Very Hard To Acquire Money (Gil) In This Game

Back then I've tried to count how many shards I could get within 10 minutes, that's around 80 shards. 1 hours = 480 Shards.

In my server it's a shard usually valued 40 Gills :(, Keep farming shards for 52 hours, and Pop you will have 1 million gills to your pocket :p

Well then again this is not generating gills, but taking gills from other players.

It's taking money from crafters, who in turn take their money from leves. So yeah you can make money off of them, they are generating money all the time.

The easiest thing I've found to do is check the markets and see what sells for decent and farm it. I've been doing that with a certain item for the past two days and made about 200k in 2 hours worth of farming. Fortunately for me these mobs are not over camped so maybe I'm just lucky.

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Originally Posted by Slatervonjager

This is simply...

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That's the nature of the MMO. People who focus on crafting, farming and studying the market will have way better opportunity than people who just want to play the game like it's Diablo. Well, this isn't Diablo. You can't just play some dungeons and expect plenty of money to flow in. You have to work for it. You can level any craft to 15 in like 30 minutes or less. There are quite a few crafts at those low levels that can make some ok gil. If you say you don't want to do it, fine. But don't expect gil to be flying in from everywhere either.

Even still, if you don't craft or gather, you can still farm. Gather those items that the crafters don't want to farm for themselves. It seems like every major skin is worth a good bit. Go kill some raptors. There's also the option of just buying items from NPCs and reselling them for a profit on the market. I make about 50k a day simply reselling items I purchased from NPCs.

Yeah you can call me ignorant all you want, or people who "don't want to do" whatever makes decent money, but that's their fault. Sometimes you don't always get to do what you want 100%, so if gathering is boring to you, either suck it up to make some money and then take a break from it for awhile or don't do it and choose another avenue. Go kill stuff for fleece, snurble tufts, diremite thread, etc. etc., or run CM and buy coke/animal fat/etc. to sell for 40-50k per every second CM run. That's potentially 75k an hour right there. Just tired of people complaining for what essentially amounts to them either being lazy or not even trying to understand how to make money, and then coming here to complain that the game is fundamentally flawed when it is actually their own deficiency.

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Originally Posted by Beefsteak

That's merely taking Gil from other players, while good in the short term it'll slow down in the long term.

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People say this all the time... but as long as I'm rich, why do I care if my money came from other players and not from the game?

Rich people don't get rich or stay rich by spending all their money. I have turned into a cheap bastard, in game, as of recently, and it's paying off. I don't get from point a to point b as fast as possible, and I rarely have BIS items, but I'm sitting on a growing purse.

I've been using my GC seals for all my gear, riding my own mount wherever I go, and only teleporting to places set as favorites, and only when I plan on being there long enough to recoup the money spent getting there.

It's not rocket science, it's budgeting.

1) If you don't have time to play. Don't play MMOs (Or go play WoW). The complexity of MMOs has dropped significantly because people like you think you should have access to the entire game with minimal effort, or worse, doing only the stuff you like. You get what you work for.

2) If you're a dungeon runner and that's all you care about, there's several great single player RPGs that are basically the same thing, but better. Dark Souls is plenty hard if mean boss fights make you randy.

Bottom line. In a year, or 2 years. I still want to be working towards something. Maybe even my Relic +1 (college slows me down). I do not want to be on another rollercoaster (WoW) where the only thing worth doing is farming the latest raid to come out, only to replace it in 3-5 months, because everything else is handed to me on a welfare system, with worthless crafting skills that provide no real benefit.

If you don't like having to put extra work in, quit. Go. This isn't the game for you. Stop coming here in droves and driving every new MMO to come out intp obscurity because in 6 months you've achieved everything.

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Originally Posted by Riot55

people who "don't want to do" whatever makes decent money, but that's their fault.

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You assume that all players have the time to dedicate to doing so. There are those who cannot do so. Not everyone has the time to dedicate to doing all of that. You cannot expect people to do everything, if they do not posses the ability to do so.

And again, and this is something all of you who say "go craft/gather/farm" seem to fail at understanding, if everyone does plays the MB, then NO ONE WILL MAKE MONEY IN THIS GAME! It's easy enough to make money by selling for way less then the obvious RMTs on the MB, but if everyone starts crafting/gathering/farming and selling on MB, guess what, now the entire server is competing against one another, and then no one is buying, meaning that no one is making any money. And then we ALL have the same problem.

if you are unable to participate in all of the content then you shouldn't expect to to get all the rewards

Question: When you say to make money crafting/Gathering, How do you make that money?

