Formal Letter to SE about RMT situation.

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Originally Posted by Haibel

Wasn't singling you out, I just like you because you look fluffy.

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http://i3.minus.com/ibfN3ttKtcoUb2.png
I'm not fluffy!
I mess you up!

Exodus has been better for about a week. Not gone but but notably less.

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Originally Posted by Magusrex

Exodus has been better for about a week. Not gone but but notably less.

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Lamia got better for like 2 weeks, but then a huge wave came back afterwards and its back to usual.

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Originally Posted by Magusrex

Exodus has been better for about a week. Not gone but but notably less.

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The same on Coeurl. I'm just not sure whether it's a meaningful drop or just a pre-expansion lull.

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Originally Posted by Niwashi

The same on Coeurl. I'm just not sure whether it's a meaningful drop or just a pre-expansion lull.

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I'm on Couerl, also. I've noticed this before - it just usually comes back later somewhere down the week so I've learned not to hold my breath too long.

I have to be honest, this is very discouraging for me. When the devs came out and apologized for the failure that was FFXIV 1.0, and polled the players for feedback on how to make ARR, I started to think this dev team was different and actually cared about the players. It's all too clear now that I was wrong and they don't care at all. So unfortunate.

Translate this to Japanese, then post on the Japanese board. Perhaps the best way to go about getting your message across.

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Originally Posted by Gextiv

Translate this to Japanese, then post on the Japanese board. Perhaps the best way to go about getting your message across.

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That has been done already and it achieved nothing.

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Originally Posted by Sicno

That has been done already and it achieved nothing.

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It has? I know someone posted something to the JP forums before that was similar to this and the JP made it sound as though it were a niche problem not shared by many NA players. I don't think this thread in particular has ever been linked to them has it? I wouldn't even know where to begin in translating this to good Japanese. I'm be so grateful if someone translated it all to JP and linked them here so they could see the 100 pages to know it is a real problem.

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Originally Posted by Zabuza

It has? I know someone posted something to the JP forums before that was similar to this and the JP made it sound as though it were a niche problem not shared by many NA players. I don't think this thread in particular has ever been linked to them has it? I wouldn't even know where to begin in translating this to good Japanese. I'm be so grateful if someone translated it all to JP and linked them here so they could see the 100 pages to know it is a real problem.

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Someone had posted about RMT in the JP threads, but the thread they made was in english, and was quickly locked. this thread was linked in that.

The leadership of this game is showing themselves to have no honor. What I know personally of Japanese culture tells me they hold leadership and honor in high regard. I and my father before me trained with Japanese masters in Judo, it appears that spirit is gone. I am ashamed for those in charge of this game because I admire the courage and tenacity of the history of the Japanese people, I consider myself honored and blessed to have trained with them. If management had courage, they would come to these forums and address our concerns and accept responsibility for everything that happens under their watch. I and others are being harassed, management appear to be doing nothing meaningful to fix it, leading us to believe they are profiting from it and seem to lack the courage and honor their position should mandate.

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Originally Posted by Magusrex

snip.

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its comments like this one i was talking about before, Zabuza. some go way OTT.

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Originally Posted by Kaze3434

its comments like this one i was talking about before, Zabuza. some go way OTT.

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I meant it to be OTT. I meant what I said however. Their continued silence leaves me with legitimate questions about the character and honor of those in charge. We deserve a response. We have not touched a nerve yet, have to try something new.

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Originally Posted by Magusrex

I meant it to be OTT. I meant what I said however. Their continued silence leaves me with legitimate questions about the character and honor of those in charge. We deserve a response. We have not touched a nerve yet, have to try something new.

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interestingly enough, everyone who plays the game does not deserve a response to anything about anything. the people that a company must answer questions to are stock holders. its a crummy system, but thats how business works. most, if not all gaming studios try to have a layer of transparency, but there will always be things that will not be touched on, or fully explained. Case in point: DLC( Disk Locked Content). first expansion for destiny was already in the base game, but the players were forced to pay for it. no answer has been given why some companies do this.(we all know its about money).

