We need more ways to make gold in this game.

When you're done getting to lvl 50 as soon as as humanly possible, visit one of the crafting guilds and see all the players slaving away in their dumb looking coifs and crafter's gowns. You may think they're fools but you will eventually join them(albeit late) when your lvl 50 goes broke.

I like how this long ass thread is basically 3 people actually talking about what this thread is about and 100 people saying "SELL THINGS ON THE AH! GAWD". Or in the case of Matsume "GO MAKE ANOTHER CHARACTER AND HAVE ONE OF YOUR FRIENDS HOLD ON TO THAT FEW HUNDRED THOUSAND GIL YOU MADE! GAWD". (You can't send things cross-account champ.)

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Originally Posted by Neasa

Actually start doing level 50 dungeons, and then tell me you don't make more gil than you lose. That includes introducing more gil into the economy than taking out just from currency or NPCing junk. It costs 350 gil for one piece of grade 5 dark matter... Dungeons constantly give double that from chests in currency alone, nevermind the other junk that gets NPCed.
Dungeons from 1-50 also did nothing but introduce more gil, as you'd just NPC or convert gear. You'd outgrow most of it before ever needing to repair it. New gil is also introduced as a bonus when you do an instance with a first-timer, along with an EXP bonus.
RMT also do nothing BUT introduce gil into the economy by leveling characters (And eventually getting banned), which unfortunately gets circulated into the market through buyers. There's also FATEs, available even after you've done everything else, that continue to introduce gil into the game.

It's funny how you keep telling other people how they don't understand virtual economies, yet fail to explain their error.

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So you're saying only one grade 5 dark matter is enough to repair everyone's gear after an instance run? Did you take in account that it's 4x or 8x repair bills and those coffers aren't handed out to every member of the party. I will give the benefit of the doubt and assume that coffers in an instance introduce slightly more money than repair costs of all party members. Then I also assume that every party member uses dark matters to repair their armor (you know it's not like that in actual scenario).

I can agree with you that RMT introduce more gil into the economy, I did not think about that. But if SE eventually manage to weed out this efficiently, that will not be a valid income anymore.

The 1-50 dungeons give barely any gil and you can't forget the party-wide repair bills, which were low but so were the rewards of the instance.

But as I said, let's assume all those runs will give a slight increase in the economy and not decline. Now let's start looking at the market, a whopping 5% gil decline from the economy for each transaction. There's no way that tiny little increase that comes from instances can out-number the amount of gil sink in both market and teleports.


Also about me telling people that they don't understand economies are aimed to people that make irrelevant posts, it was not aimed towards people that think there's enough gil income into the economy (like you). I'd love to discuss this people like you, that do understand, but disagree with the thread.

The only gil-sink is Repairing. Provided you level your Crafting and Gathering professions, you can repair for free. So, it's really just a race of trying to sustain yourself with the Gil you make from normal stuff until you can do it all yourself for free. Some people think it's reasonable for everyone to have a million gil and be level 50 and raiding Titan HM a week into projected launch, which is stupid. The economy is sustainable potentially because every character has it within their power to be 100% self-sufficient economically.

I have made just over 1 mil on my miner and goldsmith because I was smart enough to realize that crafting would be the best way to go on a new server. Whats the point of rushing to 50 on a battle class when your characters is gonna be gimped the whole way there. Now when I start leveling my Tank every 5 levels he is gonna be pimp. I don't see the point of playing if your not gonna play your character to its full potential.

But with that said there are so many ways to make money with crafting. If you have money issues that is the way to go. Albeit your not gonna make the kinda money I have simply because I went many of nights without sleep to stay ahead of the pack. Then you can charge whatever prices you like , go go monopoly :]

I understand the problem but I think people are overreacting. The game is barely rolling yet. There are a lot of ways they can tweak things if needed. One would hope SE monitors this and makes appropriate tweaks. Of course...at this point, my confidence in SE isn't all that high so maybe the sky IS falling and we're all doomed.

The worst part of this thread is how many people don't understand the original point - not so much the potential impact of that point. It's pretty amazing.

Plus, the OP's "research and analysis" isn't complete. Some agree. Some don't. Some are on another planet.

For ex, not all players will run dungeons. They may just do levels/dailies/fates/whatever in lower quality gear and be gaining gil. Not all players will be reckless with quick travel costs (there are cheaper alternatives). In other words, not all players play exactly the same way and you can't be sure all players will be at net loss. If we're not all at net loss, then the AH can assist with gil redistribution even with fees.