Is it though selling ii on the market wards? If so, where does that money that bought the item come from?

Usually from other players.

Point is Yoshi-P has admitted there needs to be more gil generators in the game. Especially since he is going to be adding in another huge gil sink. Housing. It took me a while to understand what other people were talking about regarding this issue but now I understand its about introducing new Gil into the game to counter all the gil coming out of the game (MW tax, Repairs, teleporting, etc.)

He has some big fixes coming our way for patch 2.1 and he will try to implement what little fixes he can before then. Hopefully the forums don't completely lose their heads before then.

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Originally Posted by Slatervonjager

You assume that all players have the time to dedicate to doing so. There are those who cannot do so. Not everyone has the time to dedicate to doing all of that. You cannot expect people to do everything, if they do not posses the ability to do so.

And again, and this is something all of you who say "go craft/gather/farm" seem to fail at understanding, if everyone does plays the MB, then NO ONE WILL MAKE MONEY IN THIS GAME! It's easy enough to make money by selling for way less then the obvious RMTs on the MB, but if everyone starts crafting/gathering/farming and selling on MB, guess what, now the entire server is competing against one another, and then no one is buying, meaning that no one is making any money. And then we ALL have the same problem.

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Please take an econ 101 class. This made me face palm so hard. You could apply this same awful logic to real life.

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Originally Posted by ZakarnRosewood

Question: When you say to make money crafting/Gathering, How do you make that money?

Is it though selling ii on the market wards? If so, where does that money that bought the item come from?

Usually from other players.

Point is Yoshi-P has admitted there needs to be more gil generators in the game. Especially since he is going to be adding in another huge gil sink. Housing. It took me a while to understand what other people were talking about regarding this issue but now I understand its about introducing new Gil into the game to counter all the gil coming out of the game (MW tax, Repairs, teleporting, etc.)

He has some big fixes coming our way for patch 2.1 and he will try to implement what little fixes he can before then. Hopefully the forums don't completely lose their heads before then.

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I do agree there needs to be more gil generators. And about that one, Tradecraft leve some of them does give you a good amount of gill

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Originally Posted by busta

Please take an econ 101 class. This made me face palm so hard. You could apply this same awful logic to real life.

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You need to take that class yourself, if you think i'm wrong. in the real world, not everyone does the same thing. You have people with particular skills, that work in certain areas, trade occurs, money transfers, economy can grow or shrink, etc.

in an MMO, in which EVERYONE ends up doing the same thing, there is no demand for anything. If we all do crafting and gathering and farming, what need is there to buy from others, who are doing the same thing, and they in turn have no need to buy either. At the same time, we're ALL TRYING TO SELL. No money is trading hands, no trade is made, Economy dies.

Sorry, you have no clue what you're talking about, because it doesn't apply to real life, because in real life, not everyone is capable of being a blacksmith, a farmer, a seamstress, etc. GJ not thinking your reply through.

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Originally Posted by Theref

I do agree there needs to be more gil generators. And about that one, Tradecraft leve some of them does give you a good amount of gill

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For sure, there are some gil fountains in the game but they barely keep up with things as it is. Wait till housing comes out. They know its an issues and they are addressing it. Patience is needed but again, that fountain seems dry with most people.

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Originally Posted by Slatervonjager

in an MMO, in which EVERYONE ends up doing the same thing, there is no demand for anything. If we all do crafting and gathering and farming, what need is there to buy from others, who are doing the same thing, and they in turn have no need to buy either. At the same time, we're ALL TRYING TO SELL. No money is trading hands, no trade is made, Economy dies.

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Wait? So I'm not the only one HQing level 29 boots for casters? The whole server is doing it too?

Widen your scope. Crafting and gathering has a massive diversity, to which your argument doesn't apply.

This topic's been visited over and over. There are definitely a lot more gil-sinks than traditional gil-generating mechanisms in the end game. Crafting is all fine and good, and helps, but it wouldn't hurt to have additional end game dailies or dungeon/raid dailies that produce some gil to offset these repair bills. Crafting should not be the one and only way to combat poverty.

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Originally Posted by avaughnimous

This topic's been visited over and over. There are definitely a lot more gil-sinks than traditional gil-generating mechanisms in the end game. Crafting is all fine and good, and helps, but it wouldn't hurt to have additional end game dailies or dungeon/raid dailies that produce some gil to offset these repair bills. Crafting should not be the one and only way to combat poverty.

