So why play this one? It's built for a player to do everything themselves. Only dungeons and raiding require more people. Raiding is such a small portion of this game I don't even know why they bother with it, it's not fun content 90% of the time. Dungeons are nearly in the same boat because of fates, which can be quicker to level up with depending on certain circumstances. Honestly you beat one raid boss you beat them all given how badly they seem to follow the exact same format of burning adds and learning patterns. Give me more raids like Steps of Faith prenurf and then maybe I'll change my views.Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxyAreku
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03-08-2016, 07:16 PMJetstream_Fox
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03-08-2016, 07:24 PMBHGlobbd
I like the idea of it being similar to Diadem, but it doesn't have to become irrelevant with the next patch/ilvl increase. What if this zone was vertically large, divided into tiers based on the patch cycle, these upper tiers are locked until the next patch. When the patch hits the next tier opens with new bosses that drop the new ilvl. The previous tiers are now still relevant.
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03-08-2016, 08:42 PMBubblyBoar
Diadem will be getting updates like every all other content. It just comes on odd numbered patches instead of even numbered ones.
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03-08-2016, 08:49 PMStanelisPeople are not interested in the diadem because it is plain dull and boring (you basically had to bash mobs in order for monsters to spasn), and flawed on a game design standpoint. I can hardly call that exploration. Exploration cannot take place in an instance where you have to enter with 7 people, with a hard timer, with no real points of interest. The diadem are merely floating rocks in the sky, you can hardly find that compelling and interesting as an exploration field.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor
Give us an interesting maze in which you d have to explore in order to find interesting bosses (and even maybe with puzzles to get to some parts of the maze), and that will be what exploration is.
Assuming most of the dedicated raiders are still playing FFXIV, which is a long shot. I no longer bother with raiding in FFXIV because it is just boring.Quote:
If you question actual raiders, I suspect very few will complain beyond asking for more fights.
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03-08-2016, 08:52 PMMerleSirlos
But it depends on how you look at the content. The entire Coil was one big area (you end up in the same room once you finish each of them) made of three big corridors leading to the center where you get to fight the final boss once you cleared all three corridors bosses. In the end it ends up as how they come out. Do you want the dev team to give you everything at the same time and then nothing for a year? Or do you prefer to cut it in parts and have multiple entry points that are basically just "save points" but you get a new one every 3 months?
another point is accessibility. Like someone mentioned, doing a raid that is too big and takes too much time to complete will keep people away from it. You could find a way around it by saving your progress but then you can't farm a specific boss if you want to. The way FFXIV handles it makes sense from that point of view, coil and Alexander are one big raid each with several rooms and bosses that are connected. But you choose which one you want to do when they are on df and have a saved progression when it's freshly released. That way everyone can do it at his own pace. -
03-08-2016, 08:55 PMStanelisYou re saying that assuming raids should be linear. Which they really don't have to be. Also, the idea that all there is to raid should be farming bosses show how dull the genre become.Quote:
Originally Posted by MerleSirlos
Also, there are ways to save progression in a linear raid (see world of warcraft).
Raid isn't only about bosses or trash mobs. But most people forgot what a RPG was since blizzard took world of warcraft away from the RPG genre, during WOTLK, in 2009-2010. Resulting in the production of flawed MMORPG for years, no wonder the popularity of the genre is quickly decreasing. -
03-08-2016, 09:12 PMMerleSirlosI'm not saying raid is only farming bosses, just that it is for some people and you need to be careful not to take it out for them too.Quote:
Originally Posted by MerleSirlos
My favorite turns in coil were 2 and 3, 2 because you had to choose a path depending on your party composition and 3 beacause I had a lot of fun in there.
And I agree with you that it doesn't need to be linear. But people are lazy and will always follow the most efficient part. So even if you make something non-linear and someone finds out there is one way that does it the fastest (even by less than a minute in an hour long run), at least 90% of the people will follow that path making your non linear dungeon/raid/whatever it is a linear one because of the players. -
03-08-2016, 09:24 PMWarlyxyet i still think ulduar has been the best raid in the last years....both thematically and with interesting mechanics with a HUGE ZONE , lots of bosses , its has a train even !Quote:
Originally Posted by Stanelis
http://www.blogcdn.com/wow.joystiq.c...duar-train.jpg -
03-08-2016, 09:25 PMStanelisThat's only because, in FFXIV, everything revolves around repeating something a very large amount of time. Maybe people would be in less of a hurry if the replay value of the content was better and didn't require so much farm.Quote:
But people are lazy and will always follow the most efficient part.
WOTLK was great thematically (including ulduar), but wow started to go downhill from that point. Like ToC was utter garbage and in ICC only a few bosses were interesting (the last from the wings, and arthas). Also, ulduar wasn't linear.Quote:
yet i still think ulduar has been the best raid in the last years....both thematically and with interesting mechanics with a HUGE ZONE , lots of bosses , its has a train even !
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03-08-2016, 09:27 PMMilesSaintboroguhThen it wouldn't be an MMORPG then. People would get everything done then unsub until next patch.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stanelis