i think both sides can argue which is more important, content or battle/class balance. but in the end. both issues are important. it really doesn't matter which one gets implemented first because the other side is just gonna make a post saying "i want more defined classes and better combat". they want content but yet they want a balanced battle system that can allow them to group xp more efficiently to get to endgame content.
the only thing we can do now is wait for the battle system adjustments and then content and stop complaining about doing it the other way around
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03-30-2011, 05:56 AMGabbaGabba
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03-30-2011, 06:03 AMBelgianRofl
The only way to explain why the population is dropping like flies is that people are unhappy with what is in the game at this current moment. If things were different now, people wouldn't be leaving.
You and I both agree that this game needs HUUUUUUGE amounts of content... Is it really that unreasonable to think that any battle-related content should be held off until after the battle system is changed?
I have no objections to implementing an Auction House, player housing, chocobo's, gambling houses, mini-games, airships in the meantime.
Because the majority of time spent in Eorzea is in battle, and because the overwhelming majority of people are in favor of changing the fundamental aspects of the game, and because people are leaving left and right, something needs to be done about the class/battle system so the developers can get to work on everything else that's going to make this game great. -
03-30-2011, 06:04 AMAbriaelI'm perfectly fine with the way they're doing it now:Quote:
Originally Posted by GabbaGabba
IE: taking their time to bring out polished major updates (whatever they are) when they're ready, and not "right now!" as someone demads. "Right now" is not only not realistic, but also damaging, since hurried content tends to be unpolished and fail at the impact with the community.
The launch of FFXIV (and many other games) should have thaought a lesson to some. Yoshida seems to have learned the lesson, thankfully. -
03-30-2011, 06:10 AMBelgianRofl
I agree that things should take time. FF14's been in development for 5+years...
The major question and point of the thread is, does SE have enough time to fix this situation?
What is a solution to dealing with challenges when you have limited time? Devote more resources and manpower. -
03-30-2011, 06:19 AMMalakhimEnough time for what? They aren't on any deadline as far as I'm aware of.Quote:
Originally Posted by BelgianRofl
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03-30-2011, 06:23 AMElexiaThey don't have limited time.Quote:
Originally Posted by BelgianRofl
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03-30-2011, 06:25 AMAbriaelReally? mind quoting where? Wanting something else adressed *first* doesn't mean thinking that there's no problem. Also, I do think that *radical* changes are not really needed (mind you, I use first person singular, since i don't need to use "we" to add some false weight to my personal opinion), while an evolution of the current system would be a better solution.Quote:
Originally Posted by BelgianRofl
I am also pretty sure that the ones that expect the system to change from night to day will be sorely disappointed and need to start preparing for that, because Yoshida clearly stated that they aren't just going to scrap the current system and add a completely new one in multiple occasions (and it wouldn't even be realistic, both time and resources-wise).
People also would like to win the lottery. And winning the lottery would actually be easier than making significant changes to a sensible system like the battle system of a MMORPG "Immediately".Quote:
It also seems like you're trying to argue that people do not want these changes to be made immediately.
Most poll participants understand that such changes take time, and don't put speed as their top priority, as the poll clearly shows and as any realistic and logical approach would dictate.
Nice hyperbole. "Dropping like flies" does not reflect in any way the current situation of the game. Actually I've noticed a quite visible increase of population since when the servers reopened. Not surprisingly.Quote:
The only way to explain why the population is dropping like flies is that people are unhappy with what is in the game at this current moment. If things were different now, people wouldn't be leaving.
In any case, the real way to make population "drop like flies" would be hurry the changes you want so much excessively, releasing them unfinished and unpolished, and burning the chance to satisfy the current players and bring back past ones.
Yes, It's unreasanable for a single reason. grinding endlessly is boring whether you have an awesome battle system or a mediocre one. Every repeatitive action is, on the long run, and grinding with a battle system that offers diversity and shingles is still boring.Quote:
You and I both agree that this game needs HUUUUUUGE amounts of content... Is it really that unreasonable to think that any battle-related content should be held off until after the battle system is changed?
