Male Viera as a playable character! show your support

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Verethyl

I don't even like the female bunny, I BOUGHT a Fantasia to change back to my AuRa, since I'd used my in-game fantasia to change to viera.

---

Could I ask the reason for it? There is a list of several options I can imagine people don't like but it's always better to ask.

In some recent news, it seems that Viera names are composed of Icelandic names (forename) and their village (surname). However, when they leave the forest they can adopt entirely new names (the case for my character). It seems to be this way for both genders since they didn't really specify anything special for males. There doesn't seem to be anything about Viis names though, to avoid spoilers I would think.

Source: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ng-Conventions

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by grinkdaboy

of course you wouldn't because that would sink your entire argument

---

... What?

Lets walk through this.
This is what you're saying ..

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by grinkdaboy

i'm pretty confident that we're going to get them as the japanese are beholden to the western audience since we are vastly more profitable than their own domestic audience. it's why we even got the hrothgar.

---

As in, you think that they added in Hrothgar souly because "the West" wanted it and because we're more profitable. You literally said they're "beholden" to us and apparently do what we want. So you think that w/e number of players that get vocal about this topic in the West will force them to add them?

Which is funny ... cause I have no clue what they've done that's been credited to appeasing any side of the world only. Like, wut?

And I can't know what JPN wants as I don't speak or read JPN.

Here's what I can say though. This is what they had to say about adding Hrothgar ...

"After seeing the positive reception of the Lupin characters we introduced in Stormblood, we concluded that, for the long-term health of FFXIV, it was important to implement a greater variety of character types beyond the traditionally beautiful in a future expansion. In truth, we had considered adding more beastly characters long before, and since this was possibly our last chance to do so, we decided that we should—much like we did with the Viera—in the interests of expanding the lore and the choices available to players."

(Looking at HW concept art that seems about right. They had hella beastly art for the race that would become scaley bois and gals.)

"Character creation is about providing players with options, and while there’s no telling how many people will utilize these options, we also believe that there is value simply in having them exist—in empowering people to fill the world with greater variety."

"We don’t really need any more cute or sweet looking characters because we have so many as it is.

Especially for FF14, we have many symbols of power or strength such as Highlander and Roegadyns. We wanted something more animal like. Its not that we wanted to create a wild west of characters, but we do need a good variety. So the simple answer is: Viera was sought after so we had to add those. To expand the game and its options, we also wanted to add Hrothgar.”

"We think that an MMO is a game that people with different perspectives can play it worldwide. Final Fantasy games are games that have beautiful characters, but in the same fashion as in FFX, there are races that look rather stronger. I always use “Guin Saga” as an example. Since we are making a fantasy game, we wanted to give spotlight to that aspect, as well. We thought: “Why add more handsome races… even if we do, the biggest difference will be the ears…”. This time, our motive was the voices of players talking about wanting Lupins which were based on the sketch of a “basic wolfman” and released in 4.0. "

These are the reasons we're given.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by reivaxe

Reading through these convo and I guess I'm post the actual statement again.

"The addition of new playable races will impact more than the development cost of the items added in 5.1 and subsequent updates. Not only will we be transitioning from twelve variations (six races, two genders each) to fourteen, but we will also need to commit more resources to the development of new emotes. While FFXIV will continue to strive to maintain a regular 3.5 month major update cycle, we must also ensure that sufficient time is secured for the meticulous development of new content—or else the quality will invariably drop. This is a complex problem that can’t be solved simply by throwing more money or people at it, as it impacts both debugging and QA.

In summary, these are the circumstances which informed my previous statement that this is likely to be the last time we add new playable races; as at this point in time, it is difficult to see us maintaining our patch update schedule if we have to account for more than seven races and two genders (technically six races with two genders and two races with a single gender, but this is the functional equivalent).
----

As you play through Shadowbringers, you’ll learn that both male Viera and female Hrothgar exist. While you won’t meet any in person, if we developers can find a way to address the various problems which are preventing us from implementing them, then perhaps someday you’ll be able to see them for yourself. I want to be clear that this does not mean it will eventually happen, and that I cannot make any promises at this time. I hope you will understand and bear with us."

It's not a singular issue or problem, it's various problems which prevent them from doing it. And even if they were to over come these problems down the line there's no promise that they would bother going through with it.

