Could a melee Healer work?

I'd like to go the other direction and have a magic-based tank.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I'd like to go the other direction and have a magic-based tank.

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I think the dark knight is a failed attempt at that....

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Originally Posted by gllt

I mean I've always wanted a ranged healer that throws potions so why not

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an apothecary class would be pretty damn cool for sure. imagine tying alchemy to it too

wooo, reminds me of the Warrior Priest class in Warhammer Online. Was so fun!

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Originally Posted by ApolloGenX

I think the dark knight is a failed attempt at that....

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It was doomed to fail because it still primarily revolves around swinging a large bladed weapon.

I think PLD would be a better representative of a caster tank. A cast-time heavy tank would be a neat idea if it is also had ample instant casts to be able to reposition when needed.

As for a melee healer, you could have one in the same sense that RDM is a "melee caster". So many fights and player strategies are designed with the idea that healers are ranged jobs, so any melee skills would need to be flexible on when to use them. SGE already technically "fulfils" this niche with Phlegma being close range, it's just not exactly fulfilling like the rest of the healers.

No idea but give Chemist yoship pls ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ

I would like to see mid range tank that uses long lance and sheild who uses the sun to empower their attacks

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Originally Posted by ApolloGenX

I think the dark knight is a failed attempt at that....

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The fantasy isn't their

Dark knight should be berserk high damage attack but longer GCD low mobility

Who uses dark magic to improve their defense

It technically is a thing only in Leviathan EX under certain circumstances

YES. YESSSSS. A MELEE HEALER WOULD BE FANTASTIC. IVE BEEN HOPING FOR ONCE SINCE ARR DROPPED!!!! PLEASE SE!!!!!

It honestly would probably look something like PLD.

If we were to take my... let's call it "Dark Cleric" idea, that's where the Dark-aspected part would come in! Well, and using a completely different kind of weapon. But yeah, PLD is already kind most of the way there with its shields and heals (which is neat)

How do we feel about Geomancer? It has some basic lore thanks to an optional dungeon and some AST job quests and could b a hybrid shield/regen healer.

At first, I wouldn't have thought so with current encounter design in mind.

However, if they designed the Healer with an augment similar to Sage's Eukrasia that changes their ranged abilities to melee (or vice-versa) to do more damage or apply some other effects, I think it could definitely work.

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Originally Posted by Vensaval

At first, I wouldn't have thought so with current encounter design in mind.

However, if they designed the Healer with an augment similar to Sage's Eukrasia that changes their ranged abilities to melee (or vice-versa) to do more damage or apply some other effects, I think it could definitely work.

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In theory this works but I can imagine the forums being blasted with complaints about the ranged spam being too weak when they have to do ranged mechanics. Making the melee part stronger just makes the having ranged option an illusion. You're gimping yourself if you're not doing melee 99% of the time.

Melee healer could work but they would need to tune down the forced ranged mechanics that requires the healer to spread out.

Yeah. Let's call it Chiropractor. And it revolves around dashing between party members and healing them using Hokuto Shinken.

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Originally Posted by Tsiron

What brought this about was my pondering the kind of Job they might give Gaia in the future since although she's a MRD/WAR in terms of (roughly) weapon type and stance, nothing else about it matches her particular skillset. Making her a Tank still doesn't feel right (even if a time skip were involved), and then it struck me! A melee Healer that uses time magic to halt or rewind damage! After all, there's a strong connection between maces/hammers and clerics and the like (admittedly mostly in western media e.g. Warhammer Fantasy), and aligning it with Darkness would make for a fun twist, I think.

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Since new Jobs only get 10 levels' worth of quests anymore I think it would be funny if the Job teacher was very clearly just an older Gaia herself (regardless whether you'd completed Eden or not) taking a brief jaunt back in time to pass her skills down to the WoL

Warhammer Online had/have a melee healer class called Disciple of Khaine. So the concept of a melee healer is possible.
A thing Warhammer Online had/have though is that a player could target 2 at the same time, 1 hostile and 1 friendly.
So as a melee healer you could have a friend targeted while hitting on a hostile target, healing your friendly target.

That's basically Kardia, isn't it?

I mean some other game do it. The captain healer specialisation in Lotro does exactly that. It slightly heal everyone when some of the dps skill are used. It kinda work like kardia, except it heals everyone. It's not as good of the pure healers, but it works pretty well as a off heal. That said, the healer/tank/dps is not as rigid as it is in FFXIV. Buff, debuff and CC are far more used that what we have in XIV. For that reason, I don't see that happening here.

