Male Viera as a playable character! show your support

I really don't understand why some people are so horribly opposed to the idea of males being shorter, for once. Would some diversity hurt, from the "male=hulk, female=loli"?

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Originally Posted by Tlamila

I really don't understand why some people are so horribly opposed to the idea of males being shorter, for once. Would some diversity hurt, from the "male=hulk, female=loli"?

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Diversity for the sake of diversity isn't a particularly thrilling approach for many, especially when it involves hijacking a race that have already been described in a certain way.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Diversity for the sake of diversity isn't a particularly thrilling approach for many, especially when it involves hijacking a race that have already been described in a certain way.

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Where is the description? I genuinely want to read it because I missed it. If there's an in game description it makes sense, otherwise also wanting them bigger because "smaller males wouldn't look good" would be unifying for the sake of it.

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Originally Posted by Senn

Where did Yoshi P state this? Not because I'm doubting or anything, but because I'd like to read up on it. Or are you maybe referring to the concept art?

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Wasn’t there like a live letter or something where he casually mentioned them being tall and savage looking? Man this whole thing has gone on for so long I can’t remember right so it’s possible it was never said at all.

As far as the whole rabbits vs hares thing, it doesn’t even matter anyway since viera are hunters who eat meat. Pretty sure viera only came about because the artist of Final Fantasy Tactics Advance thought putting bunny ears on a woman was hot.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

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As far as I know, male viera were never described as being taller or shorter than female viera, so it's kind of hard to call that hijacking. Though if there's a source confirming their height in comparison to the females, I would like to see it.

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Originally Posted by MikkoAkure

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Yeah they are described as savage hunters, but Yoshi P has also described them as slim, elegant, and handsome. I have not seen him confirm whether they were taller or shorter than the females (but I don't doubt that they are tall in general). Since the females are already tall, even if the males were a little shorter than the females, they would still be considered tall.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Simple - it's how we evolved. Men by and large are physically larger and women smaller and both genders find this sexually appealing. Exceptions to this are rare. It's little to do with "double standards of gender" and more to do with what they know their playerbase tends to find appealing for each of the two genders.

That said, I view the extent of the dimorphism with Au Ra to be a mistake and I would not want to see it repeated with Viera. They can just do what they ought to have done with Au Ra females - allow for a bigger height slider that lets the men go both below and above the female height, problem solved.

Also, as was pointed out earlier in this thread, female rabbits are only "larger" to accommodate sexual reproduction, i.e. possess more body fat, but are not longer, per se, and it's also not uniform across all leporine species. However, Viera are not rabbits (or hares, for that matter) and just loosely rabbit inspired, so it's of little relevance how they differ in size as animals.

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Well, it's a game. This isn't real life where we play to find mates *saveforthatonethread*. The power to contradict biology laughably exists in every corner of FFXIV yet they employ it with apparent discrimination.
IMO, it technically still has lot to do with double standards because SE wants to predict and play on the playerbases standards, a playerbase where double standards are inherent when it comes to gender. Females can appear short and ambiguously young because "female uwu", but males cannot because "am stronk". Female Au Ra could have had the build of female viera, keeping in tact the female au ra body language. But I. Can. Only. Dream.

I reallly think the only reason that viera are not small in stature / a waifu race is because there already existed a model to build around. I can hear the screeching of the loremasters.

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Originally Posted by Tlamila

I really don't understand why some people are so horribly opposed to the idea of males being shorter, for once. Would some diversity hurt, from the "male=hulk, female=loli"?

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The only description I remember is them being fierce and living mostly alone (defenders of the forest type). Which of course means that they have to be huge and full of muscle, because even though its a game where we can play as Lalas and where we have female Au Ra that are fighting alongside their males, it still means that they somehow need to be big.

Its also good to point out that the fierce part of their description is not there in the japanese version.

In the end I dont care if they are slightly taller, a bit smaller or the same height as the females, as long as they look like they still belong to the same race. If that in the end means that we get a male race that is max as tall as the min. female, I would be fine with that too.

