A serious discussion about abridging the story quest 1-50 (discouraging new players)

Printable View

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

06-26-2015, 06:39 AM
Madjames

Quote:

Originally Posted by Felis

Ishgardians would still tell to you : "There is nothing to see. This is our war. Now go!"

Only after you saved them twice with defeating Shiva and defending the Steps of Faith they start to trust you enough.

That does not matter anymore when someone or some thing threatens the entire world. They could say sorry go away all they want just like some countries could say it here. The elves KNEW they couldn't defeat mordor on their own so Elrond told Gandalf, so they also sided with the humans which they hated and did not trust.

The same thing could happen here and I guarantee you that it will. It also happened in mists of panderia in Wow. As well as SWTOR and countless other games and movies and books where two factions/countries who did not particularly like each other HAD to band together for the same goal of destroying something that involved something greater then just their own faction/country but the entire world. This also happened IRL with two World Wars. Ishgard can say no as much as they want but in the end, it is not fair to allow the world to defend its self and we would eventually be let in to deal with this life threatening situation by joining the Ishard people anyway. There is NO REASON why this can not happened. Lore and the story can be changed to fix this in more then just this way.

You are picking at straws here to try and justify the grueling and daunting MSQ bullcrap that should not be forced upon us players who do not care for it at all. My reasons for playing are not for the story and I should be able to level and play without such a huge timesink ON TOP of leveling a character to 50.
06-26-2015, 06:40 AM
Nightdreamer

Ishgard would open it's doors to all adventurers when all hope is lost and they need the help. There's your starting quest for the expansion.
06-26-2015, 06:47 AM
Voltyblast

As much as I might be thinking in the worst possible ways about this, I think this statement explains it all

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exotik_Legacy

If I purchased ARR and heavensward to play 1 of the 3 new classes that were advertised, and then found out I have to play a class that I want nothing to do with just to play 1 of those 3 classes, after spending all of that money Im stuck with a month of work which forces me to purchase a timecard as well just to play 1 of the 3 new classes where in my eyes thats when the game would really open up because its the class I wanted to play, I would be very upset and turned off from looking at this game.

There you have it: that's the real reason behind the gated content in my opinion, as new players won't be able to get to the expansion content in time within the free month and making them pay for another month or two if it's taking too much time.

I mean, I still hardly believe that it's for lore reasons that the expansion is gated: not even all JRPGs are that gated in terms of content (well, at least those who allow free exploration), but I think this one pretty much explains why the gating. I might be wrong on this and this might be the most pessimistic way of thinking at things, but who would gain for doing all this?

Definitely not the new player if you can catch my drift.
06-26-2015, 06:49 AM
Reinha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Madjames

. . . I have never given actual books or movies as much time to see if I liked them before shutting it off or CHOOSING to not purchase said book. . . .

You can not say that an MMORPG player does not have a right, nor should they not have a right to CHOOSE what they want to do and how they want to play a game they are paying for. If they like every other aspect of this game EXCEPT the minor small scale MSQ then we should be allowed to skip it and continue to level how WE see fit. If you do not allow us to do so then you are choosing the story huggers over MMORPG players who join this game for the MMORPG aspect no the Final Fantasy story aspect and that is wrong thinking and SE should have just made this game single player.

A game company can make the game however they like and you as a customer have every right take it or leave it. No one is forcing you to pay for this particular MMO if the Final Fantasy story doesn't appeal to you. You said it yourself with your book example. The only time I will suggest a player that they leave an MMO is when they are unhappy and with some aspect that has always been there. MSQ has gated things since level 1, so this is one of those times. If it's too different from other MMOs then go play other MMOs that you think did it right. If you "like every other aspect of this game EXCEPT the minor small scale MSQ" then just get the minor small scale thing over with and enjoy the rest of the game.

There is no formal rules about how to make an MMO and it's super arrogant of you to say that SE did it wrong just because they didn't cater to your wishes. Their playerbase is growing and that can't be said for many MMOs on the market. Thinking in the way of "it should be either a single player game or a mainstream MMO and not something in between" is very black and white.
06-26-2015, 06:58 AM
Felis

Quote:

Originally Posted by Madjames

That does not matter anymore when someone or some thing threatens the entire world. They could say sorry go away all they want just like some countries could say it here. The elves KNEW they couldn't defeat mordor on their own so Elrond told Gandalf, so they also sided with the humans which they hated and did not trust.