I mean, it wouldn't be my cup of tea, but it definitely sounds unique and interesting when it comes to FF14. Unique is good, I like unique. *Hisses at all those homogenised jobs*

A-Are you speaking of WAR?!

There are some mechs which make this either very annoying for downtime reasons (searing wind) or break the current strats (M4S transition which needs one melee and one ranged pair and both of them support/dps pair).

It might force to use one magic dps in melee spot.

I don't think this will ever happen.

They could go the ffxi way by giving them access to clubs or if not that a maul. It is doable!


But…how would the healing work? Damage = heal? That would be rough out of melee range to not get heals. Would need something to help.

Idea 1:swings the maul around to do a aoe heal?
Idea 2: hits the ground with the maul to aoe heal?
Idea 3: make it throw potions to single heal

Could a melee healer work?
Probably

Would it work?
Not really... healing in this game is not really needed to make designing a new healer worth it.

I expect that they will only focus on new DPS jobs for the remainder of the game as any new tanks or healers will cause an imbalance in their existing system.

I suggest range healer call a medic that has pet dog that garlean in original

Yeah I thought thats what a battle cleric was

A melee job wouldn't fit their healer design of 1 damage spell and 1 dot.

So, sadly, a melee healer wouldn't work in FFXIV.

Too often I see people who misunderstand what "Melee Healer" means, and additionally see too many who assume it has limitations that wouldnt be applied to any other jobs in the game.
All melee DPS have ranged attacks for scenarios they have to stay away from the boss, these attacks are a DPS loss when in melee range. The same would be applied to the melee healer.
The real question is, would it be fun to play a melee healer in a game where all healers just spam 1 button?
Not saying SE will do this, or should do this, just using as a quick example for others
Looking at how SE handles healers homoginization; Id see it as a sort of "4 melee strikes" type of deal. Where 3 are all different types of heals, and 1 is a straight up DoT. (Since SE loves the single DoT on every healer. Something akin to #1 adds to a pool for oGCD healing. #2 takes from the MP pool for direct GCD healing. (Inverse kardia, a 0.5s GCD triggers after this is pressed. maybe adjusted for 1s, instead of 0.5, depending on issues)
#3 splashes an AoE heal around you if you have the MP for it. (otherwise its just dmg w/o a heal)

all 3 do the same damage. so you use #1 until youre capped on resources, and then spam 2, until you need to aoe, then 3.
oGCDs heals will supplement the heals of the melee strikes.

for ranged situations, you have a straight up ranged attack thats like 10 potency lower, and takes up mp. (Id give it a 0.5s cast time for mobility purposes.)
(also a ranged casted heal thats more MP consuming. idealy try not to use these two unless needed)

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Originally Posted by Tsiron

Just musing out loud.

I don't have one theorycrafted or anything, but suffice it to say by melee I of course don't mean the actual healing part of its skillset (or... do I?), I'm imagining it just being its damage-dealing abilities. I think it could make for a novel addition to the game's roster even then.

What brought this about was my pondering the kind of Job they might give Gaia in the future since although she's a MRD/WAR in terms of (roughly) weapon type and stance, nothing else about it matches her particular skillset. Making her a Tank still doesn't feel right (even if a time skip were involved), and then it struck me! A melee Healer that uses time magic to halt or rewind damage! After all, there's a strong connection between maces/hammers and clerics and the like (admittedly mostly in western media e.g. Warhammer Fantasy), and aligning it with Darkness would make for a fun twist, I think.

Damn it, I really want this now...

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No. Because nobody would bring a healer that actively takes away uptime from a melee. And there aren't strats centered around 5 player uptime. This is already a huge issue If you play 3 melee in savage. This is 1 of these ideas that sounds quirky on paper but once you implement it you realize nothing good comes out of it. If healers need innovation. Forcing them into melee spits with positional and incredibly tight heal ranges isn't it. Even if this some how got green lit (after "smile" anythings possible I guess) the backlash would be so intense from both players and party members that it would literally get patched out and given the drk treatment until it was

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I'd like to go the other direction and have a magic-based tank.

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What's the point In a tank that's ranged if the boss allways goes to it. Also wouldn't this literally break mecanics that force uptime stacks? This would just be equally as pointless.