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Originally Posted by Alleo

Its also good to point out that the fierce part of their description is not there in the japanese version.

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What does the japanese description say?

The Japanese version is a bit odd. In ff12 they have the males described as macho, aggressive - but more 'mad'. But I argued that the translation for that is that they're not mad of mind - just very aggressive to outsiders, to the point that females actually find it strange. But the males are described as very 'male' like - to the point where you get the imagery they're just straight up testosterone on legs following a simple directive. Kill, breed and survive.

So even if they were smaller, making them anything less than looking aggressive/cold/stoic/dangerous would be doing them a disservice.

Keep in mind that if you're in said woods with Viera, you want a female to find you. You're likely to survive. If you find a male - well, you're going to be dead before you even lock eyes with them.

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Originally Posted by Alleo

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

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Does anyone have the japanese text or picture they can link me to?

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I tried looking for your source, but couldn't find it. The only thing I'm finding from FFXII on male viera is from the Final Fantasy XII Scenario Ultimania book, which mentions they are vicious, but that is not a description of their appearance. Until you can provide an actual source, I'm inclined to believe this is based solely on your interpretation, and is not a reflection of what male viera really look like.

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

The Japanese version is a bit odd. In ff12 they have the males described as macho, aggressive - but more 'mad'. But I argued that the translation for that is that they're not mad of mind - just very aggressive to outsiders, to the point that females actually find it strange. But the males are described as very 'male' like - to the point where you get the imagery they're just straight up testosterone on legs following a simple directive. Kill, breed and survive.

So even if they were smaller, making them anything less than looking aggressive/cold/stoic/dangerous would be doing them a disservice.

Keep in mind that if you're in said woods with Viera, you want a female to find you. You're likely to survive. If you find a male - well, you're going to be dead before you even lock eyes with them.

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Yeah, it's a pretty cool concept and one I hope they stick with. It'd certainly be more popular, especially with the Western crowd (which makes up the bulk of the game's player-base). We're sorely in need of another ruggedly handsome/classically handsome option that is taller than Miqo'te/Midlanders but not as weirdly proportioned as Roegadyn/Hrothgar/Elezen.

Hopefully Matsuno has the final say on the matter, since he'll probably make them like Basch/Balthier. Ivalice men tend to be classically/ruggedly handsome and it's only fitting that Viera men follow along those lines as a result.

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Originally Posted by VirusOnline

Well, it's a game. This isn't real life where we play to find mates *saveforthatonethread*. The power to contradict biology laughably exists in every corner of FFXIV yet they employ it with apparent discrimination.
IMO, it technically still has lot to do with double standards because SE wants to predict and play on the playerbases standards, a playerbase where double standards are inherent when it comes to gender. Females can appear short and ambiguously young because "female uwu", but males cannot because "am stronk". Female Au Ra could have had the build of female viera, keeping in tact the female au ra body language. But I. Can. Only. Dream.

I reallly think the only reason that viera are not small in stature / a waifu race is because there already existed a model to build around. I can hear the screeching of the loremasters.

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My point is not that we play to find mates, but that the races are designed with our own preferences in mind, which themselves have a basis in our own evolutionary history. They have to ensure enough people are interested in the race to merit the cost of adding it. Whatever oddities fantasy might be capable of spawning are not necessarily of interest to a game dev on a budget, seeking a profit. Viera females do a better job of appealing to the playerbase than Elezen (too gangly/stiff/ill-proportioned) or Roegadyn (too muscular, perhaps), but their decision to limit their hairstyle options does appear to have led to some buyer's remorse.

The specific lore they went with for the males and females makes them an even poorer fit for inverse gender dimorphism (and closer to what Gwen is referring to re the XII version), but in the end they will go with whatever they think will have broader appeal. I have a feeling that will involve trying to do Elezen "right", in the same way they did with the females.