Many people read this as the most "no without saying no" you can get from a JPN company where as the child Player character stuff is more along the lines of "Never happening, stop asking for it (you sick fs)" as it, in so many words, tells people that they will not do that from a moral stand point. Seems to me some people see the hard NO on kids as reason to think less of not-a-hard-no statement when in actuality that's prob the most nope they can give as it gives them freedom to make them if they so please some day but makes it clear that they aren't doing it for a number of reasons and even if those problems that keep them from doing it are resolved they don't promise it will happen.

---

No matter how many times these Facts are stated, people will ignore them and pretend to know what YoshiP secretly means.
So many times people talk about Budget and Hiring more people, even after Yoshi stated the issue isn't solved by Money and Man-power. But hey....everyone else seems to think they know better.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by grinkdaboy

so then by that logic nobody wants male viera since some people in this thread do not want them

---

He’s just saying he doesn’t buy that it’s true that only western audiences have an interest in more muscular male physiques and masculine aesthetic. All we have to suggest otherwise is anecdote, usually from players claiming some special insight because they speak Japanese, as if it matters - you’d need to take a slightly more statistically sound approach to it than that to infer such a finding.

I don’t doubt that there is a divergence between what is seen as more desirable in western cultures and Japan but at the same time I doubt it’s the yawning chasm some claim it is.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

No matter how many times these Facts are stated, people will ignore them and pretend to know what YoshiP secretly means.
So many times people talk about Budget and Hiring more people, even after Yoshi stated the issue isn't solved by Money and Man-power. But hey....everyone else seems to think they know better.

---

Because it amounts to little more than tea leaf reading. The ‘multiple problems’ they specify all resolve to resource issues. It is a maybe as much as some would like to stamp their feet and insist otherwise. There is no commitment to adding them and that is all there is to it at this point.

Also please don’t pretend as if people who work within the industry itself have not given their input on the comments. I can link these when I’m at my PC in case you want to pretend it didn’t happen.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by official_coconut

In some recent news, it seems that Viera names are composed of Icelandic names (forename) and their village (surname). However, when they leave the forest they can adopt entirely new names (the case for my character). It seems to be this way for both genders since they didn't really specify anything special for males. There doesn't seem to be anything about Viis names though, to avoid spoilers I would think.

Source: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ng-Conventions

---

I just think they didn't say anything about the males since there aren't any males to begin with.
I can guess it's the same thing with Hrothgar woman.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by official_coconut

In some recent news, it seems that Viera names are composed of Icelandic names (forename) and their village (surname). However, when they leave the forest they can adopt entirely new names (the case for my character). It seems to be this way for both genders since they didn't really specify anything special for males. There doesn't seem to be anything about Viis names though, to avoid spoilers I would think.

Source: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ng-Conventions

---

they will probably avoid mentioning the other gender not to get peoples hopes up
and male viera probably have slightly different naming conventions to females

as of this point they don't really leave the forest to adopt a new name

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Evergrey

I just think they didn't say anything about the males since there aren't any males to begin with.
I can guess it's the same thing with Hrothgar woman.

---

Given what Viera female naming conventions are like it doesn't seem like the males ones would be too different, just that the "forest" name would use masculine Icelandic names instead.

Hrothgar females names meanwhile seem like there would be more differences. The Clan names are based on the females for males, but this doesn't seem to indicate whether its the females first or last name and of course what a female who isn't queen's name would be.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dualblade

Given what Viera female naming conventions are like it doesn't seem like the males ones would be too different, just that the "forest" name would use masculine Icelandic names instead.

Hrothgar females names meanwhile seem like there would be more differences. The Clan names are based on the females for males, but this doesn't seem to indicate whether its the females first or last name and of course what a female who isn't queen's name would be.

---

"Female Hellsguard names follow the same rules as those for male names."

If they have been clear about this earlier when genders share the same rules, why wouldn't they do it now aswell?
But as of now no one is either right or wrong.
It could be because there's no males so why even add them to the naming convention.
Or it could be that they do share the same naming convention.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by reivaxe

snip

---

of course they'd never outright say so about the western audience. it's a huge pride thing. look up tom kalinske and sega. viera being a bone for the jp audience and hrothgar a bone for the western audience makes the most sense. hrothgar aren't cute so they wouldn't be very desirable to the majority of japanese people if they were the only race released. i know a very small minority of people would be happy to have them

They appeal to a niche amongst both audiences, though. When you look at Roe figures that becomes clearer. Even if they’re throwing a bone at their western audiences due to the higher uptake in their ranks, it’s not a very large part of them.

