Slight buffs to WAR

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Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

What exactly is the point of making it grant 8 seconds worth of Eye? To have it up for the 3 GCDs your're going to spend re-applying it right after you pull, anyways? All pulling with Onslaught does is annoy your DPS and Healers, not sure why this is requested so much. Besides that it's going to clip your first GCD. It's why we always use oGCDs after a GCD.

It doesn't "unclunk" Onslaught because it's not clunked right now. You can already pull with tomahawk or provoke or overpower. Why do we need a 4th pull option?

People need to cling on to something more exciting than small changes to Onslaught. All SE is actually likely to do is copy the other gap closers and then we all lose.

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The point of the 8 sec eye buff is mostly to make packs smoother in dungeons. Then you don't have to do the eye combo. There have been a lot of posts complaining that we have to do our eye combo while aoeing.

And, Onslaught is clunky, in that it only works in combat. Staring at a mob, hit Onslaught, nothing happens? It is a poorly designed ability that doesn't work intuitively. It's hamstrung by SE because they didn't anticipate the problems that occurred with generating gauge out of combat in SB.

We can literally pull with all our abilities, what's your point? It is vastly inferior to pulling with Onslaught, thematically. Fun factor. Only a tiny amount of players care about slight clipping of your first hit, or high end raiding and minmaxing in general. This would however be a great QoL change for dungeons and open world. And no one is going to force you to pull with Onslaught if you don't want to :p

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Originally Posted by Inuk9

Why?

I mean, it is that hard to NOT press a buttom during Inner release?

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IKR, but my eyes do not deceive me. The amount of "I'm gonna do big d*** damage AARRGHHH" I've seen... No desk is hard enough.

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Originally Posted by Rhyn

And, Onslaught is clunky, in that it only works in combat. Staring at a mob, hit Onslaught, nothing happens? It is a poorly designed ability that doesn't work intuitively. It's hamstrung by SE because they didn't anticipate the problems that occurred with generating gauge out of combat in SB.

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There's a whole lot of abilities that don't work outside combat, most of them for good reason. The fact it's not a DPS gain to use on cooldown should at least illuminate the idea that you don't need to use it it everytime it's available. How is an ability that you don't even need to use on cooldown clunky at all? You don't have to use it if you don't want to. So then the real problem is that it doesn't work for what you want to use it for. That doesn't mean the ability in and of itself is clunky or broken.

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Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

There's a whole lot of abilities that don't work outside combat, most of them for good reason. The fact it's not a DPS gain to use on cooldown should at least illuminate the idea that you don't need to use it it everytime it's available. How is an ability that you don't even need to use on cooldown clunky at all? You don't have to use it if you don't want to. So then the real problem is that it doesn't work for what you want to use it for. That doesn't mean the ability in and of itself is clunky or broken.

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It hurt my eyes to see people having to point out the obvious like this gentleman.

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Reasoning: Makes it crystal clear that Upheaval is a dps gain and should be used always when possible,

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- Upheaval: TBH, don't think that's really necessary. OTOH WAR needs slight potency buff either way, so they can as well push the potency here up.
- Nascent: suggestion is nice - even one line direct target macros are so unreliable it hurts.

TBH I wouldn't mind something similar for shirk (pass threat always to 2nd target on the list - is there even a legitimate other use of that skill than passing to the 2nd party member ?).

- Onslaught: I wouldn't remove its gauge cost. There isn't much (anything actually) left from keeping your gauge high like in 4.x, so at least dumping it to 0 should punish people with lack of gap closer when they actually need it. The skill literally screams "use me if it saves you gcd".


Other than that, what I would like to see:

- return crit bonus for keeping gauge high; wtf did they remove it is anyone's guess
- more varied/subtle rotation
- slight potency buff across the board as it's evident from fflogs

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Originally Posted by Rhyn

And, Onslaught is clunky, in that it only works in combat.

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Not to fan the flames, but it occurred to me last night - Onslaught isn't even locked out of combat. If you have left over gauge you can Onslaught into combat all you like.

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Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

Not to fan the flames, but it occurred to me last night - Onslaught isn't even locked out of combat. If you have left over gauge you can Onslaught into combat all you like.

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Yup. All tyese solo questing requests are kinda moot. You just cant use it when you enter a zone. But just like in dungeons you can charge to the boss if you saved 20 gauge after the trash pack. It ties up rather nicely with trying to maintain eye between packs if the timer is getting low just charge in and extend it again.