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Originally Posted by Senn

Does anyone have the japanese text or picture they can link me to?

edit:
I tried looking for your source, but couldn't find it. The only thing I'm finding from FFXII on male viera is from the Final Fantasy XII Scenario Ultimania book, which mentions they are vicious, but that is not a description of their appearance. Until you can provide an actual source, I'm inclined to believe this is based solely on your interpretation, and is not a reflection of what male viera really look like.

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You will have to play the Japanese version of ff12. It was actually quoted in this thread further on. But that's one heck of a look. The Japanese had them roughly translated as 'Macho' men who are 'mad'. I remember this discussion throughly because we was having a huge debate if 'mad' meant they were crazy and aggressive towards their females. The English have them down as vicious and aggressive - which is also how they're described in FF14. If I can find the actual Japanese text I'll show. I only have English version of ff12 :[ But it's a good thing I'm playing through it - I'll be sure to find that exact Viera and see what she says regarding the matter.

I found some of the info of the player who was either Japanese/Speak Japanese

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Originally Posted by Komarimono

Non existent in FFXII except for one mention if Fran talks to one of the Viera, on how the males are sparse and mad in the head and muscular/stout.

Revenant Wings talked of cross breeding female Viera with other races and connected to the Ivalace lore. Hence Feol Viera.

So if they pull directly from FFXII lore, the men are crazy and barely to be found lol.

Let's hope that changes if they do ever try and add them, or would be quite awkward.

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and this is the quest;

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Originally Posted by Komarimono

When you're on the Lente quest, Fran can talk to the other Viera. Not hard to play it and see it yourself.

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Perhaps the original post could be edited in order to retain that information for future reference? I know the OP has asked for it to be brought up a number of times already throughout the thread, so it'd probably be quite a helpful move.

Following on from that, since we know from Yoshi-P's statements on the matter, male viera are not going to be designed to be 'child-like' and as such it might be a good move to take the child-like variants of art out of the original post as well.

Just a suggestion, though!

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Originally Posted by Omymy

I hope they don't put this race in the game,[...]

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Originally Posted by Omymy

They could use that money to finish the two races they introduced with the expansion [...]

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Your posts absolutely make sense as usual............ :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Lauront

There is another alternative, and that is to give them a height slider like the Roe female one. Then you could have them be as short as they are now but say at Highlander female height at max. I personally don't like the females because of how short they are. I would have liked if they had a slim, elegant demoness vibe to them.

They could adopt a similar approach for the male Viera, and just give them a big height range. Funnily enough it is males who tend to exhibit this kind of variability in height, and not females, so it'd fit Viera men better than it would Auri females... but it would have sufficed in both cases as workaround.

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I don't know about that, having too big of a height slider would just end up making them look weird. If they were going to be 7ft tall, I think they would need a model redesign anyway, they would just look... odd... enlarged to that extent.

Male Viera, well females aren't 7 feet tall, and don't start out at like 5 feet, so I could see this working a bit easier with them.

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Originally Posted by Omymy

I hope they don't put this race in the game, really. There are much more important things than having another doll to dress up and walk around with.

I don't know, is this The Sims or what; go to Second Life for gods sake.

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Hey I like dressing up in this game! :(

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Originally Posted by VirusOnline

Female Au Ra could have had the build of female viera, keeping in tact the female au ra body language. But I. Can. Only. Dream.

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I like au ra petite. :o

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Perhaps the original post could be edited in order to retain that information for future reference? I know the OP has asked for it to be brought up a number of times already throughout the thread, so it'd probably be quite a helpful move.

Following on from that, since we know from Yoshi-P's statements on the matter, male viera are not going to be designed to be 'child-like' and as such it might be a good move to take the child-like variants of art out of the original post as well.

Just a suggestion, though!

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The OP could use some updates. Keep the male viera dream going!

Well what I mean is a 6ft max for Auri females, which is more or less where Highlander females sit at. 7ft would be too much.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Well what I mean is a 6ft max for Auri females, which is more or less where Highlander females sit at. 7ft would be too much.