In this games case, the action being done(perm banning bots and gil sellers and temp banning buyers) is a bandaid on a gunshot wound. the rate they ban at is fast, but its just as easy for the gil selling companies to make new characters, and flood the servers. one of the main reasons that this game has so many bots is because its a sucessful game, with tons of players that are used to freemium, and pay to win. if there was no incentive to have gil, then none of this would be happening.

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Originally Posted by Kaze3434

interestingly enough, everyone who plays the game does not deserve a response to anything about anything. the people that a company must answer questions to are stock holders. its a crummy system, but thats how business works. most, if not all gaming studios try to have a layer of transparency, but there will always be things that will not be touched on, or fully explained. Case in point: DLC( Disk Locked Content). first expansion for destiny was already in the base game, but the players were forced to pay for it. no answer has been given why some companies do this.(we all know its about money).

In this games case, the action being done(perm banning bots and gil sellers and temp banning buyers) is a bandaid on a gunshot wound. the rate they ban at is fast, but its just as easy for the gil selling companies to make new characters, and flood the servers. one of the main reasons that this game has so many bots is because its a sucessful game, with tons of players that are used to freemium, and pay to win. if there was no incentive to have gil, then none of this would be happening.

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I disagree, I know we are not guaranteed a response, I know it is not in the terms and conditions but I think enough of us are being harassed that we deserve one. I also understand that deserve does equal receive. I also have known people who could could not resist responding to the gauntlet I dropped. I have played far more popular games that had a much,much better handle on this. I KNOW they could do something about this if they CHOSE to care enough.

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Originally Posted by Magusrex

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Um, one thing you learn about Japanese business and culture in general, is that they also don't like to directly address problems. They often beat around the bush about subjects.
It's one of MANY things that caused friction in recent years with SE themselves (that pretty much got Tanaka fired and Yoshida his job) as well as companies like Toyota.
The usual idea is that a problem will be reported and quietly solved. And it'll be reported in THE most passive-aggressive manner possible.
The boss wouldn't say "I want you to make this mauve," he'd say "I don't like green." You're supposed to pick up on what he wants from what you know of him.
However, NA/EU people are COMPLETELY different and want updates whenever possible of every action being taken, even if it's just "we're working on it."
This cultural discrepancy is just something you learn to deal with when doing business with Japanese companies. Yoshida and his team are actually UNUSUAL in that they're at least trying to emulate non-Japanese companies in their approach to the players. But some things won't change, especially as this is still new territory for them.
"Honor" means many things in Japanese society, and one of those things is not talking about money matters in public.
They're not klingons...

I guess I just have a very old fashioned view of what leadership and honorable business means. I manage a 4 million dollar per year business. The way our employees handle complaints is a DIRECT reflection of me. If someone called me out on our website, the people who work for me know with certainty they need to inform me as soon as such a thing is found even if they were the cause. I would respond. I understand that my business is not comparable SE however this is much more than a single complaint and it is affecting a very large percentage of the player base. I am the CFO our corporation and I see their silence as cowardly and consider it a direction reflection of those in charge. They have not instructed the people who work for them to care enough about the customers who pay for their wages.

I can deal with the frequency of tells I receive... it's frustrating, and I wish I had a better way to report it, but I can handle it.

My tipping point with the RMT spam is when all of my friends started going BUSY all the time to avoid the spam. Now I can't whisper them, but they can whisper me... and don't realize they're busy. XD So what ends up happening is I get super frustrated because I can't answer and they don't remember they have busy status on.

The first step would be to allow only friends to whisper you, but even this is flawed because how do you make friends if you can't whisper anyone in the first place? Either way, this is definitely something that needs to be addressed on a more public level. I agree it's going to be bad PR when Heavensward hits and the gilsellers are in full swing. I don't remember it being this bad when ARR first happened, but I don't think anyone anticipated it being as successful as it was...

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Originally Posted by Magusrex

I manage a 4 million dollar per year business.

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This is why I love the internet.

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Originally Posted by SummerSkye

This is why I love the internet.

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What a coincidence. I manage a $5 million per year business.

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Originally Posted by SummerSkye

This is why I love the internet.

