Well I'll be the optimist for you! I'm good at that! I will hope and dream and pray and sing and dance and laugh and chime until the very Twelve themselves recognize your Fisher's Plight and makes sure that the new Fishing system is to your enjoyment!Quote:
Originally Posted by LlenCoram
I shall not give up! I shall not give up on you! I shall not give up on Fishing!!!!
FFXIV: ARR's fishing system changes
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02-22-2013, 10:37 PMHestern_Nestern
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02-22-2013, 10:40 PMLlenCoramxD This is the first I've laughed all morning. A good friend of mine is trying his best to cheer me up too, saying that the complexity of knowing what rod and bait to use where will be worth it. I still lament the fact that we won't be fighting for our fish though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hestern_Nestern
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02-22-2013, 11:52 PMFatestormThis is not a good answer. Not because we are going to throw an entitled fit, but because we are simply asking for information. And honestly, most of the answers in this letter were very vague.Quote:
Q10: How will fishing work in FFXIV: A Realm Reborn?
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A10: It's probably best if you actually experience it in-game, so let me just go over the broad concept. In ARR, you will first need to walk near a water spot, select a fishing pole that matches the type of water, and then select the bait. There will be no actions during the fishing process. Instead, we will be providing a variety of fish-types depending on the area.
If you just want to stick with the 'broad concept', then tell us this at least: are fishers still connected with the economy at all? With Massively's info and the info you provided in the letter, are we going to be able to make any money at all for our labor in leveling this job?
I can understand if perhaps you feel that the fast-paced nature of botany and mining don't fit the patience and quiet intensity required of fishing. I actually agree with you. However, everyone in threads like this is worried that a class that they took the time to level is becoming obsolete in the game and its economy, and instead being turned into a trivial distraction to pass time while chatting. If ANY more light could be shed on this, confirming it one way or another, you would at least end a lot of desperate speculation.
Please don't tell us we all wasted our time leveling Fisher. -
02-23-2013, 01:16 AMReinheart
I want to see how much of the community really wanted fishing to be downgraded, more simplified (old school FFXI before they added the action) fishing...
I was expecting something better than the XI's fishing where you just press left or right... not a full on downgrade...
If people wanted to do something while they wait for their friends and stuff and just chat there were so much other things devs could of done aside from cutting fishing... >< -
02-23-2013, 01:31 AMHiirNoivl
Here's the broad concept:
RNG. "Please look forward to it"
In the meantime, I have given up all hope. It's all I have left of it which blows my mind because the RNG aspect of gathering was one of the few things I disliked about it.
Other than that you're getting nothing but a random treasure map that makes you take others to a place start fighting instead of doing all that lame gathering chores. The old 1.0 is gone. It's not coming back. I'm as sad for you just because I know how you feel. When I saw how Alpha botanist played for the first time on the official video I was horrified.
It's gone folks. It was great while it lasted. Say goodbye to the only reasonably meaningful gathering in MMOs ever.
*lights a candle* -
02-23-2013, 01:36 AMFatestorm
"Now open your eyes while our plight is repeated
Still deaf to our cries, lost in hope we lie defeated..."
;) -
02-23-2013, 01:40 AMLlenCoramYeah, the treasure map thing was especially insulting.Quote:
Originally Posted by HiirNoivl
"You can get a random treasure map, which will lead you to a place to go fight!"
"Why not have it lead to MORE gathering, like... you go to a place that pops a special instance for you, where you can gather super rare stuff for a bit?"
"But... why would I do that? No one actually likes gathering!"
I'm starting to think Yoshi is one of those people who doesn't understand how or why some people genuinely like not fighting in an MMO. -
02-23-2013, 01:45 AMZetsumei_Tsunarashi
Yea when I was reading about the treasure maps I started to get excited. I was like "OMG this sounds like chocographs from FF9 that's awesome!!!!" Then I read the part about fighting monsters and I was like "Oh ....."
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02-23-2013, 01:51 AMZetsumei_TsunarashiQuote:
Originally Posted by Reinheart
http://i46.tinypic.com/10nrplk.jpg
Clearly everyone wants less content for gathering .... >.> -
02-23-2013, 02:47 AMZakarnRosewood
All i have to say is that if you play an MMO for the fishing, you are in the wrong genre.