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Even if they could be as tall as viera, I bet people would still complain that they were too short compared to males. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by MrKusakabe

Your posts absolutely make sense as usual............ :rolleyes:

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Anyone with two neurons realizes my message wasn't going that way. I forgive you because it is obvious that inside the potato's head there is a blown fuse.

I'm glad that ten poor deludeds are supporting you. That only demonstrates sectarian behaviour when someone doesnt shares their same point of view.

This game doesn't need Au Ras with rabbit ears. For that you have other tools that makes it easier and without burning money.

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

I remember this discussion throughly because we was having a huge debate if 'mad' meant they were crazy and aggressive towards their females.

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"Mad" doesn't necessarily describe what they look like physically, and yes, they are aggressive, even towards other females, as was stated in the Ultimania book.

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

If I can find the actual Japanese text I'll show. I only have English version of ff12 :[ But it's a good thing I'm playing through it - I'll be sure to find that exact Viera and see what she says regarding the matter.

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Ok, I will be waiting for your sources. <- I know I can come off harsh in text, but it's not my intention, and I don't mean it in a mean way. I'd just like to see your sources.

I went back to read that user's posts as well, and it wasn't clear to me that they played the japanese version of the game. It also seems like that user has their own biases, so I am not currently going to take that statement as fact if there's no link, text, video, or picture to go with it. If there's a japanese version and english version of the text, I would be interested in seeing both.

Mad, aggressive, and all that has nothing to do with looks too. See Xaela females, especially some of them, they're tiny and cute and yet bloodthirsty and often can't be reasoned with without a battle.

I wouldn't mind the males being slightly shorter than the females. As in a head shorter but not lalafell sized or the size difference Au Ra has. I think even if they are "short" by Viera standards, they would probably be seen as tall by the standards of the other races. Either way, I think their inclusion can only be a positive addition to the game itself.

I think because males are exiled from the villages their culture is to be territorial and aggressive. I think to other races this could be seen as "mad" but i think that's a thing will a lot of Male Viera lore. It comes via second-hand information rather than being through the first-hand experience. The alluded encounter within Shadowbringers does give a different perspective in that the male left before meeting us, The female Viera said maybe we could have met them had she had a chance to speak with the elusive male.

I think given the way the Ivalicean lore is stated - that any males that are included in the future are likely to be more stalwart guardians than overly aggressive and territorial/mad warriors. If they were so, we would have perhaps encountered them/they would literally have killed us as soon as we stepped foot into the Viera part of Rak'tika.

There is also that curious line around the hares being rounded up by Garlemald and given the biological weapons that Garlemald seems to be creating. I wonder if perhaps this will factor into the reason for their break-in custom should they be added in 6.0 (which I believe they may be. Given the uproar of the last expansion of the genderlocks and omission, their inclusion if played right could provide a lot of hype and excitement, being somewhat of an own goal for Square Enix. Equally though, if played poorly it could cause even more disappointment. I think its therefore likely we will know by the first fanfest if they are coming or not. )

Mad and aggressive doesn't describe actual physical, stout and muscular does describe their physical appearance. Being mad/aggressive is simply how they would come across in personality. If all the males are viewed as mad/aggressive then all of them should have that specific body language where when they idle - they should come across as aggressive. When they emote; they should also be aggressive. We can't forget that their dominant personalities are what will form the basis of their emotes.

The issue with Xaela females is that they got thoroughly done dirty and had to share emotes/stance with the Raen who are not aggressive. If it was just Xaela I would bet my cup of coffee that they wouldn't be so cute. Think of fHighlander where when they idle they're usually in some sort of 'power stance'.

In regards to ff12; I can go through that quest and double-check. What is said, might take me a week or more since FF12 hasn't been first and foremost in my mind. It will be on my switch - so i'll try my best to make the images presentable. If they don't say anything I'll be sure to say that nothing has been said. I'm playing the Zodiac version, which was originally Japanese only. So hopefully the translation was smooth come across. I can try to switch it to Japanese voices and hope that the translation in the subtitles is the one we're looking for.

