Scrap current classes or keep as is?

I'm confused a bit. Isn't the CURRENT armory system the MAIN highlight of XIV? I thought people just hated how it becomes to gray at endgame? Not that it needed to be scrapped. Why scrap one of you're best features if it only needs to be completed?


edit: My opinion is I highly doubt SE is going to get rid of it.

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Envoyé par Akumu

I'm confused a bit. Isn't the CURRENT armory system the MAIN highlight of XIV? I thought people just hated how it becomes to gray at endgame? Not that it needed to be scrapped. Why scrap one of you're best features if it only needs to be completed?

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Thats what I'm saying, Don't remove or replace the Armoury System, Augment it with a Job Title System.

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Envoyé par AlexiaKidd

Looks like we may be getting FFXI-2 after all now that auto attack has been confirmed and it seems they are making a lot of other huge changes.

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Excuse me? Where was it confirmed to get Auto attack?

Also, there's no way they would scrap the system. Changing the class system to that degree would not bring significant numbers of new players, and they would lose a large percentage of players, as evidenced by this thread.

The Armory system is something they did RIGHT with FFXIV... they just need to tweak it a bit to make classes more unique. There are plenty of ideas that have sprung up to do it without screwing over the Armory system, and I'm sure they aren't stupid enough to completely scrap and redo it.

If they are, they deserve for the game to tank.

EDIT: Nvm, I see it now. *sigh* Maybe they are too stupid.

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Envoyé par Kaedan

Excuse me? Where was it confirmed to get Auto attack?

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http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...to-Attack-wins!

There is nothing to say they can't keep the existing armory system and still rename the classes though and redo some skills.

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Envoyé par Kaedan

[s]EDIT: Nvm, I see it now. *sigh* Maybe they are too stupid.

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they arent doing away with it, they havent said so yet
right now they are discussing what to do but have stated that they will most likely NOT scrap the current jobs and such for new ones. The prefered idea is to add to it.

Anyone in their right mind who has seriously leveled would quit if they didnt have the jobs they leveled anymore, and saying "we will give you new jobs of the same leve" isnt gonna cut it, cuz nothing says we will want those jobs.

The auto attack thing isnt gonna mean nothing, it wont affect much at all and doesnt change what we do now except not having to hit the attack button a bunch.

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Envoyé par TheVedis

The auto attack thing isnt gonna mean nothing, it wont affect much at all and doesnt change what we do now except not having to hit the attack button a bunch.

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You are in for a shock then, because auto attack fundementally changes every skill in almost ever class.

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Envoyé par Jinko

You are in for a shock then, because auto attack fundementally changes every skill in almost ever class.

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changing combat is one thing
but changing the overall job itself has nothing to do with auto attack, people are looking way deeper into this and seeing things that are not there

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Envoyé par TheVedis

changing combat is one thing
but changing the overall job itself has nothing to do with auto attack, people are looking way deeper into this and seeing things that are not there

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Perhaps or maybe they are looking for things they want to be there :P

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Envoyé par Jinko

Perhaps or maybe they are looking for things they want to be there :P

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of course, people will always state what they want, but the people who are talking about it like its a done deal fact are the ones who are in for the wakup call

we know NOTHING of the overall end results of what will happen, people however are going to assume the worst

i read what was said in the statement by the dev, and i saw what he meant personaly

everything will be almost the same
they have to adjust the speed attacks can go through(since if you spammed standard attacks youd run out of stamina, they will adjust this to compensate so that youd still attack near the same rate for damage)
doing away with stamina for abilities? thats fine, just add cooldowns based on how much stamina they took.

it doesnt change a whole lot in the end really, and really, it has nothing to do with scrapping all the current classes and making all new ones like some people here are claiming

Auto attack will significantly change the game. I brought it up in the AA thread. We will lose significant amounts of control in combat, and it's going to create a lot of problems. IMO, more than it's worth to have it.

Sorry, I don't want to derail this... shouldn't have brought up the AA.

I just hope that them not thinking through adding AA doesn't signal that they won't think through class changes.

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Envoyé par Kaedan

Auto attack will significantly change the game. I brought it up in the AA thread. We will lose significant amounts of control in combat, and it's going to create a lot of problems. IMO, more than it's worth to have it.

