[Character Graphics Update]: Second Benchmark Worries

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Originally Posted by HollowedDoll

From my understanding the new heads being able to morph into each other via shapekeys is a side effect of remaking the heads using the same base model and UV map rather than something that's actually being used in the end product.

I've seen this practice in other recent games as well. As for actual shapekey usage in this game, from what I've read about this it's either 0 or 1, unlike say visemes in Unity, so it's mostly used to have a certain shape applied for reasons such as overlapping gear. It's noticable with hairs especially because a lot of them drastically change shape rather than just get masked out.

I imagine faces are set up in a similar manner, whether they could turn these values into sliders is anyone's guess I suppose, but one would think if that was the case they would've done so already.

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Rather than a side effect, that's generally the very reason to use the method- it's why it makes it easier, due to removing the need to recreate the UVs and rigging on each one.

On whether or not they can implement sliders, it's possible for an older engine like theirs not to have the function to interact with shape keys. Looking at what we have now in terms of sliders:

The Height and Tail sliders scale the armature, and the Musculature slider overlays a normal map, which leaves the Bust slider as the only possibility for knowing if it's implemented already- I can see that being either bones again, or shapekeys.

Being worried for it is normal, but I feel like they probably are going to mainly try to fix the lighting issues and facial structure issues like they stated. Most people were upset with the mouth and some other things. For the eyes, I feel like they'll most likely change the lighting, because how eyes work now is they look dead because lighting is not updated in the benchmark to adjust to the new character models, so I think once they adjust that, the eyes will just end up looking not dead. Though that's what I am speculating on, I really don't feel like some things with eyes will be changed. I hope they fix the muting of colours, because it even happens with skin tone and hair colour, also hoping they fix the mouths to look similar to the ones we already have but just updated graphics, like how they showed in the previews in live letters.

Agree. Every change I've seen so far is objectively better. If they revert any of them I will be asking to speak with a manager.

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Originally Posted by HollowedDoll

From my understanding the new heads being able to morph into each other via shapekeys is a side effect of remaking the heads using the same base model and UV map rather than something that's actually being used in the end product.

I've seen this practice in other recent games as well. As for actual shapekey usage in this game, from what I've read about this it's either 0 or 1, unlike say visemes in Unity, so it's mostly used to have a certain shape applied for reasons such as overlapping gear. It's noticable with hairs especially because a lot of them drastically change shape rather than just get masked out.

I imagine faces are set up in a similar manner, whether they could turn these values into sliders is anyone's guess I suppose, but one would think if that was the case they would've done so already.

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It might be a side effect, yes, but it still required them to remake all the shapekeys for the different faces. The current retail faces already use shapekeys but they do not use the same base mesh.

You are most likely correct about the shapekeys currently being binary though. The mouth for example has 3 different shapekeys, 1 for each option in the character creator with no active shapekey being the default mouth shape and 4th option.

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Originally Posted by LordMcMutton

The Height and Tail sliders scale the armature, and the Musculature slider overlays a normal map, which leaves the Bust slider as the only possibility for knowing if it's implemented already- I can see that being either bones again, or shapekeys.

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At least right now all three, the height, tail length and bust size seem to all be done with bone scaling, the are no shapekeys on any of those meshes as far as one can see.

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Originally Posted by LordMcMutton

Rather than a side effect, that's generally the very reason to use the method- it's why it makes it easier, due to removing the need to recreate the UVs and rigging on each one.

On whether or not they can implement sliders, it's possible for an older engine like theirs not to have the function to interact with shape keys. Looking at what we have now in terms of sliders:

The Height and Tail sliders scale the armature, and the Musculature slider overlays a normal map, which leaves the Bust slider as the only possibility for knowing if it's implemented already- I can see that being either bones again, or shapekeys.

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Yeah I probably could've worded it better, what I mean is that it was a means to an end, not a beginning of some hyper customization of roe/au ra hybrid as some have suggested.

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Originally Posted by Absurdity

It might be a side effect, yes, but it still required them to remake all the shapekeys for the different faces. The current retail faces already use shapekeys but they do not use the same base mesh.

You are most likely correct about the shapekeys currently being binary though. The mouth for example has 3 different shapekeys, 1 for each option in the character creator with no active shapekey being the default mouth shape and 4th option.



At least right now all three, the height, tail length and bust size seem to all be done with bone scaling, the are no shapekeys on any of those meshes as far as one can see.

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Tbh even if they chose a different way unless they kept the same models they would've had to remake the various shapekeys regardless, and I'm not saying there isn't difference on some of them but they have a much better track record with these than everything else that seemingly used very little to no references (eyes, eyebrows, eyelashes, lips, roe/viera nose) still they should be able to adjust these shapes further.