The Ultimana book seems to be a bit conflicting - because the Vii males we came across aren't seen as aggressive. We know that one of them intervened to save a Vii female but ran away when he saw us, not wanting to get involved. Another was talked about in regards to his daughter daydreaming about him. But she only really said 'Papa* is that you?' In some form or fashion.

Viera males in FF14 aren't described as 'mad' either - but they are described as extremely cold-blooded, and not someone you want to come across. Hence my argument that mad just means they come across as aggressive. They will kill you, and it doesn't matter what your reasons are for being in their territory. They're worse than Xaela in that. Xaela at least allow for trade and accept other races into their clans. Some of them are seen as extremely derpy as well. Even Magnai is seen as a bit of a joke. Viera males, while we haven't seen any of that. The imagery is built up that they are perhaps one of the most aggressive 'males' in the FF world. I haven't seen a humanoid race in FF14 that as described as harshly as the Viera males are actually in-game.

Edit; for those wondering what I mean why the males are 'aggressive' here's a snippet from FF14 lore regarding the 24 man in Ivalice.
'As I explained before, the duty of a male Viera─a Wood-warder─is to see that their tribe’s demesne remain untouched by the destructive whims of outsiders. Yet, they do so from the shadows, oft choosing to shoot first, and not even bother with questions. '

Here is the rest of the lore dump jhere. As you can see, the life of a Viera male is pretty intense.

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Originally Posted by Anvaire

I think even if they are "short" by Viera standards, they would probably be seen as tall by the standards of the other races. Either way, I think their inclusion can only be a positive addition to the game itself.

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Yeah, that's what I've been saying too. They would still be tall, even if they are shorter than the females. I really do hope they are added one day in the future!

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

stout and muscular

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That is, if they were actually described that way. Take your time playing, but let me know what the text says when you get to that part. I don't doubt they will be muscular (you can still be slim and toned), but I am doubtful about the stout description, especially since Matsuno made comments on the male viera appearance (going back to his comments on Ashita no Joe), and how Yoshi P mused about them being slim, handsome, and elegant.

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

They're worse than Xaela in that. Xaela at least allow for trade and accept other races into their clans.

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Actually, male viera do trade as well, but only with other viera. Since that one male viera protected the vii female, and since she thought perhaps she could have even introduced us to him, maybe they aren't that bad. Xaela are pretty bad - fighting each other and war is pretty much engraved in their culture. Xaela also enslave people. Male viera brave the wilderness and are fine hunters, but as far as we know, they don't necessarily have any battle royales with other viera, only territorial spats.

It does seem like ffxiv viera and ffxii viera are a little bit different from each other. I'm not even sure if the males are aggressive even towards the females when it comes to territory in ffxiv. I also wouldn't be surprised to see a derpy or socially awkward male viera in ffxiv, just like there are some derpy xaela.

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Originally Posted by Senn

Actually, male viera do trade as well, but only with other viera. Since that one male viera protected the Vii female, perhaps they aren't that bad. Xaela are pretty bad - fighting each other and war is pretty much engraved in their culture. Though I know male viera brave the wilderness and are fine hunters, they don't necessarily have any battle royales with other viera, only territorial spats. It does seem like FFXIV viera and FFXII viera are a bit different from each other. I wouldn't be surprised to see a derpy or socially awkward male viera, just like there are some derpy Xaela.

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Where does it say they trade with one another? I thought they were pretty strict in regards that they don't do that. And everything is about survival with them - the strongest survives and goes on to breed. Males shun contact with other males unless they're a master with their apprentices.

'Without a supportive community, the males must constantly struggle to survive. Food, clothing, weapons, medicines─all must be procured or crafted by the individual and without the aid of another. The male lives alone and dies alone. This has gone unchanged for countless generations. I spent many a moon in the Desert Sapphire, and while I saw all manner of wondrous creatures, not once did I lay mine eyes upon a male Viera, nor did I hear of one living in the city. They simply do not exist to us.