It's been stated several times that males exist so there's no sense in spreading the misinformation that there are none. As for "the desirability" of Hrothgar, for me I just needed something that looked bestial for one of my characters, but after trying out Hrothgar I prefer Roegadyn for him. The limitations on Hrothgar's hairstyles frustrate me too much especially after unlocking other hairstyles for him. If I was forced to stick with one character, regardless of gender, it would have to be my Viera one. Their hairs are limited as well, but at least I don't have to spend real money to change it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by official_coconut

It's been stated several times that males exist so there's no sense in spreading the misinformation that there are none. As for "the desirability" of Hrothgar, for me I just needed something that looked bestial for one of my characters, but after trying out Hrothgar I prefer Roegadyn for him. The limitations on Hrothgar's hairstyles frustrate me too much especially after unlocking other hairstyles for him. If I was forced to stick with one character, regardless of gender, it would have to be my Viera one. Their hairs are limited as well, but at least I don't have to spend real money to change it.

---

I think the "no male viera" comments refer to no playable male viera.
And that we haven't seen any male viera ingame either.
In lore they exist. But as character models they do not. So one could say that they "don't exist" and not be completely wrong.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lauront

They appeal to a niche amongst both audiences, though. When you look at Roe figures that becomes clearer. Even if they’re throwing a bone at their western audiences due to the higher uptake in their ranks, it’s not a very large part of them.

---

big hulking beastmen are considered far more cool in the west than in japan. why do you think so many people play horde in wow?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by grinkdaboy

big hulking beastmen are considered far more cool in the west than in japan. why do you think so many people play horde in wow?

---

Blood elves I think.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by grinkdaboy

big hulking beastmen are considered far more cool in the west than in japan. why do you think so many people play horde in wow?

---

Blood Elves

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Blood elves I think.

---

Quoting cause they beat me to it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by official_coconut

It's been stated several times that males exist so there's no sense in spreading the misinformation that there are none. As for "the desirability" of Hrothgar, for me I just needed something that looked bestial for one of my characters, but after trying out Hrothgar I prefer Roegadyn for him. The limitations on Hrothgar's hairstyles frustrate me too much especially after unlocking other hairstyles for him. If I was forced to stick with one character, regardless of gender, it would have to be my Viera one. Their hairs are limited as well, but at least I don't have to spend real money to change it.

---

Hrothgar seemed to scratch the itch the Bara crowd (however small they may be) wanted, as in my experience Roes became a dying breed once Hrothgar came out. Of course that could be because of the new race hype, and we might be seeing roes again, but every would-be Roe is now a Hrothgar, and even Roe lovers I know are making the switch. I think the limitations when it comes to customization is what's ultimately going to shoot the Hrothgar in the foot when it comes to their turnover rate (You mean to tell me you essentially have to pay to change it? That's some Freemium shenanigans right there.). later down the line I have hopes that this will be fixed and SE will slowly start adding more to the races.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by grinkdaboy

big hulking beastmen are considered far more cool in the west than in japan. why do you think so many people play horde in wow?

---

https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...9_Statista.png

i dont play wow but i know Blood elves basically saved Horde

i mean sure, but as the graph shows there's still a large amount of people who like to play monstermen

I can make something that looks more like Beast from the new Beauty and the Beast movie from 2017 using a Hellsguard roegadyn and not have to worry about tail clipping problems or not being able to use the more "princely" hairstyles like the braid with the red tie, the new mgp hair, default super long hair with the leather circlet, and several others I miss. On the subject of Blood Elves I do think that sort of physique and aesthetic would suit male Viera. Their hairstyles are beautiful, but I would prefer ones without such ornaments.

I disliked both of the major factions in WoW. Their existence always felt contrived. I did play a blood elf as a main character, though, since they were the most interesting to me on both a story and aesthetic level. Plus masculine, rugged elves are neat!

I wouldn't consider the amount of people interested in bestial races to be 'small', though. There's definitely demand there - and a lot of the JRPG's I played growing up contained at least one as a playable character.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

I disliked both of the major factions in WoW. Their existence always felt contrived. I did play a blood elf as a main character, though, since they were the most interesting to me on both a story and aesthetic level. Plus masculine, rugged elves are neat!

I wouldn't consider the amount of people interested in bestial races to be 'small', though. There's definitely demand there - and a lot of the JRPG's I played growing up contained at least one as a playable character.