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we will lose some control over attack order, thats for sure, how they implement ability activation during the auto attack is the point of interest there.

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Envoyé par Jinko

There is nothing to say they can't keep the existing armory system and still rename the classes though and redo some skills.

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Exactly. Changing class/ability names and maybe adding or redistributing some skills (like giving Jump to Lancer, for example) wouldn't require any fundamental changes to the way the Armoury System works - it would still be the Armoury System, just with more of a traditional Final Fantasy theme to it.

From what I've seen, it doesn't seem like the DoW classes would really change much if they were renamed to more classic FF series counterparts. It's the DoM classes that would cause the real problem with the way they're sort of a hodgepodge of what would normally be classified as white/black magic under other FF job systems.

If they were to keep the current classes though, my preference would be to see them used as base classes in a Tactics-style progression, which is an idea I've seen mentioned a few times. Though that would probably still require some reworking of the existing classes in order for such a progression to make sense while still keeping all the base classes viable in the long term.

Ultimately it's a tricky problem and I certainly don't envy the designers.

With the two choices Yoshi-P is deciding from I also don't see anything relating to a possible current class name changes.


Yoshida-san is between two possible plans at this time. The first idea is that the traditional names would be introduced as “higher” or “advanced” classes. The traditional classes would thus be something of a goal for players. The second idea is that the traditional names would be more of a subset or specialization within the existing classes.

When they change the armory system they will be enhancing it not just deleting/rewriting names and moving abilities around.

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Envoyé par Akumu

With the two choices Yoshi-P is deciding from I also don't see anything relating to a possible current class name changes.


Yoshida-san is between two possible plans at this time. The first idea is that the traditional names would be introduced as “higher” or “advanced” classes. The traditional classes would thus be something of a goal for players. The second idea is that the traditional names would be more of a subset or specialization within the existing classes.

When they change the armory system they will be enhancing it not just deleting/rewriting names and moving abilities around.

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and thats the quote i keep refering to, thanks for posting it

Wow you cry babies need to get a grip. AA is coming deal with it and along with is coming a completely revamped battle system, which mean skills and abilities from all current classes will have to changed to adapt to the new system. The game has failed and they are making drastic changes to pu it right, maybe one of those changes is to the class system as even in this biased fanboy environment of people who mostly still play the game on this thread scrapping the system is winning over keepin it the same last time I checked, so stop holding onto the past and get with the times. Change is going to happen for this game to survive as it can't with the amount of players it currently has

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Envoyé par Darksoul

Wow you cry babies need to get a grip. AA is coming deal with it and along with is coming a completely revamped battle system, which mean skills and abilities from all current classes will have to changed to adapt to the new system. The game has failed and they are making drastic changes to pu it right, maybe one of those changes is to the class system as even in this biased fanboy environment of people who mostly still play the game on this thread scrapping the system is winning over keepin it the same last time I checked, so stop holding onto the past and get with the times. Change is going to happen for this game to survive as it can't with the amount of players it currently has

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Name calling is bad, mmmmkay.

I don't mind Auto Attack being added, in fact, I welcome it. The majority of the player's thought the battle system needed a lot of work (from what I remember, correct me if I'm wrong).

However, scrapping the class system and redoing would be a gamebreaker for me (Though He's already stated he won't be doing this). The Armory system itself is a good system, they just need to finalize it, it simply isn't complete yet, or it doesn't 'feel' complete to me anyway. Not wanting it scrapped doesn't mean we're holding onto the past, it means we actually like the system.

I await more details on what he plans to do, but until then, I'll sit back and quietly read the forums like usual, occasionally popping in with a response.

Lets see if people opinions have changed much since this thread was started.

Treat the current release as one of the betas so wipe everything & start fresh.

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Envoyé par rubina

Treat the current release as one of the betas so wipe everything & start fresh.

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people without a lot of time invested love this idea, i dont like to grind endlessly, id rather move foward, pass.

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Envoyé par Physic

people without a lot of time invested love this idea, i dont like to grind endlessly, id rather move foward, pass.