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I manage a 3 physician comprehensive ophthalmic practice that sees 240 to 265 patients per week. We treat Glaucoma, Macular Degeneration, perform surgery on Cataracts and treat many other eye diseases. We are very busy clinic with 14 employees in addition to the physicians. Our practice has been in operation for over 30 years and I have been working there since 2006 and in my current position since 2009. Believe it or not, I care not.

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Originally Posted by Ryuko

What a coincidence. I manage a $5 million per year business.

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Good for you!! What type of business and what are your most difficult challenges?

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Originally Posted by Magusrex

Believe it or not, I care not.

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Again...I fucking LOVE the internet.

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Originally Posted by Kaze3434

interestingly enough, everyone who plays the game does not deserve a response to anything about anything. the people that a company must answer questions to are stock holders.

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SE and Blizzard are the only two MMO companies who have the luxury of not having to answer to stockholders. This is why SE was able to take the initial financial hit to make Realm Reborn. This stockholder thing doesn't apply to them. They can remain silent if they want of course but they will only hurt themselves with this course of action when HW releases. Unless they fix the problem in silence.

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Originally Posted by Zabuza

SE and Blizzard are the only two MMO companies who have the luxury of not having to answer to stockholders. This is why SE was able to take the initial financial hit to make Realm Reborn. This stockholder thing doesn't apply to them.

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SE as a whole? that surprising to say the least.

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Originally Posted by Zabuza

SE and Blizzard are the only two MMO companies who have the luxury of not having to answer to stockholders. This is why SE was able to take the initial financial hit to make Realm Reborn. This stockholder thing doesn't apply to them. They can remain silent if they want of course but they will only hurt themselves with this course of action when HW releases. Unless they fix the problem in silence.

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Yeah, there simply are not many companies that would do what this game did.

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Originally Posted by Magusrex

I guess I just have a very old fashioned view of what leadership and honorable business means. I manage a 4 million dollar per year business. The way our employees handle complaints is a DIRECT reflection of me. If someone called me out on our website, the people who work for me know with certainty they need to inform me as soon as such a thing is found even if they were the cause. I would respond. I understand that my business is not comparable SE however this is much more than a single complaint and it is affecting a very large percentage of the player base. I am the CFO our corporation and I see their silence as cowardly and consider it a direction reflection of those in charge. They have not instructed the people who work for them to care enough about the customers who pay for their wages.

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yo lemme borrow like $200, i need to get the CPU for my new computer homie

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Originally Posted by Magusrex

Good for you!! What type of business and what are your most difficult challenges?

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I have no challenges, because I was kidding; I don't run my own business, and my income doesn't even approach that of a medical practice. Sorry if that wasn't clear. :( I was just poking fun because businesses cannot and will not all be run the same way. Also, how much you make or manage isn't really relevant to the topic at hand. I am sincerely happy for you that you run a successful business that diagnoses and treats so many different eye problems (as someone who has eye problems), but that really is neither here nor there in this thread. Also, I'm kind of getting off topic by even replying. Let me just sum it up by saying this: a medical practice isn't really comparable to a company like Square Enix. Of course we'd all love to fix every single problem, even if only from a financial standpoint, but there are priorities that must be met.

Allow me to explain why SE has probably been quiet... dealing with exploiters and gilsellers is like a game of cat and mouse. The goldfarmers (in all MMOs) start their goldfarming business, so the MMO companies try to halt that. The goldfarmers then find a workaround, and the MMOs then come up with another solution to try to curb it. If SE even gave a hint about what they were doing (beyond "We're paying attention to you and we're working on it"), the gilsellers would preemtively prepare for their next workaround. This is why game companies MUST keep quiet. This is why you don't hear about bans until they happen, and why SE doesn't release reasons for emergency maintenances if they involve patching a potential exploit until AFTER the issue has been fixed. I am really hoping there is some sort of solution in the works. It has been quite a while since something was done (besides mass bans), but this is why it is understandable that SE chooses to keep quiet in a nutshell.

