Her Beloved is Bahamut, the non primal one that we have never seen outside artwork, we could guess Primal Bahamut might be a 1 for 1 but we can't say for certain at this point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilenya
Tiamat is remaining put unless someone forces her out, her mindset is set in stone that she needs to eternally repent for summoning Primal Bahamut in her grief, there is no way anyone can convince her given how long she has put herself through what she has.
If Tiamat returns, it is by force, she will not leave her 'captivity' willingly, an act like that is not something we traditionally do more like a villain thing especially when we have just left her there for 2 wars and a shard world hopping.
question about Taimat the dragon at Aza Lla
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08-20-2020, 08:22 AMCrushnight
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08-20-2020, 01:15 PMJojoya
YoshiP did warn us in the live letter than we may want to start brushing up on our HW lore - and that lore heavily involved the dragon broods.
If we end up going to Meracydia and discover some threat involving the brood Tiamat left behind, especially if that threat was somehow related to her pact with the Ascians, I could see her releasing herself to go deal with it as another form of atonement.
There's also Midgardsormr's pact with Hydaelyn. He and the eggs he carried were given sanctuary in exchange for protecting whatever lies under Silvertear Falls. He's currently at sleep to recover from the encounter with Omega. If there's a new threat to Silvertear Falls, would his children feel bound to provide that protection in his absence? If so, that could rouse Tiamat. -
08-24-2020, 11:06 PMSavagelf
I think she could be made to see we able bring end to dragon war which the Ishgard thought was impossible. we able rouse her brother to fight Nidhogg see dragon aren't as set in stone by way of they will as the claim to be.
i hope we get dragonling companion one hope Midgarsormr is get ready for his next stage of growth hehe
i miss his kind -
08-25-2020, 12:52 AMViduWhy would that matter to her? She didnt care about the Dragonsong War - keep in mind that what happend to her happend during the Third Astra Era (aka: Allagan times) which was five millenia before our time right now. I couldnt find out when excatly Tiamat was imprisoned, but I suppose its pretty save to say that it happend at least more than four millenia ago. When the Dragonsond War started, she had already stayed there for over three millenia. That war has nothing to do with her - except for the parallels between mortal men (Allag and Isgard) being cruel towards dragons.Quote:
Originally Posted by Savagelf
Given the parallel between her and her brother Nidhogg - she is consumed by grief; he was consumed by hate; both over the loss of one of their own (though it in case of Tiamat and Bahamut even more brutal, considering they were mates and how she summoned this twisted version of him - something she feels great guilt about) - you might have had a point, if we had been able to "heal" Nidhoggs grief.
But we didnt. We didnt end the war by reconciling Nidhogg with Ishgard, we ended it by slaughtering him. We're not a "solver of dragon problems", we're a solver of "problems mortals have with dragons". Why would us killing another one of her brothers change her mind about the punishment she choose? Specially after this punishment lasted over four millenia?
Its been my understanding so far that shes written in a way that no one - not even her own father, another basically immortal being, can actually grasp how deep her grief and sorrow are - so its understandble to look for "loopholes", for ideas and ways how she could be convinced otherwise. And as I mentioned before: Personally, I'd wish for her to be free and happy - but within the story I actually dont want to see that happening (unless maybe for a very, very good reason that is unrelated to someone convincing her that shes suffered enough - I could maybe accept something like Midgardsormr calling for her aid in a great time of need during a final battle against Garlemald, but even that would be a stretch).
As the story/lore stands right now, shes been there for millenia - the world has changed around her multiple times, she must have seen multiple Warriors of Light come and go (though non visiting her, obviously). She lost a sister and another brother - one whom she didnt aid in his thousand year war.
I dont see anything changing her mind - and certainly not us. We might be pretty special - but I dont consider our character to be special enough to convince her to give up on her grief after so many millenia. I repeat what I said: It would cheapen her character. It would along the lines of writing about a severly depressed character (and I mean "depression" in a clinical sense here) and have that character cured by someone saying "Have you tried being happy?"
In regards to little dragons: I recommend picking up the new custom deliveries!
