Extreme loss of humanity

My advice to you OP is a realisation I came too recently, also in regards in the extreme primals.

We are what? 2 weeks since the patch and therefor the majority (but not all) of the players queing up for the hardest content in the game are not going to be pleasant. They are dedicated at best, elitist and obnoxious at worse. It was the same not long after launch with Titan HM and getting relics, only if you go and join a group now going for their first relic you will generally find a much nicer crowd than you would have back then.

It sounds to me like you're not part of that hardcore crowd, just like me, and so the best thing to do is dial it back a little. I have done so and am having a much better time. Think about EX content in a month or two and I bet you will find your groups much more accommodating.

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Originally Posted by cotti

I don't think there's any way to make current trials work with a pre-dungeon.

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There's tons of way to make it work because they did so in most other FF games where you fought Summons with a few exceptions. Hell, even in FFXI if you weren't a summoner and did mini-avatars, you had to go through a respective dungeon to reach the avatar fight because you had to get to crystal that houses the avatar (in most regards) or through certain other dungeons where they were previously released (Einherjar - Odin, Undersea Ruins - Alexander, Pso`Xja - Diabolos and Fullmoon Fountain - Fenrir.)

Previous FF games did even so much as a small puzzle or set of puzzles, very rarely did you just get off your airship, go inside of a cave and fight a main summon lol, especially in the later FF games. So the only way it won't work is if Yoshi keeps developing this game where "accessibility" means nothing to "stress the player."

I'll bite and try to point out the other side of the argument.

First off, if a group is demanding experience and you can't fulfill their requirements, don't join it. It's that simple. Joining a group that clearly states something like "3 deaths = kick", then complaining after you die 3 times and get kicked is like buying bread then complaining it tastes like bread.

"Oh, but then how will I learn the fight?"

Create a group and clearly state this is a group for newcomers that are learning the fight. Trust me, it will get filled fast. It filled when I did for all 3 EX Primals for my initial runs, and helped me get that stress free learning experience. People died to the most stupid shit and no one complained. That's because all them knew it was and agreed to join a learning run.

With that said, let's now also mention why people want experience and some even demand a fail free party: That's because once you practiced enough that you never even get hit before X happens, it's absolutely USELESS to run the fight all over again when the group is wiping before X happens.

Using Titan EX, if you consistently reach adds phase before dying, it makes no sense for you to stay on a group which has players still learning how to dodge the first triple landslide. You're not gaining ANY experience on what you actually require. You can wipe for hours and not get one inch closer to the win, and then you will still wipe groups that actually reach the adds phase because all the time you spent on a weaker group means you never actually practiced that part.

"Oh, but don't you play games for fun?"

Of course we do. Do you think it's fun to lose for hours without you actually never dying once? I don't think it is. You say that people shouldn't complain about losing their time, well, I ask you: Why shouldn't they? It -is- a pure loss of time to keep losing for no fault of their own. Unless the group got some synergy they are actually having fun even during multiple wipes (and this most likely will only happen with groups of friends, ls / fc mates and the like), you are effectively wasting your time away for every time the group dies because someone else ate a landslide.

It makes perfect sense from a personal point of view to only join groups / want people that are close to your experience level.

"But some people have lag"

If it's so bad that it affects them negatively, they might want to reconsider playing an online game on the first place, I'm sorry. Yes, some people have lag especifically only on this game, that can happen, but again, they might want to reconsider playing this one if it's so bad and out of their control. It's not their fault, true, but it's also not other player's fault that YOU have connection issues with FFXIV. It's unfortunate, but you have to understand you are affecting seven other people's fun. Again, I repeat, it's not fun to lose for hours, especially when said losses aren't even your fault.

"Ok, but do people really have to be so agressive and impolite?"

No, of course not. There's a difference between playing to win on a competent group and being an asshole. Being an asshole is bad. Politely setting up your expectations for a group prior to it and removing members that fail without shitting on them is not bad and should not be viewed as bad behaviour.

I'm sorry, but by the time people are at Extreme Modes and Turn 5 and whatnot, you shouldn't be running these things with strangers anymore. You've had plenty of time to find people who work to your play style, who you mesh well with, and can coordinate fights of this caliber with that you can be running things with.

Right here, this is why I cant understand these 5 person FC groups. Its forcing you to pug, pug EX primals at that *shudder*. Join a good FC, work with your fellow players to get that Primal down with a bit of work. And then proceed to farm it. So many people are bitching about these pug groups being a nightmare and I have to ask why are you playing a MMO if you just pug everything?

And OP, if you dont want to watch a video something is wrong with you. I expect everyone to have done that. Dont join a random group and expect them to carry you, and thats what not being prepared is saying. Im to lazy to watch a 10 minute video on youtube, everyone carry me!

What cracks me up are those "the fight is so easy" people. Well sure it is once you have watched a video over and over again. Why not enjoy the game for yourself and try the fight yourself? If you keep failing then maybe turn to a video instead of using it as part of your gameplay experience and then telling someone they are a noob for not watching a video? Seems to me if those players were so good they would not need to watch a video at all. I myself can watch a video but like most do not retain it and need to do it to learn. So I die a lot, at least I'm learning the fight mechanic and not having it handed to me through a video tutorial.

*Reads thread over...

Yes, lets make a game where we are all about a flexible class and craft system, and then when we get to end game toss the entire idea out of the window! Why?! Just... WHY?!

*Continues to pound head into nearby wall.

If I keep pounding my head into a wall, it might eventually make sense!

Anyway, TC. The simplest solution to your problem would probably be farming Humanity on rats in the depths.

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Originally Posted by Ruri

This is the only part I can understand requiring you to do before joining a group. Why not watch a video of what you're about to get into so you can have a basic idea of what to expect? It helps when people are trying to explain the fight if you see the steps visually as well.

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Because this isn't my job, it's a game, it's supposed to be fun. I do my work at well, work, and I'm paying to have fun not to study so I don't disappoint someones egomaniacal gaming precondition.

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Originally Posted by Autumnfire

I'm sorry, but by the time people are at Extreme Modes and Turn 5 and whatnot, you shouldn't be running these things with strangers anymore. You've had plenty of time to find people who work to your play style, who you mesh well with, and can coordinate fights of this caliber with that you can be running things with.

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Every FC I have been in to date have all passed me up, Maybe its my age or since I am American who the hell knows im just a white guy with tattoos and a temper when messed with, But I enjoy my game and hone my classes very well.

I have noticed through vent and stuff there's lots of Australians for some reason a lot of them do not like white guys from the city.
I am in my 30's and I think the majority of the gaming here is 12yo to 16yo's. I'm not trying to be rude but at this time this is were I don't really care too much for a game that I once loved.