---

certainly, i agree, and i would've liked something more like a lupin as opposed to a shorter roegadyn with a lion head on it. i've been saying this whole time that the hrothgar were more to appeal to westerners. if they had used a modified aura body or had a physique more like khimari, i'd probably be playing that as opposed to patiently waiting for male viera. i know he was pretty muscular but he wasn't built like a fridge like roegadyn are

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by grinkdaboy

certainly, i agree, and i would've liked something more like a lupin as opposed to a shorter roegadyn with a lion head on it. i've been saying this whole time that the hrothgar were more to appeal to westerners. if they had used a modified aura body or had a physique more like khimari, i'd probably be playing that as opposed to patiently waiting for male viera. i know he was pretty muscular but he wasn't built like a fridge like roegadyn are

---

I think they made them mroe human like because I think SE was too afraid to push the envelope too much, so in the end they took the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" approach and stuck to their comfort zone, humans with additional features. I feel like Charr are Hrothgar done right, as I adore the Charr.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by grinkdaboy

certainly, i agree, and i would've liked something more like a lupin as opposed to a shorter roegadyn with a lion head on it. i've been saying this whole time that the hrothgar were more to appeal to westerners. if they had used a modified aura body or had a physique more like khimari, i'd probably be playing that as opposed to patiently waiting for male viera. i know he was pretty muscular but he wasn't built like a fridge like roegadyn are

---

I was hoping that they would be along the lines of Byakko. Minus the weird tiger arm. The final result does seem to be closer to the Japanese aesthetic of 'bara' than a Western design to me, though.

I like muscle, but around the point of a Highlander guy is roughly the limit of what I enjoy. Anything too far beyond that it ends up becoming too much and weirdly proportioned for my tastes.

well its pretty clear why they went the direction they did with Hrothgar,
most players who wanted a beast like race were mainly Roe players so its not a surprise that Hrothgar are similar to Roes,
they are fine how they are really besides the obvious hair issues.

you can kinda tell what Male viera will be like considering most request are from miqote and Midlanders

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

I was hoping that they would be along the lines of Byakko. Minus the weird tiger arm. The final result does seem to be closer to the Japanese aesthetic of 'bara' than a Western design to me, though.

I like muscle, but around the point of a Highlander guy is roughly the limit of what I enjoy. Anything too far beyond that it ends up becoming too much and weirdly proportioned for my tastes.

---

Byakko has always creeped me out. So creepy, butt naked and with weird arm.

https://media.tenor.com/images/91c7a...227f/tenor.gif

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duskane

well its pretty clear why they went the direction they did with Hrothgar,
most players who wanted a beast like race were mainly Roe players so its not a surprise that Hrothgar are similar to Roes,
they are fine how they are really besides the obvious hair issues.

you can kinda tell what Male viera will be like considering most request are from miqote and Midlanders

---

Male Viera being similar to Miqo'te would be amazing imo, but I don't think they'd be that short. Stretch them out a little first.

male miqo'te have a pretty decent amount of muscle
and since male viera would be somewhat tall it would be much more noticeable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by official_coconut

In some recent news, it seems that Viera names are composed of Icelandic names (forename) and their village (surname). However, when they leave the forest they can adopt entirely new names (the case for my character). It seems to be this way for both genders since they didn't really specify anything special for males. There doesn't seem to be anything about Viis names though, to avoid spoilers I would think.

Source: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ng-Conventions

---

Rava tribe seems to have FFXII inspired names, though (short and often having only one vowel among few consonants. Which has sense, since they look more like XII Vieras.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duskane

male miqo'te have a pretty decent amount of muscle

---

say this to those who continues to define them as "Miqos are feminine twinks" or "they are just less feminine females" (exaggerating a little bit but ahem) @_@

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Halivel

say this to those who continues to define them as "Miqos are feminine twinks" or "they are just less feminine females" (exaggerating a little bit but ahem) @_@

---

i mean they can be
male miqo'te is the most versatile race there is they can be anything and it would look fine on them

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gwenorai

The only meme I know from this is the homosexual adult film bara meme. Could be related, Hrothgar fills that niche now since a good portion of the Roe's switched to them. Either that or something that's isn't on my meme radar.

Edit- Googled it, came up with Yugioh? Might be that. My cash is on the bara meme though.

---

After all, male hrotgar are here and a good 70%/60% of its players, from what I've seen, are just playing them because they like furry bara

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by reivaxe

Of course if you have your heart set on it you read it as a maybe. But it's not that B/W.

I personally couldn't care less about Male Viera as I think it adds nothing that's not already in the game ( I come here for the lulz) BUT I actually really want Fem Hrothgar. The dudes are so cool that for the first time ever I'm playing as my own gender in an MMO and I'd like to see what they do with the females cause I'd prob play that to (plus a RL friend of mine wants her kitty girl to upgrade into a cat WOMAN). Thing is I'm not "consumed" with it nor do I have some personal stack in their inclusion ... nor do I see this exclusion as a personal attack or w/e so I'm not looking for a "yes" where ever I can find it.