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Originally Posted by Ryuko

I have no challenges, because I was kidding; I don't run my own business, and my income doesn't even approach that of a medical practice. Sorry if that wasn't clear. :( I was just poking fun because businesses cannot and will not all be run the same way. Also, how much you make or manage isn't really relevant to the topic at hand. I am sincerely happy for you that you run a successful business that diagnoses and treats so many different eye problems (as someone who has eye problems), but that really is neither here nor there in this thread. Also, I'm kind of getting off topic by even replying. Let me just sum it up by saying this: a medical practice isn't really comparable to a company like Square Enix. Of course we'd all love to fix every single problem, even if only from a financial standpoint, but there are priorities that must be met.

Allow me to explain why SE has probably been quiet... dealing with exploiters and gilsellers is like a game of cat and mouse. The goldfarmers (in all MMOs) start their goldfarming business, so the MMO companies try to halt that. The goldfarmers then find a workaround, and the MMOs then come up with another solution to try to curb it. If SE even gave a hint about what they were doing (beyond "We're paying attention to you and we're working on it"), the gilsellers would preemtively prepare for their next workaround. This is why game companies MUST keep quiet. This is why you don't hear about bans until they happen, and why SE doesn't release reasons for emergency maintenances if they involve patching a potential exploit until AFTER the issue has been fixed. I am really hoping there is some sort of solution in the works. It has been quite a while since something was done (besides mass bans), but this is why it is understandable that SE chooses to keep quiet in a nutshell.

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FWIW....I am a CFO, not the owner. I know they are not comparable, however in some ways they are. I have played literally all the popular MMOs. They all do a much better job with this. It is exponentially worse here. Leadership is leadership, doesn't matter what it is. You set the tone for your organization, unless of coarse you are weak. If the people in charge made it abundantly clear that the organization was going meet things head on, be as transparent as possible and make the customers feel as though their concerns matter, it would be so. To me they are saying we are doing what we are doing, until it starts to affect our bottom line nothing will change, fixing this will cost money. Hey man it's their business, believe me I get it. The thing is, you don't what is going to make a thing completely unravel. I know if I leave and start spending my time somewhere else, i am not coming back. I know their are other people like me. Some of us take FCs with us when we leave, servers start getting empty other people leave that were not even bothered by RMT. This game cannot afford another failure like 1.0. Is what it is.

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Originally Posted by Magusrex

FWIW....I am a CFO, not the owner. I know they are not comparable, however in some ways they are. I have played literally all the popular MMOs. They all do a much better job with this. It is exponentially worse here. Leadership is leadership, doesn't matter what it is. You set the tone for your organization, unless of coarse you are weak. If the people in charge made it abundantly clear that the organization was going meet things head on, be as transparent as possible and make the customers feel as though their concerns matter, it would be so. To me they are saying we are doing what we are doing, until it starts to affect our bottom line nothing will change, fixing this will cost money. Hey man it's their business, believe me I get it. The thing is, you don't what is going to make a thing completely unravel. I know if I leave and start spending my time somewhere else, i am not coming back. I know their are other people like me. Some of us take FCs with us when we leave, servers start getting empty other people leave that were not even bothered by RMT. This game cannot afford another failure like 1.0. Is what it is.

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Personally, I understand that companies must prioritize, and they can't prioritize everything. I'm sure they understand it's a problem people are concerned about... and this thread really proves that, if there were any doubt. Additionally, I'm sure they have people who play regularly to get a feel for the community. They're not blind about their own game. While I do recognize that gilseller tells are definitely annoying and stifling of the community, it's not something that I have seen stop anyone from playing. I have seen people quit over lack of content, boredom or disliking the community... but not gilseller tells. That's not to say it SHOULDN'T be addressed, but where priorities are concerned, I'd rather they focus more attention and energy on other things, especially with an expansion on the horizon; expansions make or break the overall progression of an MMO, and the success of an expansion directly correlates with the resources that the company will pour into it in the future. Since you said you are the CFO of a company... think of it like budgeting. You only have X amount of employees and X amount of budgeting to deal with at the present moment, and if making a true fix requires a lot of additional programming and systematic reworkings (adding functionality to report spam immediately and have them removed from the game quickly, for example), it might be better to spend your resources fixing other, more dire issues... such as UI bugs or other community functionality... for now. That's not to say it WON'T be done, but it isn't a priority.