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Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming

stuff

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you lack vision my friend. these rhetorical questions have been answered many a times over the last decade. now, the real problem is not *IF* it can be done, but how to mold it into the current limits that FF14 has created.
You randomly assigned restrictions on a melee healer that arent required. a melee healer is about their optimal dps being in melee range. not that they *MUST* stay in melee range. (As addressed in this very thread, and how to go about it fairly)

The absolute hardest gimmick to introduce into this game would be the ranged tank, 100%. Most of the games mechanics are built in a way to prevent its use from being useful, or from even functioning smooth enough to be enjoyable. So, rather than explain how it would be done in an ideal world, lets stick to how FF14 handles mechanics/gameplay usually.
(1) Ranged tank mostly means the tanks DPS can be applied from a distance, w/o suffering a DPS loss. (Such as a WAR spamming tomahawk)
but thats not entirely everythign ppl mean... so...
(2) To actually stand away from the boss, would require one of 2 things; (A) Crowd Controlling the boss from moving. (useless in 14, if not detrimental) and then (B) Pet tanking.
Pet tanking is seriously flawed in this game, which is why titan lost its ability to tank. The only way it could still work, is if its used like a cooldown. The pet vokes all nearby enemies, while taking reduced damage for X number of seconds. (Could be a replacement to the 40% reduction most tanks have) once the CD wears off, the pet goes away.
Its not around long enough to worry about needing to position the boss in X, Y, or Z location. (Id even argue u summon the pet with a ground marker, so u can have the boss move to that location. The pet cannot move.)
Another version of this would also be the invuln. Summon the pet again for 10s, and the pet cant die.
You can find ways to use this for more melee uptime. (an example for me, was when i was RDM, i really wanted to melee at points where only the 2 melee were allowed near the boss, so i was SooL and had to wait to get into melee range after we resolved mechanics.)

Do i think we *NEED* this? not really. but my only point is that its not really that absurd, even within the limits of how restricting the 14 tank/healer designs are.

Mechanics in this game are designed with 4 melees and 4 ranged in mind.

A melee healer kind of sounds like if you took away some of the tanky parts of a pvp paladin's kit and tweaked it so each time it heals itself, it also healed each other party member for that same amount. Like to use that as an example, on using Confeitor, you would afflict the boss with Sacred Claim, then each time you strike the boss with your damage dealing weaponskill abilities, you also heal party members each time, like as a 400 or 500 potency heal. Same with granting themself a regen and then party members.

If we were to consider what sort job fantasy this would be, I would personal say something that is nature-centric would differiante it. Though this could open it up to something that is specifically one thing, like wind or water or plants. Like if it were water, it could be a pirate corsair with water magic. If it were wind I would imagine a kind of azim steppe nomad. While for plants, I personally imagine a type of druid that might hail from somewhere like meracydia or xak tural.

Just cooking, but the healing for such a melee healer could be tied in a similar manner to a gauge bar like red mage's. Where the goal would be to fill a bar, then to later expend it for high potency emergency heals. The bar would be filled for simply doing dps rotation as it was intended.

It could, if the damage the disparity between ranged and melee was more homogenized so that taking 1 melee dps and 3 ranged jobs is indistinguishable from a comp that brings 2 melee and 2 ranged jobs. So basically put everything close to where Pictomancer and to a lesser extend black mage is.

The main issue is that SE designs mechanics around accomodating 4 melee jobs and 4 ranged jobs including tanks and healers. A ranged tank job could also work as a premier off tank job that has to be indistinguishable from a melee job whenever it's the main tank or has a sort of dummy/puppet that holds the attention of the target and the skill expression is how does one keep that alive. A melee healer seems very easy to make work since healers are primarily driven off ogcds and this wouldn't change for a melee job either.

So yeah, this could work, but would require SE to change how damage is distributed across the roles in the game so that it's worth taking 3 ranged to allow for that melee healer to be invited in. if you have a comp with 5 melee that will sucks for quite a few fights which means they need to make it so 4 melee jobs are the max which is why it is the way it is now

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Originally Posted by gllt

I mean I've always wanted a ranged healer that throws potions so why not

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Isn't that just a regular healer, but without ever having to worry about cast-times on the heals?

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Like warrior and pld?

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PLD heals from up to 30 yards away, same as any other healer. Though I suppose WAR at least has to be in 20 yards for Tomahawk as its last resort heal, and would need to be in melee range of multiple enemies to spam its Benediction.

As probably mentioned already in this thread, there are plenty of healing Spell/Abilities that are PBAOE already.

So, I don't think it would be out of the realm of possibility.

The class name and theme would be the tough one to figure out.

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Originally Posted by Fourbestintoner

Mechanics in this game are designed with 4 melees and 4 ranged in mind.

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I honestly dont think theres a single person in this thread that doesnt already know and assume that with the job idea in mind. (I could be wrong, but this has been addressed so many times, it's hard to understand why its still brought up, so I can only assume that most ppl making these replies are just doing a quick drop in and out of the thread. (Obviously theres a lot said in the thread, and its a pain to read it all.))

Would be good if they put their focus into making ranged healer gameplay better b4 making melee one.