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And it's not. There's FATEs, Leves, GC Leves, Guildhests, and mob farming for crafter's mats.

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Originally Posted by Jeht

Widen your scope. Crafting and gathering has a massive diversity, to which your argument doesn't apply.

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Right now, no the whole server isn't doing it. If the whole server does, it creates a dead economy. Do you understand why? It's because if everyone is doing it all, then there is no dependence on each other. Seriously. If we all do crafting and gathering, it slowly starts to create less demand, and dependence goes down. Eventually, there is no more dependence on each other, as we do it all by ourselves. the player economy dies thanks that the simple fact that there is no longer demand to meet the supply.

So glad the economy experts here are able to understand the issue with everyone doing all skills. What ever would we do without people who posses no real marketable skills, and have never actually had to play the real world economy to survive.

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Originally Posted by Beefsteak

That's merely taking Gil from other players, while good in the short term it'll slow down in the long term.

The main problem is there's very little in the way of repeatable quests (Leve's give very little Gil when you have to buy things like Bait for Fisher).

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Or make bait from the fish you catch?

Leves don't "give very little gil," they "give gil." That's the aspect to this you may be missing. If you did leves while leveling, while crafting, and while gathering, then you should be shovelling it onto your retainers for storage. I'm merely depleted of my leve income from pushing GSM and MIN up and procuring materials to help my FC make gear. But I barely had to touch my leveling income from my main job, nor have I liquidated more than 30k from picking up only the coins from quest rewards. There is a lot of open accessible methods of making money in this game, keeping the economy strong by keeping the money moving. You don't have to amass all the moneys, as that is some rather idiotic bad economic perspective; you just need to have a nice amount that you invest into product to then sell, making it back, and keeping things aflow. Use your effing brains, man!

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Originally Posted by Slatervonjager

So glad the economy experts here are able to understand the issue with everyone doing all skills. What ever would we do without people who posses no real marketable skills, and have never actually had to play the real world economy to survive.

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There are 1680 recipes listed.

Source: http://xivdb.com/?search/!filters/IlJFQ0lQRVMi

People craft things to make money. Then spend on that money on things they either don't have the craft for, or are to lazy to make. And if you think people aren't lazy, you don't know jack about MMO economies, where plenty of people make money off of lazy people. And not just a little money. I must reiterate MMO ECONOMIES. Because the real world doesn't apply here.

In your perfect screw up of a world, everyone would have every craft leveled to max, have the time and patience to farm every mat they need, and actually do it on top of everything else the game has to offer.

If anything it's too easy to get gil v.v...

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Originally Posted by Jeht

There are 1680 recipes listed...

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No one is saying that there are not lazy people, in fact, everyone saying 'go farm/craft/gather' is calling people that wont lazy. But again, if everyone is crafting/gathering/farming, it creates, *gasp* less demand, which in turn causes the economy to shrink, and players make less money. Still a VERY big issue. No matter what you can say, whether it be laziness, or everyone doing everything, it still creates a hindrance to the economy.

It's a game economy, not a real world economy, trying to act like it is a real economy is pointless, as the same limitations do not apply, and there are no where near as many marketable trades and skills in the game.

It'd be nice if mobs dropped gil, but alas, that's not the case. I had saved up over 200k for my potential house and now it's gone down to 15k with repair bills. It's actually made me not want to play the game as much as there really is nothing to sustain the costs. Yeah, I'm a carpenter and botanist and probably will go into other things, but considering how prices drop so much on the market and I've had stuff that's stayed in the market for well over a week or two now says a lot. I don't want to feel like a game is a job. I already have a job and uni. Last thing I want to do is come home and feel like I'm working another job. There's no fun in that.

These crafters still don't get it.

Locke Cole, the treasure hunter can't make any money from treasures he got from all the ancient ruins and dungeons because merchants buying everything for 1 gil. then a carpenter appears and tell him to become a carpenter like him to make millions of gil so Locke abandoned his dream job and becomes a carpenter and live peacefully in Narshe. Game Over.

is that what RPG supposed to be?

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Originally Posted by Slatervonjager

*gasp* less demand

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As a leve farmer, I would welcome more competition in the market. Why? It makes me more likely to spend gil on the AH to buy gear which works against your shrinking argument. Demand would go up because it would fall into a more reasonable range.