The people that quit do so for a reason. Because they're bored.
The majority of the time spent in eorzea is in battle because there ain't anything else worthwile to do for the ones that don't particularly enjoy crafting.Quote:
Because the majority of time spent in Eorzea is in battle, and because the overwhelming majority of people are in favor of changing the fundamental aspects of the game, and because people are leaving left and right, something needs to be done about the class/battle system so the developers can get to work on everything else that's going to make this game great.
In any case, while I hate to resort to this argument, you really can't gauge the quality of the current battle system at level 15. At low levels battle is overly simple in every game.
Personally, the current battle system isn't definitely as bad as you describe it. It's very technical (And I'm sure some will find it difficult due to stamina management), but it's not terrible, and nowhere one of the worst in the market. It needs to be evolved, but that can easily be (and it will probably be) done gradually.
People being favorable to fundamental changes of the game as opposed to not wanting them means nothing (especially considering how generic a definition that is). It doesn't mean that they want them FIRST, especially when just three questions above the majority clearly stated that they want content first.
Mind you, content itself IS a fundamental change of the rules of the game. Now a "fundamental rule of the game" is that you have to do endless guildleves and grinding to level up (few rules in an online game are more fundamental than the ways of progression). Adding more content would change that rule.
Belgian. Good games hit the market every month. This year is nowhere different from any other year past and future. I would say that risking to completely burn ANY chance to fix the situation because of some ancestral fear of the competition, that always existed, currently exists, and always will exist, is quite a lot worse than losing players to that competition.Quote:
Originally Posted by BelgianRofl
Players will always set a game aside to play other games. Very few gamers are entirely dedicated to one. Today I played three different games (Shogun 2, Yakuza 4, and now FFXIV) since I had a day off.
Whatever Square Enix does with FFXIV, I will still play quite a few of the games you listed. Even if they came out tomorrow with a masterfully concealed superupdate that made FFXIV the best MMORPG in the world, that wouldn't stop me from purchasing and playing them.
No matter if SE implements the game tomorrow or in two months. There will always be other good or alluring games in the market. The biggest one is called WoW. And it's already out. -
03-30-2011, 06:35 AMEvenstarYea, but Belgianrofl (THINKS) he knows better. The guy acts like developing game is like taking a walk in the park. He can not say one positive word about SE or FF. However he is online 24/7 to start new topics about FFXIV and SE and how much they suck. Do not waste your time trying to discuss with him. He got a tunnel vision.Quote:
Originally Posted by Abriael
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03-30-2011, 06:43 AMBelgianRofl
I am a fan of Square-Enix. I am not a Square-Enix fanboy.
Final Fantasy 10 was my first Final Fantasy. It is one of my top 3 favorite games of all time. I spent an entire summer learning how to play Zanarkand on the piano - having never played piano before.
FFXI was my first MMO. In my opinion, it is the best MMO out there. It has some major problems but considering my incredibly favorable impression of Square-Enix, I had assumed that SE would take what it's learned from it's 8 years of FFXI and release the best MMO for years to come.
I will not just support something right or wrong. Stand for something, or you'll fall for anything. -
03-30-2011, 06:48 AMAbriaelUnfortunately Square Enix did learn a lesson fron Final Fantasy XI: That you can release a game much before it's ready and patch it after, and still be successful.Quote:
Originally Posted by BelgianRofl
I'm sure many would love a FFXI-2. Personally, I can only applaud the choice to try to innovate the model. I played FFXI for 6 years. That's plenty to get bored, even when a game is great. And FFXI was. But still, after 6 years, I found myself bored.
Incidentally, the MMO that I think is the best in the market is Dark Age of Camelot. I'm quite glad to see that Yoshida agrees :D