I would personally like if they would implement a system that allows players to report a tell as spam, and after enough reports (maybe 10 unique ones from 10 unique people), it is automatically suspended for a 24 hour period for review. To prevent abuse, a GM would then review the account and the outgoing whispers, and decide if it is banworthy (pretty easy to tell if someone is a gilseller spammer or not). If the person was erroneously reported for spam (such as by people who have it out for a legitimate player), the GM would then be able to punish the people who 'cried wolf'. If there is a real punishment for abusing the system, people would be deterred from abusing it. That's my solution, but it would require additional resources (more GMs to review accounts) and an additional functionality in the game itself... (right click and report someone for spam), plus an automatic system to lock an account until it can be reviewed. I think that would be effective, but it takes time and resources. The best time to implement something like that WOULD be with an update to the game's system itself, which may or may not occur in Heavensward or during one of the post-expansion patches.

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Originally Posted by Sicno

That has been done already and it achieved nothing.

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They cannot be linking this thread to their post of course. It has to be as authentic as can be.

Anyways, Gil sellers are more annoying than ever, now they whisper(tell) and send multiple friend requests.

S.E. pls.

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Originally Posted by Ryuko

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I am certain people do quit from RMT, they just leave and don't say anything. Those likely to be drive away, are also the type that are reluctant to post in public forums. This is all my personal opinion of course.

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Originally Posted by Cakekizy

I am certain people do quit from RMT, they just leave and don't say anything. Those likely to be drive away, are also the type that are reluctant to post in public forums. This is all my personal opinion of course.

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I can't really say for sure, but I'm only speaking from my personal experience... I have had friends leave because they were bored with the game, didn't have the time to play as often as they'd like, couldn't afford to play anymore, or just didn't want to play because it wasn't their type of game. I've never had a friend tell me, "I'm sick of the RMT spam so I'm quitting." I have, however, had plenty of friends and FC-mates go Busy because of the RMT spam.

I agree with this letter.
/signed

The friend requesting bots are now having similar names I got one yesterday that had the same first name as my character, just what I need now I hope people don't think I am a bot now -.-

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Originally Posted by Cakekizy

I am certain ... This is all my personal opinion of course.

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Well which is it?

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Originally Posted by Ryuko

I can't really say for sure, but I'm only speaking from my personal experience... I have had friends leave because they were bored with the game, didn't have the time to play as often as they'd like, couldn't afford to play anymore, or just didn't want to play because it wasn't their type of game. I've never had a friend tell me, "I'm sick of the RMT spam so I'm quitting." I have, however, had plenty of friends and FC-mates go Busy because of the RMT spam.

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About two or three months ago I left this game with the intention never to return unless I heard they improved the RMT situation. The ONLY reason I left was the RMT spam. I'm back now because my fiancee loves the game and wants me to try out Heavensward with her. I've been back less than a week and I'm already ready to cancel my subscription again due to RMt.

I agree they have to undertake bigger actions to make this game an Massive Multiplayer Online RPG again, and not a Massive RMT PropagandaPG.

/signed

Still being harassed, 7 friend requests in short time on Sunday afternoon on Exodus. Any new plans devs or are you going to keep up the silent go bleep yourself treatment to your customers.? What you are doing is not enough.

Feel free to count me as signed. Its getting to a point where I had to go to /busy the minute I get in, but even then as I am loading I still get a tell from a bot. Not to mention that I work from home so while doing so I gather clusters and I have reported the same botter several times over the period of 3 weeks and when I finally do get a response, it was a basic "thank you for your message". Feel like I need to record him and post evidence if I want anything done about him.

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Originally Posted by Ryuko

I can't really say for sure, but I'm only speaking from my personal experience... I have had friends leave because they were bored with the game, didn't have the time to play as often as they'd like, couldn't afford to play anymore, or just didn't want to play because it wasn't their type of game. I've never had a friend tell me, "I'm sick of the RMT spam so I'm quitting." I have, however, had plenty of friends and FC-mates go Busy because of the RMT spam.

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Yeah I think the RMT spam just kinda adds to their justification when quitting. Heh, well..at least come expansion the servers will be on lock down for a while (At least, some will..) so we will get a break from the tells >.>