These are FF14 Viera, not FF12 btw. The wiki seems to say they allow for trade, but all other sources say otherwise. They stay away from the female settlements, period. Unless they're going to breed and pick up the jacks.

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

Where does it say they trade with one another? I thought they were pretty strict in regards that they don't do that. And everything is about survival with them - the strongest survives and goes on to breed. Males shun contact with other males unless they're a master with their apprentices.

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"They live in separate settlements and only communicate with the females when needing to mate, trade or collect the male adolescences."
https://finalfantasy.fandom.com/wiki...-MaleViera_0-0

I was looking at the wiki (I actually thought the wiki was talking about ffxii for a second). It could be wrong, but I wouldn't be surprised if they decided to take the opportunity to trade a little while collecting the adolescent males. Out of the settlements and into the wilderness, I imagine there would be absolutely no trading.

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Originally Posted by Senn

"They live in separate settlements and only communicate with the females when needing to mate, trade or collect the male adolescences."
https://finalfantasy.fandom.com/wiki...-MaleViera_0-0

I was looking at the wiki (I actually thought the wiki was talking about ffxii for a second). It could be wrong, but I wouldn't be surprised if they decided to take the opportunity to trade a little while collecting the adolescent males.

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I wouldn't be surprised if that's wrong going off the information that we've been given. If the women are looking for the strongest of males then they're probably going to want one that can survive purely by themselves without their aid. The women also have their community where they trade with one another and live pretty comfortably. So, in most scenarios whatever would be traded would specifically tend to benefit the male.

I could see them 'gifting' however, but not taking. A gift seems a lot more likely to be accepted when you're coming into the village to breed.

And of course, males seem to be very normadic, so they don't live in settlements if we go by how they live alone and die alone. They just camp around the woods. Having spats here and there for the best hunting grounds. Do they kill each other like Xaela? No, need. Their numbers are dangerously low. Male Viera only kill other male viera in regards to the strict training. That seems much worse to me. Their younglings die because of how strict and harsh their training is.

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

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Yeah, it could be possible they get gifted things when they go to a settlement. It doesn't seem like male viera relationships are that bad with the females, seeing that there is a viera who spoke of her father, right? -and of course, that one male who protected the female vii.

What I'm getting at is that both xaela and male viera are pretty brutal. Despite this, there could possibly still be a derpy male viera, just like some xaela are derpy.

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

Here is the rest of the lore dump jhere. As you can see, the life of a Viera male is pretty intense.

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Thank you for the link, I'm always happy to learn more.
Though I still don't see anything about looks in there, which also makes sense because all the speakers say that nobody ever sees males.
I'm looking forward whatever info you will bring from 12 though.

PS. don't kill me for this, but when it says “Yet how they stalk the jungle in those stilettos, perhaps we will never know.” it got me wondering if males wear those too. :P

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Originally Posted by Senn

It doesn't seem like male viera relationships are that bad with the females

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Well, to start with they're matriarchal, so males treating females badly would make no sense.
Second, it says that even though they live far away their souls are still close, which sounds like love to me.
“When I was younger and far more the fool than I am now, I asked a Viera if she did not find her tribe’s ways awkward. Was it not within the natural order for males and females of a species to coexist? The woman answered me thus: ‘The value of coexistence will not be found ‘neath a loincloth. Long has our kind endured understanding that the distance 'twixt two bodies does not dictate the distance 'twixt two souls.’”

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Originally Posted by Tlamila

Thank you for the link, I'm always happy to learn more.
Though I still don't see anything about looks in there, which also makes sense because all the speakers say that nobody ever sees males.
I'm looking forward whatever info you will bring from 12 though.

