Class => Job => ???

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Originally Posted by Gravton

I'm in favor of removing classes, but my only concern would be my lvl. Only drk, mch, ast, rdm, and sam are jobs. The rest was spent lvling a class I.e. Always getting gladiator xp and never getting pld xp. I don't want to re-lvl anything so if the Xp can be transferred I'd be ok with it.

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They'll simply change the names and nothing else. Think of it like how the job tab in our character menu now lists actually jobs once unlocked instead of the classes.

Anywho, they will never implement branching jobs/classes because it's essentially developing a whole new job. Why have a Machinist who can be a healer when you can just design an actual Chemist to be said healer? That is how FFXIV handles class deviation. You simply switch to another one entirely.

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Originally Posted by kupokage

VIT wasn't calculated into Tank damage until later in the patches, right? Im genuinely asking.

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VIT became the damage dealing stat for tanks in Heavensward. They opted to change it back to STR with Stormblood as they didn't want tanks to take both a damage and HP loss when dealing with the revive debuff. Or take less of a loss by not losing damage output from the VIT not getting a debuff. It was much simpler to just revert back to the ARR method, and Tenacity was supposed to make up the difference (it doesn't.)

This loss of DPS for tanks lead to some heated debates on the forums and reddit as some felt like they needed to stack STR accessories, despite the cut that puts in their survivability. SE eventually stepped in, promising all new Tank gear will have more STR and that the new Tenacity stat will get scaled better.

As for the thread subject, as someone who heavily plays both SCH and SMN, no. I really don't think SE should do another branching job. While the new system of replacing old skill with their stronger potency upgrades relieved some of the job's balancing issues, there are still multible issues on each.

Physic being essentially useless to SMN despite being their only heal is a good example. Because it scales off of Mind, it can get some use for a SCH as the lowbie heal (cure 1/benefic 1 as it were), but since SMN is primarily INT, and caster gear never has Mind, it's basically the healing equivalent of kissing a boo-boo.

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Originally Posted by Gravton

I'm in favor of removing classes, but my only concern would be my lvl. Only drk, mch, ast, rdm, and sam are jobs. The rest was spent lvling a class I.e. Always getting gladiator xp and never getting pld xp. I don't want to re-lvl anything so if the Xp can be transferred I'd be ok with it.

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It's only renaming classes as job for most, except arcanist. With slight work editing the job quests.
I'm okay with removing too. Maybe they can work out solution for SMN and SCH separate someday.

On a lore standpoint they really can't remove classes just like that because of how ARR jobs connect to them but I get it, nobody actually cares about the lore.
I don't see a point in removing them either since it changes nothing but names.

Also, I don't see the point of separating SMN and SCH anymore since they each have their own job skills/traits to go for and level 50 content is long obsolete to even care. Bonus attributes also don't exist anymore.

Separating sch and smn would be easy. Just make smn a job that starts at 30. Like the HW jobs. Wouldn't break lore or need quest re-writes.

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Originally Posted by dinnertime

On a lore standpoint they really can't remove classes just like that because of how ARR jobs connect to them but I get it, nobody actually cares about the lore.

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I think more do care about the lore but the ones that don't will voice there opinion the loudest to make it changed.

Honestly with the way they changed some things this expansion with the traits I don't see it as an issue anymore to keep going on about classes staying in the game.

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Originally Posted by dinnertime

On a lore standpoint they really can't remove classes just like that because of how ARR jobs connect to them but I get it, nobody actually cares about the lore.

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SMN and SCH would require separate lores entirely. Should be left alone until they have foundation for both but the rest, is there something we're missing?
It's not like we never see our class shifu/guildmaster anymore, progressing just shift more advanced teachers and weapons.

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Originally Posted by bass9020

Honestly with the way they changed some things this expansion with the traits I don't see it as an issue anymore to keep going on about classes staying in the game.

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Yeah, but it seems like a nonsensical effort to me. So far people just want it gone because it's a relic of the past.

Although...do people still play high-level content as classes? Then that would be a good reason to get rid of them.

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Originally Posted by dinnertime

On a lore standpoint they really can't remove classes just like that because of how ARR jobs connect to them but I get it, nobody actually cares about the lore.

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I very much care about the lore, which is why I think the whole thing is shaky as-is.

Thaumaturge was about manipulating the energies within and tailored around status effects, buffs/debuffs, etc.
Conjurer was essentially described as an elementalist.*
Then they introduced jobs and, seemingly for purely aesthetic reasons, decided Thaumaturge should become Black Mage and Conjurer should become White Mage, forcing them to become an elementalist and a healer respectively.
*I see the official description now has a bit about conjurers being healers as well. I don't recall reading that bit in the early 1.X era, but I could be wrong; was that always there?

Arcanist is just a mess where half of the class isn't especially supported by their lore, and the other half is just something that they just claim as being a natural extension of their focus/field, but which... logically doesn't seem to be.
Then you go into Summoner which half-assed the summons to give us EGIs and then went out of its way to justify why it couldn't give more EGIs in a lame fashion (Ramuh EGI shouldn't intrinsically be more taxing than Ifrit EGI since a primal's power is entirely random and fluctuates between summonings), and had to drag Allag back into the mix (Tired of Allag for one. And they work better as an 'Old Garlemald' with more focus paid to the Magiteck rather than looking at acual Magicks, IMO).
And Scholar where... You're a scholar because you have a rock and a Faerie. You don't research anything. You don't study anything. The most scholarly thing you do is go someplace your told to and bring back the rock/urn/whatever you've been told to find. But you have a Faerie and act like a medic so... scholar?

Then there's Machinist where, as a player in-game put it recently 'you don't even make any of your own stuff'. Some dude hands you some turrets and additional gadgets and you just use them. Granted, I have issues with trying to force gunner and engineer into one job with no other paths for people that just want one of the two, but you're not even a proper engineer. :-(

Then there's Bard. They technically explain that one, but I still find it a cop-out (especially when Thancred still calls himself a Bard).

This is all on the nose.

Tanaka decided FFXIV needed it's own version of the job system with totally unique jobs in their attempts to separate FFXIV from FFXI. When Yoshi-P stepped in, these new classes not aligning with the beloved jobs of FF canon was one of the first bits of 1.0 weirdness brought up.

So, they just looked at which class could most easily be "upgraded" into a FF job and went from there. In fact, arcanist was in 1.0 as a not yet implemented class option. I guess they felt like this trend was required in 2.x as they made Rouge/Ninja the same way way, breaking the hearts of players dreaming of a Theif class the world over.

Just, please, based Yoshi-P, make Geomancer playable in 5.0 or earlier. Please.