As Nael dropped Dalamud over Eorzea the Ishgardians still said "Not our problem. We are busy enough with dragons. Don't disturb us"
06-26-2015, 07:00 AM
odintius

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voltyblast

.

So one person who holds your views = everyone in the world who plays this game, seriously I have two friends who started and told them this and their cool with it so does that invalidate your argument or perhaps your being a bit over hyperbole on this subject not going to change anytime soon expansion already released? Also they are holding off on purchasing the expansion to see if they like the game or not first 3 new jobs isn't going to change there minds if it doesn't interest them after a few weeks but go figure people with different mindsets on gaming strange.
06-26-2015, 07:01 AM
KisaiTenshi

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exotik_Legacy

Explain to me why you think it would be ok for a brand new player to be forced through thee *324* quests to reach heavenward content if they infact purchased heavenward to play 1 of the 3 new classes. As well as forcing them to complete *Primarily 100-150 quests that tie to the actual story and the rest are all fluff when in fact by the time you reach around 180 quests your already level 50 with the current exp increases?

Those new jobs starting quests are all inside Ishgard, even if it were possible to start a new character with those jobs, the design mechanic around it is "automatically level 30", so they would in fact need their own level 1-30 storyline as if they had started ARR as that class... which for storyline reasons doesn't work. The AST's first quest is in the East Shroud, the DRK's first quest is all over Ishgard. Both of these, the first quest gives you a new Job stone. That is why they start at level 30. You only need ONE class... ANY class leveled to 50 to get these jobs. The only reason it's 50 is because that's what unlocks Ishgard. Otherwise switching the job itself, you can take DRK without having any Tank classes at level 30.

And if you got to level 50 long before completing the MSQ, then you spent way too much time grinding for no reason.

The Astral Era quests which are all level 50, still have ilevel progression attached to them, So just buying whatever the current tomes gear is gets you there with no effort.
06-26-2015, 07:04 AM
Luvbunny

Quote:

Originally Posted by Madjames

You are picking at straws here to try and justify the grueling and daunting MSQ bullcrap that should not be forced upon us players who do not care for it at all. My reasons for playing are not for the story and I should be able to level and play without such a huge timesink ON TOP of leveling a character to 50.

Why are you playing this game then? It is a huge timesink regardless. Wether doing MSQ to level up your character, which is a huge timesink, especially if you are planning to do alts. Or doing endgame dungeons grind, which is in itself is also a huge timesink. This is NOT a game to be finished in 4 days so you can be done with it. It is one to be savored, played leisurely, and just take a deep breath, explore, get lost in the world and lore, and obviously becoming a slave to these dumb NPCs who cannot save themselves from anything and everything...
06-26-2015, 07:06 AM
Calypsx

The DRK quests in general wouldn't make any sense unless you played through the story. There is a lot of dialogue that references what your character has done from 2.0-2.5.
06-26-2015, 07:14 AM
Voltyblast

Quote:

Originally Posted by odintius

So one person who holds your views = everyone in the world who plays this game, seriously I have two friends who started and told them this and their cool with it so does that invalidate your argument or perhaps your being a bit over hyperbole on this subject not going to change anytime soon expansion already released? Also they are holding off on purchasing the expansion to see if they like the game or not first 3 new jobs isn't going to change there minds if it doesn't interest them after a few weeks but go figure people with different mindsets on gaming strange.

Just to make sure of one thing here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voltyblast

As much as I might be thinking in the worst possible ways about this, I think this statement explains it all

There you have it: that's the real reason behind the gated content in my opinion, as new players won't be able to get to the expansion content in time within the free month and making them pay for another month or two if it's taking too much time.

I mean, I still hardly believe that it's for lore reasons that the expansion is gated: not even all JRPGs are that gated in terms of content (well, at least those who allow free exploration), but I think this one pretty much explains why the gating. I might be wrong on this and this might be the most pessimistic way of thinking at things, but who would gain for doing all this?

Definitely not the new player if you can catch my drift.

So no I'm saying that as 100% fact: I'm saying that as 100% opinion and opinions, as far as I recall, are subjective.

Which means that I think that's the closest thing to a reason "why" to lock the expansion In my opinion, and not just because someone said it for me: SE is a company and needs to make money and I highly doubt that they really care about the lore and story as much as they say.

Still, if I'm wrong everyone is winning, and my opinion remains just an opinion that, overall, didn't hurt anyone.

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page