Plus I'm the kinda person who when asked "Are you coming?" may say "We'll see .." which is my way of saying "Nope". Because I'm this way I've found it fairly easy to read answers like this as "Nope" with great accuracy through basic use of reading comprehension from a pragmatic PoV.


Plus there's the people who read it as "Well, we know that unless they find a way around all these problems RIGHT NOW you can't expect to see them before 7.0 ... so wth is the point in spinning your wheels for 4 years, being worked up about it? It's so far away that even if you think it's coming you might as well take it as a no and move on lol".

Not everyone who doesn't think it's happening or worth getting worked up over is "anti" w/e.



I wouldn't say that's the case at all.

---

Interesting how u talk like if u were SE and knew that its gonna take at least 4 years. Specially interesting considering that the genders we currently have took 1.5 and for obvious resource reasons the new ones will likely take even less

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Blood elves I think.

---

Right, but in WoW there's still a lot of beast race players. I think that is clear that the anime/japanese audience wants sexy bunny husbandos and waifus, while the western wants cool unique interesting races

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duskane

well its pretty clear why they went the direction they did with Hrothgar,
most players who wanted a beast like race were mainly Roe players so its not a surprise that Hrothgar are similar to Roes,
they are fine how they are really besides the obvious hair issues.

you can kinda tell what Male viera will be like considering most request are from miqote and Midlanders

---

There's also a lot of male au ra tho. I think that male viera will be similar to the concept art in build, considering that most ppl seem to like that idea a lot

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Komarimono

Honestly I feel you're just reaching for anything at this point. Very few are even seeing how any of his words can be quoted to imply that, unless taken out of context, which I fear you and others have done. And things taken out of context lose there full meaning and can be construed in a manner that supports a point when the original content was not meant to support it.

---

But if he means no, why not say no? He is quite able to do that with other stuff so why not here? Why give different opinions in different interviews?

It might be in japanese culture to not say outright no (but again he did that with other topics) but he is not just dealing with a JP audience. As long as a comment is in anyway not fully clear and can be read differently then its onto the one that did the statement to correct themselves. Otherwise people should be allowed to take their view on it. In the end he stated different things on different sites and interviews. Seemingly if everything is clear and we wont ever get them, then its kinda misleading to talk about it like that, right?

(Also since hearing that the JP players do have black lists outside the game which will make it bad for anyone ever getting there and that Yoshida keeps his life privat to shield his family from some fans..I really cringe a bit at those wanting to put the JP side on a pedestal. They have their own bad side too)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duskane

well its pretty clear why they went the direction they did with Hrothgar,
most players who wanted a beast like race were mainly Roe players so its not a surprise that Hrothgar are similar to Roes,
they are fine how they are really besides the obvious hair issues.

you can kinda tell what Male viera will be like considering most request are from miqote and Midlanders

---

I'm pretty sure it's because they are based of the Ronso. And most of them were big and muscular.
Doubt it had much to do with people playing Roes and wanting a beast race.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Evergrey

I'm pretty sure it's because they are based of the Ronso. And most of them were big and muscular.
Doubt it had much to do with people playing Roes and wanting a beast race.

---

Maybe but it feels to me that calling them Ronso in the first was a bit more of a after thought
Since only one can really have a horn you think all 4 could have that option

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

I was hoping that they would be along the lines of Byakko. Minus the weird tiger arm. The final result does seem to be closer to the Japanese aesthetic of 'bara' than a Western design to me, though.

I like muscle, but around the point of a Highlander guy is roughly the limit of what I enjoy. Anything too far beyond that it ends up becoming too much and weirdly proportioned for my tastes.

---

Interesting, so you see Highlanders as the max amount of muscles to what you enjoy but still wanted Byakko type for Hrothgar? And seeing some posts here (especially with Sturms art) even that type for Viera?

I am just a bit curious because I honestly thougth with the posts in this thread that you wanted really muscled men and that Midlanders, Elezen or even Highlanders was not enough for male Viera.

But I agree with you, I find that muscles beyond Highlanders often turn out a bit strange. (Not that people cant like that)

Of course any male Viera is better than none but I still hope that they fit with the females.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Evergrey

I'm pretty sure it's because they are based of the Ronso. And most of them were big and muscular.
Doubt it had much to do with people playing Roes and wanting a beast race.

---

The ronso were big and all, but much more athletic and thin