In regards to companions: I'm pretty sure we're not going to see another pet-class and since they've never released a different companion other than the chocobo, I doubt we'll be seeing one there... maybe a Squadron or Trust-member one day? Though kinda unlikely aswell, probably... -
08-25-2020, 05:49 AMSavagelf
i more like companion dragonling myself this way every one can have dragonling.
was not Hraesveglr also consume by greif we able pull him out of it kick and scream as much a dragon kick and scream be it. Hraeveglr lost Shiva how did were able to get him to see there was another way if he wasn't consume by his lost
t
we have not two dragon but three
Hraesveglr consume by greif and lost of his human lover
Nidhogg consume a desire of revenger
finally Taimat consume by greif
we killed almost all the ascians and those responible for action of creation of behamut for most part
we dragged Hraesveglr out his grief and we have awake Midgsormr Tiamat maybe a challange but yet still possible she has realize she just as much pawn in ascian games as her mate was and as all ishgard were as well of dragon kind was.
killed the puppetmaster in this is big step in help her overcome her grief and help realize that she can be free of aswell help Hraesveglr -
08-25-2020, 05:53 AMJennahQuote:
Originally Posted by Savagelf
Bad news, OP... -
08-25-2020, 10:50 AMDyvidI wouldn't worry too much. She is a hanging plot point for whenever the story requires.Quote:
Originally Posted by Savagelf
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08-25-2020, 06:21 PMViduI dare to say that Hraesvelgrs situation with Shiva was a bit different - they both knew the whole time that she would die, so she requested to be devoured by him and now their souls are bound to each other. Apparently this bound with Shiva is the only thing that keeps Hraesvelgr from joining Nidhogg in his pursuit to wipe Ishgard out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Savagelf
Its not so much us who are responsible, its Shiva (not the primal, but the real elezen - what Ysayle is summoning is not his beloved).
Tiamat on the other hand lost her brother and mate who could have been with her til the end of time - and more so: She is the one responsible for summoning him as a primal! (Even though she was tricked by the Ascians, shes still blaming herself - maybe for the summoning, maybe for believing them, probably for both).
Yes, and we helped neither dragon - not Nidhogg, not Hraesvelgr.Quote:
Originally Posted by Savagelf
Hraesvelgr is not consumed by grief, not in the same way as Tiamat is - or in the same way as Nidhogg is consumed by rage. Just to repeat what I just stated: He didnt lose his elezen lover, he devoured her and now her soul is always with him - and he did so at her request, because they both knew that they couldnt be together forever otherwise.
This bond is what keeps him from falling into a similar rage than Nidhogg.
...and even if we did manage to "help" Hraesvelgr (at least Ysayle must have said something to him to convince him to help us): We utterly failed when it comes to Nidhogg. And not only we, Hraesvelgr too. Consumed by his rage, blinded by his rage, Nidhogg was not able to see things differently.
So yes, we have three dragons:
Hraesvelgr who is "stable" through his bound to Shiva.
Nidhogg who is so consumed by his rage that the only solution was to kill him - after even Hraesvelgr failed to convince him to change his ways.
And Tiamat who is so consumed by her grief that not even her own father could convince her that shes suffered enough and who remains in Azys Lla.
So far we did not nothing that would qualify us to free her after all the millenia shes spend there - I believe you were on the right track before, when you said that maybe her mate could. But since Bahamut is dead and summoning him as a primal is part of her misery, I'm not sure how that could work - maybe if we find a way to summon his actual spirit or something like that, if thats even possible...
She knows she was a pawn. She knows that the Ascians used her and tricked her.Quote:
Originally Posted by Savagelf
I mean, she isnt staying there out of fear and she doesnt seek revenge - I dont think dead Ascians really make a big difference to her, since shes still blaming herself for the summoning. Killing the Ascians wont undo that - and it wont bring Bahamut back either. She still did the horrible thing she blames herself for - even if the people who orchestrated it are gone.
I dont see how killing the Ascians is helping her - unless I missed some new dialouge she has where she comments on us wiping them out (I'll check on her later...).
...again... I'd be really upset if they just waved millenia of (personal) grief and suffering by having us appear on the screen. The only way I see her go "free" is by order of Midgardsormr whos calling for her aid. (Or by someone setting her free by killing her.) -
08-25-2020, 07:58 PMVyrerus
As far as Tiamat goes, I think she's long overdue for having the Garleans bungle with her.
Also, I view her as a plot hole, since Thordan was in Azys Lla to gain more power, you'd think he'd have taken an easy score of more First Brood Eyes. She probably wouldn't have resisted. -
08-25-2020, 09:03 PMIscahI don't think so. She's keeping herself locked there out of penance, so if anything she really doesn't want to be complicit in creating further tragedy by letting her power fall into mortal hands.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vyrerus
As for the general conversation of whether there'd be any chance of rousing her to action? The only way I could see it happen is to prevent something that would be a greater affront to the true Bahamut's memory. And then she still might go straight back to Azys Lla and figure out how to get herself back into the shackles.