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I have a 50 and a few 35+ and i would love a wipe, always felt that way.

Why build a second story on a mud hut when you can start over with wood?

Heya!

Are you sure that you can only have 1 job for 1 class? I'm not quite sure about it. Instead, I think, like Bayohne said, that if at a certain rank you can unlock a Job, that there are multiple jobs for 1 class.

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Envoyé par Renshi

Heya!

Are you sure that you can only have 1 job for 1 class? I'm not quite sure about it. Instead, I think, like Bayohne said, that if at a certain rank you can unlock a Job, that there are multiple jobs for 1 class.

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Well the way I see it Renshi I think it will stay as 1 Class = 1 Job under the current rules of the Armoury System. This is because say you Unlock PLD at GLA Level 30 and as they have said your Job Level is tied to your Class Level if you were a Level 50 GLA you would be a Level 50 PLD.

So with this lets say a few years down the line the Level cap is increased to 75 and you have hit cap with your GLA so you also have a Level 75 PLD, if they added a new class like RDM to GLA then you would also be a Level 75 RDM. That is why unless they do multiple off the bat which it doesn't sound like they are going to do ie making CON unlock WHM and BLM on the same class then the system won't ever really work with multiple Jobs on one Class.

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Envoyé par AlexiaKidd

Well the way I see it Renshi I think it will stay as 1 Class = 1 Job under the current rules of the Armoury System. This is because say you Unlock PLD at GLA Level 30 and as they have said your Job Level is tied to your Class Level if you were a Level 50 GLA you would be a Level 50 PLD.

So with this lets say a few years down the line the Level cap is increased to 75 and you have hit cap with your GLA so you also have a Level 75 PLD, if they added a new class like RDM to GLA then you would also be a Level 75 RDM. That is why unless they do multiple off the bat which it doesn't sound like they are going to do ie making CON unlock WHM and BLM on the same class then the system won't ever really work with multiple Jobs on one Class.

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I see. Even so, there's a possibility that when you reach 30 and unlock the quest for Paladin, you could go 45 and unlock the quest for Dark Knight, and at an hypothetic R70 to unlock the quest for... uh... Cakebuster. So you can be a Level 50 Gladiator, Paladin and Dark Knight.
However this will not work because, yeah, you can rank up Dark Knight as like you are ranking up Paladin, which is a little counternature.

I'll tell you my parting on this when we'll receive enough informations to judge this thing. For now it's a bit foggy and I beg the Dev team to give us more feedback on this, which will become a core function of the game.

See ya!

Unnn... whatever their working on, that's it, as far as I see it. Otherwise we'll wait another several set of months. If that happened certain people would spontaneously combust.

Well scrap is winning but not really a huge amount of votes to actually gather what people actually want though

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Envoyé par Renshi

I see. Even so, there's a possibility that when you reach 30 and unlock the quest for Paladin, you could go 45 and unlock the quest for Dark Knight, and at an hypothetic R70 to unlock the quest for... uh... Cakebuster.

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I believe this is the rank 30 Culinarian job.

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Envoyé par AlexiaKidd

Well scrap is winning but not really a huge amount of votes to actually gather what people actually want though

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I'll be honest. I'm not voting because I don't think it matters at this point. SE is doing what they are doing and have made it clear they are only doing this once. I'm just going to make the best of what we get.

how can u say this???? So 1 Class to 1 Job and you are locked to your Weapon forever.

What this game needs isnt change....change....change....it needs more more more..... we dnt need to change GLA TO PLD thats just dumb we however need to add PLD, RDM AND SO ON.... I agree we need to make it so that we arent limited to one weapon... that works but this poll is just dumb...LOL... we dnt need stuff changed the game is fine and will be fine in the future....if u guys stop complaining and sayin want! want! want! 99% OF THE IDEAS I HEAR HERE ARE SO STUPID AND ARE GNNA JUST RUIN OUR GAME.... u guys just had to wine and make stupid ideas like these ones..... and now most likely theyll be put into FF....

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Envoyé par Krikwan

how can u say this???? So 1 Class to 1 Job and you are locked to your Weapon forever.