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I would like to play through ffxii zodiac age but can't. So yeah, waiting on Gwen. No pressure though lol

If you're interested, I can tell you what Naoki Yoshida said when talking about male viera and their appearance:
"With FF12, there are only female Viera appearing in the game. Due to that, we have no design references for the male versions. If we did create a male design for the Viera, he would be quite elegant, handsome, and slim. He would look more like the Elezen race, but with bunny ears."
https://www.usgamer.net/articles/fin...r-trust-system

Also this:
"We knew we only had Female Viera for reference, so we had no idea what to do for the Male variant. We would have to use our own imagination for that. There was fear about how we would approach that. Perhaps an elezen body with a miqo’te face and bunny ears. "
https://boundingintocomics.com/2019/...ia-and-sexism/

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Originally Posted by Tlamila

Well, to start with they're matriarchal, so males treating females badly would make no sense.
Second, it says that even though they live far away their souls are still close, which sounds like love to me.
“When I was younger and far more the fool than I am now, I asked a Viera if she did not find her tribe’s ways awkward. Was it not within the natural order for males and females of a species to coexist? The woman answered me thus: ‘The value of coexistence will not be found ‘neath a loincloth. Long has our kind endured understanding that the distance 'twixt two bodies does not dictate the distance 'twixt two souls.’”

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I agree. When I read this, I thought that it was spoken with fondness.

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

Where does it say they trade with one another? I thought they were pretty strict in regards that they don't do that.

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I think it was in Fanow or one of the viis quests but we have to take that with a grain of salt since the viis aren’t viera and for the past 100 years their civilization has been slowly whittled away.

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Originally Posted by Senn

Yeah, it could be possible they get gifted things when they go to a settlement. It doesn't seem like male viera relationships are that bad with the females, seeing that there is a viera who spoke of her father, right? -and of course, that one male who protected the female vii.

What I'm getting at is that both xaela and male viera are pretty brutal. Despite this, there could possibly still be a derpy male viera, just like some xaela are derpy.

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Yes, it's why I don't actually think they're aggressive to their females. But only outsiders really. I think the females think they're aggressive compared to them. After all when that one Viera was questioned on if it was weird that they live the way they do.

'The woman answered me thus: ‘The value of coexistence will not be found ‘neath a loincloth. Long has our kind endured understanding that the distance 'twixt two bodies does not dictate the distance 'twixt two souls.’”

That Viera are more spiritual than physical. Physical relations are for breeding. What they desire/want is a soul mate. And the distance between two of them matters little as soul mates will always be close because of that bond.

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Originally Posted by Tlamila

Thank you for the link, I'm always happy to learn more.
Though I still don't see anything about looks in there, which also makes sense because all the speakers say that nobody ever sees males.
I'm looking forward whatever info you will bring from 12 though.

PS. don't kill me for this, but when it says “Yet how they stalk the jungle in those stilettos, perhaps we will never know.” it got me wondering if males wear those too. :P

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Nah, there is no actual physical appearance other than the imagery that is painted. They could indeed be small, but with how they live you'd also assume they'd be slim, muscular and with low/zero body fat. Hah, if they have stilettos that would be interesting.

As for ff12, I hope so as well. I really hope that information is indeed in there and I'm not just parroting some imaginary information from faulty memory. I can't even double-check because no one has done a video on it! Or if they have it's really hidden due to the fact they would need to be on Fran and talking to every other Viera female.

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Originally Posted by Senn

What does the japanese description say?

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https://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/shadowbringers/system/
(under point races)

This is the only one that I could found about the races themselves. You can change the language at the top to see their text.

Interestingly even in the english version this is the only thing that they mention about males: Their society is purely matriarchal, and males of age are seldom, if ever, found within the bounds of any village. They instead serve as protectors of the wood from the shadows, that no evil may ever encroach on their sacred lands.

Which did not mention their look at all, heck even the word fierce was not there. They are simply protectors of the wood and they do that from the shadows.

JP version: オサード小大陸の少数民族で、その名は「森の民」を意味する。古来より、森の奥深くで独自の共同体を築いて暮らしてきた歴史を持ち、近年まで他種族の生活圏に姿を表すことさえ少なかった。
特に成人男性は単独での放浪生活を送るしきたりのため、目撃例すら稀である。なお、外見はヒューランやエレゼンに近しいが、耳が大きく発達しているのが特徴的。

Google translation (in germany) tells me that the only mention of men in there is, that they live their lifes alone.