For the sake of those who enjoy it, I do hope there will me a minigame worthy of fishing that will satisfy the casual past time. So far we have little info to go on. Like the OP said, They have removed spearfishing and have gone in a "Different direction" than the other DoL/DoH. Yoshi-P did say in your quote It's probably best if you actually experience it in-game So until we can play it in beta or get some official information, we will need to remain calm and be patient. -
02-23-2013, 02:48 AMReinheartOnce I try it in beta and it's not what I was expecting I'm gonna go full out on this one. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by ZakarnRosewood
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02-23-2013, 02:53 AMLlenCoramYou and me both.Quote:
Originally Posted by Reinheart
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02-23-2013, 02:55 AMHiirNoivl
Reinheart, Llen, Please join me sometime. ^^
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02-23-2013, 03:07 AMZakarnRosewoodBy all means. At least then you will be able to comment on something you have actually experienced. I just hate all this premature up-in-arms i see on the forums but i trust Rein to provide level headed feedback instead of a flaming freak out session.Quote:
Originally Posted by Reinheart
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02-23-2013, 03:18 AMLlenCoramYou can hardly call this a flaming freak out session. So far I'm the only one freaking out, and I'm hardly the loudest voice here, nor the one with the most likes. Plenty of others have posted very well-written, level-headed posts covering the concerns we have. Fatestorm, Reinheart, Zetsumei, and a few others have written excellent posts detailing exactly what the concerns are.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZakarnRosewood
Lay the blame on me if you must. As far as I can tell, I'm the only one who's in a blind panic. -
02-23-2013, 03:23 AMKiote
Sounds like FFXI fishing to me.
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02-23-2013, 03:38 AMOrophin
I'm going to reserve judgment until I can test it in Phase 3, but I will be VERY vocal about it if I don't like what I see. I liked the complexity of matching certain baits to certain areas to catch certain fish. I'm not saying that I'm opposed to it being a little less involved as before, but all I'm getting out of what's been translated so far is "Use your fishing rod and catch something. Oh and by the way, fish won't have the economic importance as they used to."
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02-23-2013, 03:55 AMZakarnRosewoodlol, no worries. I should have been clearer in my post. It was kind of a generalization aimed at reactions to any news. but i guess thats what the internet is good for. Some people use it as an excuse to act in a way they normally wouldn't in a face to face interaction.Quote:
Originally Posted by LlenCoram
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02-23-2013, 03:57 AMLlenCoramNot at all! I know most of the forum doesn't like me since every other word out of my mouth is "fishing," and I'm probably a bit more combative than I should be in most cases.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZakarnRosewood
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02-23-2013, 04:07 AMWHS
It kinda says it all right here:
http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/02...d-mobile-apps/
Here is a blurb from that article just so you can see:
"Fishing, however, will not be retaining its previous functionality. I asked Yoshida whether fishing will have more tradeskills using its harvested items in the revamp, and he replied that the team actually went in the opposite direction by making fishing focus on the experience of fishing. If you like to fish, you can enjoy it as a hobby with its own merits rather than simply feeling it's necessary for a crafting class."
That article is current when Yoshi and Team were on the media tour in San Franscisco.
I took that to mean fishing will have to merit what so ever and just be a hobby. Might be fun but no progression what so ever. That means if your looking to make money fishing forget it. My guess it was to kill RMT's. Or at least make another attempt to. -
02-23-2013, 04:10 AMLlenCoramThat's what we're all afraid of. That comment from that interview, as well as the really vague answer to the Q&A today, are why it's crucial we get some answers. Crucial to us at least, there's absolutely no issue to Yoshi and crew at all if they continue keeping quiet, but as can be seen by this thread and the similar thread in General Discussion, quite a few of us are very worried. Some dev comments would be really nice to allay any fears we all share.Quote:
Originally Posted by WHS
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02-23-2013, 04:22 AMOzak
I'm hoping when I try this in beta it will be something I like but so far how it sounds I hate it. I liked fishing cause it was a challenge. T.T
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02-23-2013, 04:50 AMNixIt's wonderful to have something you're passionate about, and I've always enjoyed reading your posts! haha, It's so nice to see that there are people as addicted to gathering as I am. lolQuote:
Originally Posted by LlenCoram
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02-23-2013, 06:01 AMBran
I'm just happy I finished my RoL in time before it to become completely useless.