What this game needs isnt change....change....change....it needs more more more..... we dnt need to change GLA TO PLD thats just dumb we however need to add PLD, RDM AND SO ON.... I agree we need to make it so that we arent limited to one weapon... that works but this poll is just dumb...LOL... we dnt need stuff changed the game is fine and will be fine in the future....if u guys stop complaining and sayin want! want! want! 99% OF THE IDEAS I HEAR HERE ARE SO STUPID AND ARE GNNA JUST RUIN OUR GAME.... u guys just had to wine and make stupid ideas like these ones..... and now most likely theyll be put into FF....

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uh...Woosh?

To be quite honest i dont know enough details to make a real decision about which system i would prefer right now.

I have multiple classes at 50 and voted no to a character wipe back in one of those polls. However, if we were told to choose between a character wipe and this new job system, I might actually choose a character wipe. Even now.

They should have just removed the weapon=class restriction but kept all of the current classes. Restrict/move some of the abilities like they're going to do anyways and introduced these jobs and advanced classes that you need to level up. Sure, the names of the current classes might not make sense but at least the armory system will.

I have CON and THM at 50, so with the current system I won't need to do any more leveling until the cap is raised or more DoM classes are added. The DoW classes I don't have at 50 are not appealing to me. So I guess all of this r30 content will just be r50 solo content.

Hell no!

The classes are fine as they are, you are already getting jobs, Auto-attack, and have single-handedly and systematically destroyed EVERYTHING that made FFXIV unique, fact: Most of us don't want to play a rehash of FFXI!!!!

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Envoyé par Vanguard319

Hell no!

The classes are fine as they are, you are already getting jobs, Auto-attack, and have single-handedly and systematically destroyed EVERYTHING that made FFXIV unique, fact: Most of us don't want to play a rehash of FFXI!!!!

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Fact: most people already quit the game >.>

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Envoyé par AlexiaKidd

Fact: most people already quit the game >.>

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Good for them, I'm not them, and this game should not be a ffxi clone either.

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Envoyé par Vanguard319

Good for them, I'm not them, and this game should not be a ffxi clone either.

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Well unfortunately unless you have very deep pockets and can afford to keep the game afloat SE will go with whatever will bring them the most subscribers/money.

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Envoyé par AlexiaKidd

Well unfortunately unless you have very deep pockets and can afford to keep the game afloat SE will go with whatever will bring them the most subscribers/money.

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Besides, the majority who quit are the ones who were expecting a ffxi clone to begin with, so your argument is moot.

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Envoyé par Vanguard319

Besides, the majority who quit are the ones who were expecting a ffxi clone to begin with, so your argument is moot.

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Even if that were true which I do not believe it is, then SE would have been better off giving them what they wanted and give them a "FFXI-2" and maybe out of the 500k box sales they would have been able to keep enough subscribers to actual make the game P2P and built it up from there. As it is FFXIV is not doing so good hence why it is F2P and the dev team are scrambling to get it back on track and get it to a point where they can charge monthly again.

Scrap it and give me FFXI-2. I've given XIV enough time to fix its faults and they continue to stumble on their faces time and time again, lets just go with what works.

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Envoyé par AlexiaKidd

Even if that were true which I do not believe it is, then SE would have been better off giving them what they wanted and give them a "FFXI-2" and maybe out of the 500k box sales they would have been able to keep enough subscribers to actual make the game P2P and built it up from there. As it is FFXIV is not doing so good hence why it is F2P and the dev team are scrambling to get it back on track and get it to a point where they can charge monthly again.

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yeah, I would say my last statement is very true, and I'd take an original game over a graphically-enhanced remake anyday, especially since this is not and never should be a ffxi-2.

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Envoyé par Vanguard319

Besides, the majority who quit are the ones who were expecting a ffxi clone to begin with, so your argument is moot.

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Actually if that were true it would make your argument moot.

I happen to agree with you. XI is a closed chapter in my life and I was looking for something new and fresh. Every day XIV is being remade into XI-2 and it's driving me away.

...but you can't say the majority of people don't want XI-2, then turn around and say the majority of people quit because they wanted XI-2 and didn't get it. Totally invalidates your original assertion. ^^ Sorry. Stay focused and fight the good fight!