I don't understand...

So what I've got from recent posts: Don't tell people what they're doing wrong because that's elitist. I guess I'll just kick 'em then. Wouldn't want to be labeled as an elitist ;)

My god, the string analogies are getting out of hand, people! They don't even make sense; no one speaks like that. Lol.


Carry on. /Popcorn

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Originally Posted by Gormogon

So the issue being you couldn't adjust to his rotation, not surprised..

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If a tank pulls an AOE group by using Flash only once (which seems to be Songi is saying) and then doing 1-2-3 on the primary kill target only, there is no working around that. A single cure will send all of the other targets running straight for the healer. You can "work around" certain things, but if a tank isn't incurring enmity on all targets in an AOE pull, there's nothing to "work around." Your two options in that situation are to either offer the tank polite advice (such as to use Flash much more liberally), or wipe repeatedly until you all give up out of frustration.

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Originally Posted by Keres

snip..

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It is unclear how many flashes were used and when first of all. Additionally a CNJ/WHM has repose for Stone Vigil a level 41 dungeon and the mobs can all be put to sleep on that one, except the triple aevis before the final boss.

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Originally Posted by Cap75

So what I've got from recent posts: Don't tell people what they're doing wrong because that's elitist. I guess I'll just kick 'em then. Wouldn't want to be labeled as an elitist ;)

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Why is it so hard to go slower an accomodate them instead of berating them or kicking them? Why make demands of those who may or may not have the ability at that time to meet your higher expectations (even if the expectations are that high)? If it is easy make an adjustment on your side why not do it?

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Originally Posted by Cap75

So what I've got from recent posts: Don't tell people what they're doing wrong because that's elitist. I guess I'll just kick 'em then. Wouldn't want to be labeled as an elitist ;)

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One of the best replies I've ever seen in these types of threads was something along the lines of "Telling people how to play is elitist, kicking them is elitist, leaving is elitist. Only if you remain silent and wipe for all eternity will you not be considered elitist." Lol. I've since lost the quote, though :(

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Originally Posted by Foo01

It is unclear how many flashes were used and when first of all. Additionally a CNJ/WHM has repose for Stone Vigil a level 41 dungeon and the mobs can all be put to sleep on that one, except the triple aevis before the final boss.

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Songi's original post is pretty clearly-worded to indicate that the tank was, to quote:

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using flash to pull and never using more than his 1-2-3 aggro chain on a single target in a group pull

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Secondly, Sleep/Repose isn't really an excuse to not keep using Flash once in a while, because 1) Sleep can get broken by accident from time to time, and 2) when the Sleep breaks (either by accident or simply because the timer ran out), as the tank you're still going to want to be sure that you have hate on those targets. Using Flash is an easy (and non-sleep-breaking) way to do that.

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Originally Posted by Foo01

It is unclear how many flashes were used and when first of all. Additionally a CNJ/WHM has repose for Stone Vigil a level 41 dungeon and the mobs can all be put to sleep on that one, except the triple aevis before the final boss.

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You are still missing it. Even if you CAN sleep the mobs, that doesn't make enmity go away. The healer will still build up enmity and as soon as the sleep breaks, it will beeline for the healer. Unless of course the tank is generating proper aoe enmity. Secondly, there's more Aevis in the whole dungeon, that particular pull is just the most damaging, ie the most healing required.

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Originally Posted by Keres

Songi's original post is pretty clearly-worded to indicate that the tank was...

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Clearly worded but not from the side of the tank who can't possibly tell us what had happened. 1 flash 2 flash someone could miss one when they were looking away etc. I wouldn't make the call unless there is more solid information. It is easy to bash on someone else who it not present.

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Originally Posted by ispano

.... Even if you CAN sleep the mobs, that doesn't make enmity go away. The healer will still build up enmity and as soon as the sleep breaks, it will beeline for the healer. ...

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If you are down to single target, the tank won't need much healing and the healer can DPS with the dps bring down the mobs one at time. By the time it wakes up the tank would already had done the ROH combo on it an secured it. I've dozed off doing things this way on Stone Vigil before, but the dungeon still got cleared and there was no drama or bad feelings.

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Originally Posted by Foo01

Why is it so hard to go slower an accomodate them instead of berating them or kicking them? Why make demands of those who may or may not have the ability at that time to meet your higher expectations (even if the expectations are that high)? If it is easy make an adjustment on your side why not do it?

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Why is it so hard for a level 42 tank to hold hate? And telling someone a better way to do something doesn't equal berating them. If they take it that way they best give up tanking cause they don't have thick enough skin for it.

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Originally Posted by Cap75

Why is it so hard for a level 42 tank to hold hate? And telling someone a better way to do something doesn't equal berating them. If they take it that way they best give up tanking cause they don't have thick enough skin for it.

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Telling them a better way is not berating, but you run the risk of it being received that way and it has happened to turn out that way. Doesn't mean it is always that way. And if they give up tanking, or give up the game, is that really good for everyone? Maybe they just need more reps at it and figure it out. Learn by doing. Takes time, takes patience, so it naturally has to go slower.