As a crafter I would welcome more competition because then I could spend a portion of my profits buying the mats, instead of farming, saving me time.

As practically ANYONE in game. I would welcome more people gathering, crafting, and buying because it means a healthy MB that has materials, gear, and affordable prices, and because of affordable prices, reverses the loss of demand.

The only thing I see in your argument is that there won't be massively huge profits in it.

Competition is not bad. In fact, it's always good for servers. No competition means Gilsellers and jerks can screw over everyone to make enough money to fund a small nation.

Also, by more competition bringing down prices (and profits) it increases the feasibility of farming fates and leves for gil. As it stands, because people don't want to craft, crafters are making way more profit.

There is enough gil coming in with the repair prices lowered. Where it's going now is into the hands of crafting who are dominating all of the raiders who are dropping their initial freebie money on gear sets to do the raids.

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Originally Posted by Evangela

These crafters still don't get it.

Locke Cole, the treasure hunter can't make any money from treasures he got from all the ancient ruins and dungeons because merchants buying everything for 1 gil. then a carpenter appears and tell him to become a carpenter like him to make millions of gil so Locke abandoned his dream job and becomes a carpenter and live peacefully in Narshe. Game Over.

is that what RPG supposed to be?

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The game currently is pushing for this. More or less.

I generally dislike using the AH to make currency in a game but I find myself using it more often lately to get gil from wherever the other players are slowly getting it from.

There is no real self-sustainability of pure combat adventuring in this game, as far as I became aware from my experience and of those I know (that are already at end game).
Leves until level 40 are a joke in terms of gil reward, can't speak for end-game leves my self, but the people that are there, say it's the same.
Repairs, even reduced as they are from the last patch, consistently cost more than you get from fate/dungeon/world combat if you ignore selling on the AH (alegan pieces, random gear pieces to sell to npc, mats (that are worth zilch to sell to npc), fate/dungeon gil rewards).

Currently I'm letting other people bring money into the economy and I'm just attempting to get that gil via the AH by selling stuff.

I've yet to ever buy anything from the AH, and I will avoid it 100% lest I'm swimming in gil at one point or another.
If this is wrong, and I'm supposed to "circulate" the money, no thanks, I've never done so unless I'm very comfortable with my "fortune", which rarely happens.
I've never been a big ah player and adventuring doesn't bring in any significant currency in most games, just enough to slowly go up if you're not doing terribly stupid things (like constant raid wipe + buying consumables and eating through them like candy).

We'll see what happens, for the average player that does no crafting/gathering and thus has very little to sell on the AH, GIL for repairs is still an issue as far as I understood.
I can even feel it from my low level perspective if all I do is dungeons/fates for a short while (ignoring quests of any kind). I quickly find myself going down in gil, visibly.

Many people are really used to other modern mmos, where repairs are barely any hindrance unless you die non-stop (heavy raiding environment).
Thus the mechanics in this game feel terribly cumbersome to having fun, even with simple dungeon-farming.
And, to some extent, I feel the same.

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Originally Posted by GabrielK

Repairs, even reduced as they are from the last patch, consistently cost more than you get from fate/dungeon/world combat if you ignore selling on the AH (alegan pieces, random gear pieces to sell to npc, mats (that are worth zilch to sell to npc), fate/dungeon gil rewards).

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I'm a 47 Paladin, and a good tank. Unless it's an AoE I'm the only one taking damage. Which means my repairs are quite a bit more than others. Between fates, leves, and allagan pieces, I've made 20k+ profit in the last few days. My repairs are never more than 2k now. Which I make tripping on my way to the next quest hub.

At level 33 I have 65 K, and that's after spending a good amount on black dye, since I can only get it on the market. Does it start getting bad in the endgame?

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Originally Posted by Jeht

I'm a 47 Paladin, and a good tank. Unless it's an AoE I'm the only one taking damage. Which means my repairs are quite a bit more than others. Between fates, leves, and allagan pieces, I've made 20k+ profit in the last few days. My repairs are never more than 2k now. Which I make tripping on my way to the next quest hub.

