and lv3 Deep Freeze. And both can be cleansed. If anything Deep Freeze needs a buff.

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Originally Posted by Sililos

Dead in a single stun even with Esuna, barely scratches enemy HP and its damaging move is locked behind a highly limited resource with a long recharge time.

Our Limit break does NOTHING, 2 seconds of charm, the enemy laughs it off or pops their own Esuna.

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Tell everyone that you don’t know how to play DNC in PvP without telling everyone that you don’t know how to play DNC in PvP.

BTW, it’s called purify and nobody can “purify” DNC LB. And no, saber dance is not your main damaging move lol. Did you know that you can also extend your LB to 4 seconds? That’s 4 seconds of enemies losing the ability to do ANY action. Imagine that.

I bet you probably dance partner ranged jobs also.

Maybe try reading the Job action tooltips for the Job you’re playing before saying a Job is trash. Maybe the Job is fine and it’s 100% a player issue.

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Originally Posted by Mercury_Grey

I have seen DNC take over a game because their PLD has kept them alive. As if with any job who can be kept alive they can deal damage and get their LB quickly. DNC to me feels so team relient

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It is and that is what makes DNC one of the strongest under current PvP environment.
Entire Frontline and CC is team-oriented and one man army is a thing of the past.
If a player is unable to accept the fact DNC is a support, this player is playing the wrong job

Wow, talk about a necrobump.

DNC has to be played somewhat differently between Crystalline and FL (but then again, so do several other jobs). It's shorter range takes some getting used to, but that's the trade-off to having an instant "regular" GCD without reducing your speed like BRD and MCH. It'll always be more of a support job in both, but in Crystalline it still has a respectable burst and makes for a good pursuer to finish-off runners.

Thanks to melee's huge defense bonus modifiers in FL and the ability to run back into a mob of 10+ teammates; they're not as threatening. Because of that, DNC has to be played way more opportunistically in FL, using En Avant to zip in and out of range and carefully picking targets they can feasibly (helping) kill while avoiding being picked-out to kill themselves. The reason why DNC seems like such a bad job for FL to some people is because it demands an awareness and good judgement that most people queuing up for it don't have, and that many DNC's in FL are borderline useless and just standing in place until they're noticed for being too exposed.

So then we have their LB, which quite frankly, is dictated by how competent their team is, not by whenever they feel like using it- which is a death sentence. It's an incredible LB in FL if used with a team capitalizing on it, or used while a team is making a big push. The biggest problem is most teams aren't organized enough to give many opportunities, so many DNCs end up sitting on it or get antsy and use it at stupid times and present themselves as free kills. This is why it works with DRK's meta, because it gives them a directed spot to use it, and the cover of the chaos created by people scrambling to survive or get out a DRK draw-in. Absent of a murderball, DNC's LB requires (again) good judgement and awareness to get any significant use out of.

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Originally Posted by Mistress_Irika

I wish I can convince you otherwise with how well dancer is. However, many are turned off by the design of it. Also it is one of those few classes that can get shafted before the limit break takes takes effect due to the 1 sec delay (GNB has it the worst.). I'm sorry that the class does not appeal to you. Probably would have been a bit better if DNC's range was able to match the other range classes. Just saying.

That being said, compared to SAM, SCH, and SMN, I had an oddly easy time climbing with DNC. Homing Dance is completely busted. Just pray that you do not face off against a team of pure range classes.

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DNC, like most melee DPS, eats any ranged for breakfast. It can even eat some melees for breakfast and will probably outlive and outdamage most DPS jobs in the game with the exception of a few (in the context of skirmishing and 1v1 ratting/pursuing). If I see a full ranged team facing me as a DNC, I smile with glee. In fact that's what I love with this job, it doesn't care what it is facing, it can fly away, it's tough, it deals damage. The only one thing I fear is Miracle of Nature: you can't do anything about it before killing the WHM.

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Originally Posted by Valence

DNC, like most melee DPS, eats any ranged for breakfast. It can even eat some melees for breakfast and will probably outlive and outdamage most DPS jobs in the game with the exception of a few (in the context of skirmishing and 1v1 ratting/pursuing). If I see a full ranged team facing me as a DNC, I smile with glee. In fact that's what I love with this job, it doesn't care what it is facing, it can fly away, it's tough, it deals damage. The only one thing I fear is Miracle of Nature: you can't do anything about it before killing the WHM.