Gaining gauge out of combat is ENTIRELY off the table or were back to 2 min pulls (infuriate twice, wait 2 min for them to recharge. Lol. No.) That se intentionally deleted for basically everyone. And making it free just turns it into a dps ogcd spam button which is really silly. The other proposals for elaborate work arounds. (Regen 20 gauge out of combat but no more. Onslaught is free out of combat but reverts in combat and all this other stuff) are far to much ado about nothing. You cant enter a zone and charge. Oh no. But at any other point you can.

Its really not a big deal.

As for the eye stuff. Try this in the next snoozefest dungeon. Make a minigame. Apply eye on the 1st pack and see if you can prevent it from falling off for the entire dungeon without reapplying (aside from bosses). You might he surprised what you can get away with. All the "eye is only worth apying if you fight for x seconds etc" math are kinda moot if its up for 20 min. Instead of complaining about it, see how much you can fix it yourself via better play 1st. You might surprise yourself.

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Originally Posted by Izsha

As for the eye stuff. Try this in the next snoozefest dungeon. Make a minigame. Apply eye on the 1st pack and see if you can prevent it from falling off for the entire dungeon without reapplying (aside from bosses). You might he surprised what you can get away with. All the "eye is only worth apying if you fight for x seconds etc" math are kinda moot if its up for 20 min. Instead of complaining about it, see how much you can fix it yourself via better play 1st. You might surprise yourself.

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Yea I already have been. It's not that much more effort, although I've still had a few situations where I wasn't paying attention and had it fall off after IR bursting. Need to make sure it has around 20 sec remaining before that, sometimes just too much unga in my bunga.

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Originally Posted by Izsha

Yup. All tyese solo questing requests are kinda moot. You just cant use it when you enter a zone. But just like in dungeons you can charge to the boss if you saved 20 gauge after the trash pack. It ties up rather nicely with trying to maintain eye between packs if the timer is getting low just charge in and extend it again.

Gaining gauge out of combat is ENTIRELY off the table or were back to 2 min pulls (infuriate twice, wait 2 min for them to recharge. Lol. No.) That se intentionally deleted for basically everyone. And making it free just turns it into a dps ogcd spam button which is really silly. The other proposals for elaborate work arounds. (Regen 20 gauge out of combat but no more. Onslaught is free out of combat but reverts in combat and all this other stuff) are far to much ado about nothing. You cant enter a zone and charge. Oh no. But at any other point you can.

Its really not a big deal.

As for the eye stuff. Try this in the next snoozefest dungeon. Make a minigame. Apply eye on the 1st pack and see if you can prevent it from falling off for the entire dungeon without reapplying (aside from bosses). You might he surprised what you can get away with. All the "eye is only worth apying if you fight for x seconds etc" math are kinda moot if its up for 20 min. Instead of complaining about it, see how much you can fix it yourself via better play 1st. You might surprise yourself.

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Izsha, it really isnt possible to keep eye up at all times in a dungeon. Moreover, it is less to do with the warriors capabilities than dungeon design and other factors. In situations where, for example, you finish a boss and get to an area where you need to transition and load into a new zone or you fall off a cliff, it shaves precious seconds off eye. And if the healer decides to dawdle for just a few secs to check drops, you may lose eye.

So no, eye IS clunky and mythril tempest should just apply it. 10 secs.

Like i said before, prior to shb, wars didnt have an aoe combo, and overpower was used to just grab hate. After which youd apply eye and continue to use ur combos until you have enough rage to hit decimate.

Unless im missing something here and it wss more beneficial to keep spamming overpower even though you werent generating rage from it and you were without eye.

Now, we do have an aoe combo. The clunkiness comes in where you dont have eye, and you have to use overpower and mythril tempest to grab hate, GO BACK to eye combo, then GO BACK to overpower and mythril tempest.

And like I said, it is not possible to keep eye up at all times in a dungeon. And in overworld hunts, you pretty much have to reapply eye with stormseye every new hunt.

It is annoying. It is clunky. Why not judt have mythril tempest apply eye for 10 seconds instead of pushing players to just "git gud" when that isn't even the problem.

As for onslaught and rage cost, yes everyone knows that rage persists until you leave a zone and that you could keep onslaught up and ready for use if you keep at least 20 rage available.

It's annoying though, which is why it's a qol request and not something anyone thinks is manadatory for the job to function.

As for onslaught serving as a guage managment tool, I think it's clunky to have a movement action tied to the separate function of guage management just as how its clunky to tie a movement action to dps. A better design would be to either create a new guage managment tool/action or adjust upheaval to better function as one as dps and guage management pair better than movement and guage management or movement and dps.