Personally I would rather the economy be tight (but not as tight as the OP thinks it's failing) versus having idiotic amounts of money coming into the system like you see in a lot of MMORPGs.

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Originally Posted by Vyserion

The only gil-sink is Repairing. Provided you level your Crafting and Gathering professions, you can repair for free. So, it's really just a race of trying to sustain yourself with the Gil you make from normal stuff until you can do it all yourself for free. Some people think it's reasonable for everyone to have a million gil and be level 50 and raiding Titan HM a week into projected launch, which is stupid. The economy is sustainable potentially because every character has it within their power to be 100% self-sufficient economically.

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You need mats to repair and they aren't free. Maybe you can gather them. I enjoy crafting and I don't mind gathering but not all players are going to want to be forced into doing something they don't enjoy. Games are supposed to be fun. Plus, I find the repair mechanics to really suck. I don't want to change classes several times and try to find pieces needing repair in the many slots of armory to repair all of my gear. I don't even like the vendor repair mechanics since while leveling I just want a "repair all and I mean all" button.

Plus repairs aren't the only gil sink.

PLUS, I enjoy being self sufficient in MMORPGs but it's something that's bad for the social side of the game. Game design in MMORPGs should encourage player interaction, not discourage it. Sadly so much of FFXIV design all but screams be solo and what did that MM in MMORPG stand for again?

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Originally Posted by Vyserion

The only gil-sink is Repairing. Provided you level your Crafting and Gathering professions, you can repair for free. So, it's really just a race of trying to sustain yourself with the Gil you make from normal stuff until you can do it all yourself for free. Some people think it's reasonable for everyone to have a million gil and be level 50 and raiding Titan HM a week into projected launch, which is stupid. The economy is sustainable potentially because every character has it within their power to be 100% self-sufficient economically.

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You cannot repair for free. Repairing for yourself uses dark matter which you have to buy from vendors. It comes out a bit cheaper, but is not free.

Also, warps and fast travel are gil sinks. The market boards are gill sinks as they take a portion of the payment.

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Originally Posted by FutanXIV

I like how this long ass thread is basically 3 people actually talking about what this thread is about and 100 people saying "SELL THINGS ON THE AH! GAWD". Or in the case of Matsume "GO MAKE ANOTHER CHARACTER AND HAVE ONE OF YOUR FRIENDS HOLD ON TO THAT FEW HUNDRED THOUSAND GIL YOU MADE! GAWD". (You can't send things cross-account champ.)

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I have friends I can trust...If I ever needed to resort to such rudimentary gil making tactics. I'm just saying, there are plenty of ways to make gil. You just haven't found them. The "rhetorical" you, that is.

One thing people seem to be missing is the massive nerf that SE applied to the price of reselling items to NPCs. When ARR was launched, everyone's gil was cut to 10% of their sum total (i.e. if you had 1,000,000Gil you started ARR with 100,000Gil). I hear you already: "But SE cut the costs of everything to 10% so it's all relative and your point is moot" well, yes, but no at the same time.

With the revamp of items, and costs of items, and the resale to NPC price of items, they have nerfed a lot of what was viable to sell to NPC for gil. For example, the incredibly easy and common marmot skins used to NPC for something near 400gil - It was possible to pull in about up to about 10 stacks an hour just smashing these level 1 furries (10 x 99 x 400 = 396,000 gil). So you would think that the 10% rule of ARR = 39,600Gil? Nope... they nerfed the resale price of animal skins to 1Gil - which is now 400gil per hour.

My figures may be slightly off, as I am going from memory, but I remember it used to be a nice, easy and steady source of income - especially for lower levels. There were lots of these kinds of easy to farm, common drop items - Silver ore and obsidian used to drop like mad from the Spriggans, but no more.

Maybe there are efficient ways to generate gil into the economy which haven't been found yet, I don't know. What I do know is that they have nerfed a lot of the old methods.

I really don't see the problem if anything its way too easy to make Gil atm and could use a nerf. I think people are just thinking they are going to be rewarded for not putting hard work into the game.

If you don't like to farm all day like myself, do what I do I have a handful of people I pay 100k each to go out and farm me things. Now I make a ton of money and in return they are making a ton of money. If they don't like playing the market boards its win win for both parties.