So nothing about being fierce.

I do remember though that this topic was mentioned in this thread.

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

The Japanese version is a bit odd. In ff12 they have the males described as macho, aggressive - but more 'mad'. But I argued that the translation for that is that they're not mad of mind - just very aggressive to outsiders, to the point that females actually find it strange. But the males are described as very 'male' like - to the point where you get the imagery they're just straight up testosterone on legs following a simple directive. Kill, breed and survive.

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But FF12 is not FF14. So we cant just take what is said there as a way to interpret them here. At least on the official FF14 shadowbringer site they only mention in english that they live in the shadows. This lifestyle can easily make them into smaller ones. Heck being smaller and hiding in the shadows to kill from there silently kinda fit quite good together.

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Originally Posted by Alleo

...

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Oh, I remember this. Neither the english or japanese text describe male viera's appearance specifically. Thanks for linking.

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Originally Posted by Alleo

snip

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Aye, it's true that FF12 isn't FF14 - but the loremaster of the game specifically said they were taking the lore from FF12. Not that it matters much because the only thing they mentioned was that they are muscular, and I need to double-check that. They could indeed be smaller than their females, or they could be taller and/or bigger. Evidence of them taking their lore straight out of FF12 is here;

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Originally Posted by Komarimono

Chances are getting slimmer depending on how you read the answer about Viera and Hrothgar in this thread.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-transcript%29

Question:
What was the most difficult aspect of adapting both Viera/Viis and the Hrothgar/Ronso into XIV's lore and story?

Banri Oda's Answer:
As for Viera, we took the origin setting from FINAL FANTASY XII as is and as much as possible without giving it sort of the "FFXIV interpretation" to it.
By having talks with (Yasumi) Matsuno-san many times who was in charge of the scenario of "Return to Ivalice", we kind of prevented giving the spoils to FFXIV's world. I would like to thank Matsuno-san.

As for the Hrothgar we didn't want to give the impression that this race just suddenly appeared in the world so we created a setting like a link towards the place go to so it doesn't feel like a sudden appearance. And also we touched upon the Hrothgar background in the Tales of the Storm so that it can be better understood by players.


So it's as I said way earlier in the thread, their lore is based on FFXII, so males are likely to be nill to none.

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I found a picture of a male viera that I like, but it's modded. I don't own the picture or anything, just found it online, but it's probably against the tos to post it, right? Kind of a bummer. :(

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

Aye, it's true that FF12 isn't FF14 - but the loremaster of the game specifically said they were taking the lore from FF12. Not that it matters much because the only thing they mentioned was that they are muscular, and I need to double-check that. They could indeed be smaller than their females, or they could be taller and/or bigger. Evidence of them taking their lore straight out of FF12 is here;

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If they want to they can make just about anything fit. Just because a race/gender combo is rare now doesn't mean it has to stay that way.

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Originally Posted by Senn

I found a picture of a male viera that I like, but it's modded. I don't own the picture or anything, just found it online, but it's probably against the tos to post it, right? Kind of a bummer. :(

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Yeah, I wouldn't risk it. Speaking of depictions of human bunny men, though, I recently found this image on twitter:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ELoCL5cU...g&name=900x900

Not sure what its actually for, but it seems to be real SQEX art. I love the tactics/bravely style its has, and I'd love to have a similar face option available for male viera, regardless of body type.

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Originally Posted by Tabbs

Yeah, I wouldn't risk it. Speaking of depictions of human bunny men, though, I recently found this image on twitter:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ELoCL5cU...g&name=900x900

Not sure what its actually for, but it seems to be real SQEX art. I love the tactics/bravely style its has, and I'd love to have a similar face option available for male viera, regardless of body type.

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The design looks like a male miqo'te with rabbit ears attached. That honestly wouldn't surprise me if it was the route they decided to take.