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Leves can help you break even or even make a slight profit if you don't play that much (thus repairs are not piling up during one day).
However if you don't touch leves (combat leves, ugh), especially in end game in full blue/green gear, it's a bit of a different story, no ?
I personally don't like leves much, outside of what I'm doing for crafting. Thus I avoid them like the plague on my war/magic classes. (gathering leves seem crap so I don't bother wasting allowances on it)
So if I wasn't doing leves for crafting I'd probably not even touch them, outside of fear of running out of gil. Then again I strongly dislike combat leves so... gah ! :)

In any case, currently I'm "almost on the fence" on the issue since it doesn't affect me personally yet.
I've not reached a breaking point (no gil crysis) and will reevaluate things once I get into end-game on at least some of my classes and see how I fare there after 4-6 hours of pure combat adventuring.

Leve quest is best way for long run,you just need know which one to pick. at the end all crafter will lose money.

level armorer to 20, do high quality leve quests every day, there you go 24k every day, want even more? make a second character and do it on them too.

People that don't take this seriously are either

A) Not level 50 or have only been level 50 for a week

B) Those making money off other people via Marketplace

There is no decent way to produce gil via PvE, at the moment gil is moving around based on what people have acquired through the story and soon enough the economy will crash.

Mobs need to drop gil and items that sell for decent amounts to vendors
Leves need to give way more gil
Fates need to give way more gil

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Originally Posted by GabrielK

(gathering leves seem crap so I don't bother wasting allowances on it)
So if I wasn't doing leves for crafting I'd probably not even touch them, outside of fear of running out of gil. Then again I strongly dislike combat leves so... gah ! :)

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Weavers have been making 17k on a single crafting leve by turning in HQ gear.

FYI, turning in HQ items increases rewards BY A LOT. My girlfriend got 10k from a level 15 turn in on weaving.

EDIT: Reached daily limit.

I don't have a screenshot of my girlfriends, but she got 10k for a weaver leve. Not sure which one.

The 17k was also from a weaver leve. Last I heard there's something special about weaver leves. It's worth googling.

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Originally Posted by Jeht

Weavers have been making 17k on a single crafting leve by turning in HQ gear.

FYI, turning in HQ items increases rewards BY A LOT. My girlfriend got 10k from a level 15 turn in on weaving.

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I've done the 3 HQ item HQ turn in on Goldsmith and at best it bumps me by 1.2k gil. I don't know what mythical leves you people are doing as my lv25 Goldsmith sure as hell hasn't come across those.

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Originally Posted by Jeht

Weavers have been making 17k on a single crafting leve by turning in HQ gear.

FYI, turning in HQ items increases rewards BY A LOT. My girlfriend got 10k from a level 15 turn in on weaving.

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Please by all means tell us the name of this fabled Lev. No levs grant near that much for any turn in. The most I have seen is a triple turn in req 9 hq items to get 5-6k.

I wear a full set of level 49 white gear (obtained via the final sidequests) for farming Castrum in order to keep the repair costs down, however, it still costs me 500 Gil (approx.) per run. That's 500 Gill for 100 ATP.

The Darklight set is 4635 ATP. That's 47 runs of Castrum, at 500 Gil each, so 23,500 Gil or there abouts. Then you throw in HM Primal fights for the weapons, AK runs for ATM, eventually Coil attempts.

It's not a lot of Gil, but it builds up and there doesn't appear to be any way to get that money back by farming the gear that the game wants you to farm. Should level 50 dungeons be paying out 500+ Gil per run? Probably not. But should we be forced to level a crafting profession (which is sooooooooo damn boring) just so we can self repair? And it wouldn't be a single Crafting profession, as a WHM I would need Weaver for my armour, leatherworker for my boots and belt, goldsmith for my jewelry and alchemist for my weapon.

Hopefully dailies will fix this for those of us who would rather be heroes than tradies. Hell, they keep telling us that our FCs are groups of mercenaires, why not offer us daily boss kill contracts via our Grand Company? Kill Demon Wall, hand in quest and receive 1,000 Gil. You're already farming AK for ATM so there's some extra cash.

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Originally Posted by Rekujen

There is no decent way to produce gil via PvE, at the moment gil is moving around based on what people have acquired through the story and soon enough the economy will crash.
l

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Oh my Deity, really! You are not seeing the vast amount of items being brought into the game. Even if it all vendors for 1 gil. If they track items as Capital then there is way way more. We have finite storage meaning vendor. Oh they will use the markets a lot of people will just vendor and be done with it.

What I am seeing is, "I can't self support dungeons by doing dungeons." Why claim sky is falling and just be honest. Most MMO's over the last decade have capitulated to the masses one way or another. I am sure you will get dailies or dungeon gils. But again why not be honest "Please make level 50 repairs free." Then you get what you want.