Celests opinion bout the state of tanks

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Originally Posted by kidalutz

Uh huh yup because you know nobody would get pissy when the tank never left sheild stance just so they could keep aggro if they hit for 2/3rds less damage yup alright.. moving on.

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How is it different from just staying in Sword oath all the time?

You realize in this current state of the game, even if tanks took a straight up 20% damage nerf, all that changes is that the main tank doesn't get to enjoy the opener, because they'd have to stay in tank stance longer.

That's it. That's the only difference. They'd otherwise play functionally the same.

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Originally Posted by CelestaRosa

this is my opinion. don't have share my opinion. don't have like my opinion. but know nothing you say or do is gonna make me change my opinion. if don't like that tough

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Stopped reading around here. Go find somewhere else to make your echo chamber lol.

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Originally Posted by Novak_04

TL;DR: WoW's tanks play like "this" and I think FFXIV's tanks should also play like "this." kthx

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Thats just it though, wows tanks dont play like this either. If you are playing a tank in any mmo and you are able to do basic tank roll things then dps is always the next thing to go for. Funny thing is BFA changed how much threat tanks generate and people lost their minds, even though the difference was marginal at best.

Good tank will always look for more dps.
Good Dps will always look for more dps.
Good healers will always look for more dps.
This is how it should be and the only thing that would change if ops idea was implemented is how much worse the bad tanks would be.

I can't even understand this. Thank god for those who can. Also, OP has a habit of making these kinds of posts. Seeing as their main is whm, I don't really think they know what they are talking about, tbh.

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Originally Posted by Aurelius2625

I can't even understand this. Thank god for those who can. Also, OP has a habit of making these kinds of posts. Seeing as their main is whm, I don't really think they know what they are talking about, tbh.

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You dont need to know they are a whm main to see they dont know what they are talking about. Each poorly thought out thread (of which they're are dozens regurgitating the same terrible ideas) is enough to confirm they dont know what they are talking about. Main class has nothing to do with this. The complete unwillingness to discuss anything will lead to locked in dogmatic sounding broken records like OPs post spam. "If people dont agree with me, make another thread until they do" is pretty ridiculous at this point.

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Originally Posted by Izsha

You dont need to know they are a whm main to see they dont know what they are talking about. Each poorly thought out thread (of which they're are dozens regurgitating the same terrible ideas) is enough to confirm they dont know what they are talking about. Main class has nothing to do with this. The complete unwillingness to discuss anything will lead to locked in dogmatic sounding broken records like OPs post spam. "If people dont agree with me, make another thread until they do" is pretty ridiculous at this point.

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They're just one of many that romaticise the holy trinity and go to the extreme on it. Healers should heal. Tanks should do nothing but absorb damage. DD DPS.
It's a very old fashioned view of MMOs and even RPGs in general.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

They're just one of many that romaticise the holy trinity and go to the extreme on it. Healers should heal. Tanks should do nothing but absorb damage. DD DPS.
It's a very old fashioned view of MMOs and even RPGs in general.

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Yeah, at some point, developers realized that the incredible shortage of tanks and healers could be reduced by making tanks and healers (underplayed roles) have something in common with the overplayed roles (dps). It's not rocket science. Most people dont like to stand there and get beat in the face for 3 hours on raid static night or spam heals on their dps standing in fire. 1st blamed of things go wrong. No glory of things go right.

The trinity is dying off or being toned down in every game. Mmos, mobas, overwatch for crying out loud. Ffxiv is actually one of the most traditional trinity games that is successful. This is as good as it gets for mainstream trinity games in 2019.

If you like the fantasy of the immobile wall tank and healer only healer, you are simply the minority and business is abandoning you because the only thing catering to that playerbase gives is long cue times and lower sub numbers.

If you truly want an old school trinity experience you are relegated to smaller niche games because that is what this mindset has become. A niche. Making more threads wont make a minority viewpoint mainstream.

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Originally Posted by Kalise

Personally, I'm not too sold on Tanks being purely about personal damage output though... I've posited that it could be interesting to utilize a FFXIII style Stagger mechanic for tanks, where they work towards creating party DPS increases instead of focusing entirely on personal damage (It would still play a factor, but wouldn't be the only thing)

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I like this idea a lot. Don't have tanks so much focused on DPS as working through a rotation to add party utility. Maybe some debuffs, maybe some buffs, but some way that tanks help the party do damage rather than focusing on doing personal DPS (though obviously still need some personal dps).

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Originally Posted by CelestaRosa

3. no more damage skills no please. idea of being tank is be your teams sheild tank damage over them reducing it supporting them every see bits. while contributating to small abounts of dps

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I like how this quote goes so well with this one

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Originally Posted by CelestaRosa

cause well warrior. always been warrior. their always this primary focus on damage

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Originally Posted by Kaedan

I like this idea a lot. Don't have tanks so much focused on DPS as working through a rotation to add party utility. Maybe some debuffs, maybe some buffs, but some way that tanks help the party do damage rather than focusing on doing personal DPS (though obviously still need some personal dps).

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Yeah, personally, I thought it could be interesting if Tank Stance vs DPS Stance was more like Commando Stance vs Ravager Stance. Wherein the Tank that's actively tanking is using Commando Stance to utilize reactive skills that set up the ability to stack Stagger, while maximizing personal DPS output and Stagger generation, whereas the Tank that doesn't have something to tank at that moment in time will shift into Ravager Stance to work on stacking up the Stagger as well as personal DPS.

Then when the boss is Staggered, both Tanks go into Ravager Stance and go full damage, along with everyone else in the party.

That way you still get the ability for Tanks to play better and get the returns (Higher pDPS, faster Stagger generation meaning more tDPS) without them being entirely focused on personal DPS and getting complaints around doing too much damage or never caring about alternate stances.

Especially if both stances had their own ways of boosting pDPS, for example, Commando Stance has reactive skills that are good damage (Think of things like Shield Swipe being buffed, Blood Price and TBN being more potent, Vengeance's retaliation being a thing etc) while Ravager Stance has more focus on just smacking things more gooder (So for example, better MP gain from Blood Weapon/Syphon Strike/Riot Blade, stronger Bloodspiller/Holy Spirit, use of Fell Cleave etc) with both stances having similar DPS, but done in a different way - Creating a shift in playstyle between the stances instead of "This Stance makes you better" vs "This Stance makes you worse" of the current DPS vs Tank stances...