Still working on my ebisu in ffxi, if this new system is anything like it seems to be, I hope I never get it and continue fishing in ffxi forever instead :/ -
02-23-2013, 06:11 AMLlenCoramIf phase 3 fails to impress, I was actually saying I'd check out XI again. There I'd have Musketeer (sorta) AND a fishing system that works.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bran
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02-23-2013, 07:35 AMCynthisI will be right there with you!Quote:
Originally Posted by LlenCoram
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02-23-2013, 09:25 AMZetsumei_TsunarashiQuote:
Originally Posted by Reinheart
Me three. lolQuote:
Originally Posted by LlenCoram
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02-23-2013, 11:01 AMLlenCoram
Reinheart, if you'd be so kind, are there any threads similar to this on the JP side? I've met a lot of JP fishing enthusiasts in my time on the cliffs, so I'm sure there must be one or two who are unhappy/confused with this news.
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02-23-2013, 12:13 PMtheomen
if the remove fishing from the economy I'm done with ffxiv been paying for this game seens they started charging and I'm not going to bend over and take it like someone that
needs them more then they need me -
02-23-2013, 01:41 PMYrusama
I only leveled fishing to 13, and I look forward to leveling it, but it would be nice to know what to expect.
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02-24-2013, 03:23 AMwind
You do realize that gathering classes are not considered MAIN classes. If there is any proof to this, it is the fact you cannot start your character as a gathering class in ARR. The equal roles of all the categories (land/hand/war/magic) all went out the window when Tanaka and team failed.
Ive read this thread and the similar but smaller thread by Nix, basically saying they want this to be a mini-game like it was in 1.0. However, I'm not sure if you're blatantly trying to ignore the most obvious form of mini-games simply because the very few true fishers (majority of 50 fishers were bots lets be honest) are upset.
By most obvious I mean the Golden Saucer of course, we all know its going to make its appearance in ARR and what was the Golden Saucer known for in 7? Mini-Games... So if everyone is angry about that aspect, there will be a possibly better form of mini-games to come.
If you're upset that you stop having a role in the market due to the changes coming, you can't honestly be surprised can you? Has the 5months off from 1.0 made you forget the horrid market that was fish? Only fish that were used for GC trade ins had any worth, all other fish (besides black sole and very few others) dropped down to 100gil-300gil when it wasn't their week. The numerous bots that were bringing fish in the market caused weeks and weeks of constant undercutting. I'm sure if you really think back and remember the market this change cant be that unwarranted. -
02-24-2013, 03:38 AMZetsumei_Tsunarashi
It's not that we want a mini-game, for the sake of playing a mini-game. It's that sitting in front of water and waiting for a fish to randomly appear in my inventory is not really that interesting.
Fishing is a class of it's own just like the rest of the classes. Simply because it is a less needed class, does that mean that it should just be ignored ? Just because it is not your favorite class, it should be treated like it doesn't matter ? What if someone just decided that monks are worthless in parties, and don't do much damage, we might as well just get rid of their abilities and just make them do nothing but auto attack the whole time, right ?
If they don't want fishing to have an impact on the economy, then it should at least be the most fun of the DoL.
The other DoL are designed to service crafters, and so therefore they were made to be fast and efficient at gathering the materials you are looking for, with as little effort as possible. What's confusing is why they would make fishing equally as simplified, when there's no need for fish in the economy.
If fishing is meant to be just a hobby now, then why make it boring ? -
02-24-2013, 03:50 AMSmokeyTheSequelI love your sig. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Zetsumei_Tsunarashi
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02-24-2013, 04:18 AMwindThe only flaw in your comparison is that Monks are tied to the War category meaning they are considered a primary role in this game. Whereas fishing is not. Your other point on why would they make it less interactive if it becomes solely a "hobby" class that has a minimal effect on the overall aspect of the game... we'll that's a decent point. My only response would be, investing time and funds for an area of the game that will only be targeted by 5% or less doesn't seem like a smart move.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zetsumei_Tsunarashi
Dont get me wrong though, I understand you love fishing so you don't want it treated like it doesn't matter. But the fact is, if it serves no purpose in the economy, no purpose in battle, progression, or overall growth of a player (such as crafting). Then by those points alone, sadly, its not that important :(.