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We must be playing the class differently lol. I would love to see how you play, because compared to you loving that comp I completely despise it especially at the top level where most top players are spamming range classes. DPS wise it feels like a 4v5 to me.

1v1s are fine. It's grouping that I have trouble with. If I decide to follow my melee or tank behind to put pressure on that comp the other team isn't shooting them: they're sniping me as soon as I get within shooting distance. So I'm usually forced to back away before I can even get a 2nd auto off, dashes or not. Towards diamond I'm usually forced to play without the reliance of Homing Dance while I don't have an LB against that comp. I'm not exactly sure how to counter without a corner to play around.

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Originally Posted by Alyko

I have lost count of the number of times I've been in a Frontlines engagement and been burned down because I couldn't do anything due to DNC LB. It can't be cleansed or guarded against, all you can do is hope you have healing and shields.





Umbral Deep Freeze requires either being hit with ice and then Paradox (single target only) and then Superflare OR being hit by Freeze 3 times (hard to do at range) and then being hit by Superflare. And on top of all that there's functionally very little difference between lv2 Bind and lv3 Deep Freeze. And both can be cleansed. If anything Deep Freeze needs a buff.

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BLM has good range to use thier freeze 3 times and super flare, but the fact they have a LB that gives them damage reduction ontop of their burst that gives a shield. THey should lose one of their toold uring LB either the deep freeze or bunrst so they are forced to pick. Shoul di cc then LB or use my burst before i LB

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Originally Posted by Divinemights

It is and that is what makes DNC one of the strongest under current PvP environment.
Entire Frontline and CC is team-oriented and one man army is a thing of the past.
If a player is unable to accept the fact DNC is a support, this player is playing the wrong job

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Or the DNC who refuses to use thier dancer partner skill. A lot of DNC players undersell how good a group heal could be with cure sombre i think its called. I don't remember all the skills of DNC in pvp I never touched it in PVP besides like twice. They can even use thier dance partner on the tnak to support them

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Originally Posted by Mistress_Irika

We must be playing the class differently lol. I would love to see how you play, because compared to you loving that comp I completely despise it especially at the top level where most top players are spamming range classes. DPS wise it feels like a 4v5 to me.

1v1s are fine. It's grouping that I have trouble with. If I decide to follow my melee or tank behind to put pressure on that comp the other team isn't shooting them: they're sniping me as soon as I get within shooting distance. So I'm usually forced to back away before I can even get a 2nd auto off, dashes or not. Towards diamond I'm usually forced to play without the reliance of Homing Dance while I don't have an LB against that comp. I'm not exactly sure how to counter without a corner to play around.

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I don't know what happens on NA. Meeles are mildly meta on EU. Any team with more meeles in my experience holds an advantage.

But if you are the only acting melee then you should probably not go alone ahead.

(Disclaimer: I haven't actually played ranked with dancer yet. So my opinion is purely based on my experience in casual games. Maybe more experienced players will disagree with me.)

I actually really like dancer's current kit, minus the short range, and think you can be quite impactful. In my humble (non-expert) opinion if the range was improved dancer would feel like a very well-rounded class to me.
(Though obviously I won't complain if they buff its buffs. But its general playstyle I really enjoy.)

It can be very team-dependant, that's true, esp. when it comes to utilising your burst effectively but that issue is not unique to dancers. Many healers (esp. Ast) have the same problem, yet I still think their kits are fine.
I think that's just an inherent problem of more support-oriented jobs but I don't think that should mean that this job archetype/playstyle can't exist/thrive in PvP.

I assume at higher levels, when players are more skilled and there's better team coordination classes like dancer or ast can really shine (as supported by that JPN meta tier list I guess).

But nevertheless even in casuals I think it's still really fun and imo you can contribute meaningfully to your team's performance.

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But I agree I really, really dislike the short range.

I guess the reasoning is your increased mobility and your (slightly) higher HP pool but I don't think those factors fully counter the disadvantage of that truly short range.
So to me there's an imbalance between the risk and the reward.

Even with good positioning you are a much bigger/easier target than other ranged classes without the payoff being proportional to that drawback I think.

I can live with having shorter range than other ranged classes but imo it could be more than we have now.
It's barely above melee whereas with bard, mch and casters I can stand miles away.

At the end of the day I still am a ranged classes and I would like my kit to reflect that.
Right now I really feel like a slippery melee.