But, you may fall in love with other aspects of the game that would help fill the void that fishing will leave. My hope is that you didn't play 1.0 for as long as you did JUST for fishing. If you did, hats off to you, I couldn't have done that. -
02-24-2013, 05:04 AMHuhBut like, the only reason Monks are in that primary role in the game is because the developers choose to give it content and give it this big importance in the game. If fishing got as much content as say a battle class and was developed not as a hobby but as what it should be--a class-- then that 5% of people who use fishing would exponentially grow and it could be just as fun/used as any battle class.Quote:
Originally Posted by wind
But see what sucks is, it seems like the developers are going in the direction in which they want to pigeon hole fishing into a 'hobby' and that sucks because now that 5% will probably get even smaller. -
02-24-2013, 05:22 AMwindYa, that's why my first post specifically mentioned, that mindset of equality between all categories went out the window with tanaka. Even during 1.0 fishing didn't serve as large a purpose as its two other brethren. It still had cooking/alchemy to support but overall pots / food didn't serve as high as an impact as say weapons/armor/tools.. etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Huh
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02-24-2013, 06:16 AMLlenCoramAh, but that's why we wanted more. I fully agree, other than a few high-need potions from a specific fish, GC turn-ins, and shards/crystals, fishing was largely useless. The thing is, we could get more. There are two directions SE and Yoshi could take fishing. One direction is making the class even more useless than it was in 1.0, which seems to be the direction Yoshi has chosen. The other option is giving fishers more content, more functionality, and more in-depth gameplay. We don't need the gathering classes to be equal with the combat classes, because honestly they never were in 1.0. What we do want is more use.Quote:
Originally Posted by wind
You can keep a class relevant without making it equal, as seen by the new botany and presumably the new mining. It was a decision on Yoshi's part to do nothing with fishing, but he could just as easily have chosen to make what we fish important. Fish/shark oil for weapons, shark-tooth cesti for pugilists/monks, shark skin armour for tanks, coral for bows and other weapons. He could have made food actually important, with a lot of different fish imparting different stats. There's a huge number of things he could have done with the class, but instead he decided to go the easy route and make it pointless.
Again, we're not asking to be equals to the combat classes. That won't happen and that's fine. What we do want is a point to the class many of us fell in love with. As for myself, I know I'm very likely alone in this, but if fishing is as ruined as we all assume it to be with the news that came out, I will have a very very hard time staying interested in the game. For whatever reason, though I can fish for hours and hours on end, I have a hard time doing combat for longer than a half hour. I hate grinding with a passion. Quests and leves bore me to tears. Don't even get me started on crafting. If we didn't have fishing in 1.0, I'd have quit very very early into its life, purely because combat is so utterly boring to me. This is the main reason I quit GW2. With nothing to do in that game, I ran out of interest. Fishing in XIV rooted me to the game.
I'm an exception though, I understand that, so I know that I'm probably completely alone in that sentiment, and I'm not deluded enough to think that SE would ever miss one single player. The fact remains that very many of us, as can be seen by this thread and by Nix's thread, are worried, frightened, and saddened at the proposed, presumed changes to fishing. All we ask is for a dev response to either clear things up or acknowledge that yes, our preferred playstyle is going in the bin. -
02-24-2013, 07:25 AMwind
Ya LlenCoram,
I understand the concept of what you mean by fishing rooting you to the game because combat(and your full list) seems boring to you. But in that regard, has none of the other non-combat related content interested you at all? I mean there will be choco-raising, housing/expanding, gardening, w/e games Saucer brings, etc..
I guess what I'm trying to say is, it would suck for you to already throw in the towel because you're losing one of the reasons you play. Without trying any of new things that could potentially root you to the game as well.
Its hard for me to truly put myself in your shoes because I don't think I had anything that "rooted" me to the game. Sadly, I just kinda played to play while pleading with everyone who quit after a month to come back lol :(. -
02-24-2013, 07:33 AMLlenCoramDefinitely, and I understand what you mean. I absolutely love this game, and I love my character quite a lot. The changes that we've seen, plus what we haven't seen, have me beyond excited, and I will absolutely try it out. That is what hurts me the most though; I want to love this game, and I'd like to continue playing it for years to come. One of the things I'm looking forward to the most is being able to buy my own house near the beach in Limsa. I can't wait to answer a linkshell call to tackle an NM and be able to ride in on my trusty chocobo Kwefka, leap off of him, and pull my two pistols on the NM, ready for action. I'm beyond anxious to play this game.Quote:
Originally Posted by wind
But I still want to fish. I will be trying the game, but I know how I work. Withought fishing to tie me to the game, there will be many instances of me logging in and not wanting to do anything. In the past, I almost always wanted to fish. You have no idea how much that hurts me too, because I love Yoshi and what he's done. Just don't take my fishing. -
02-24-2013, 07:37 AMwind
Haha gotcha, I mean if you're able to come up with a detailed scenario as that then I'm confident you haven't completely given up on the game. Which is good :D.
I'm sorry for your fishing though :(