Healers are punished too hard for dying

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

SCH’s unique advantage is the fact that the fairy heals aren’t affected by weakness or brink, SGE meanwhile every heal they have is affected by weakness because they are the originator of all their heals

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Erm physis and kera cole ,pani/hami is not affected I believe or tbh not sure since I barely if anything die to 95% of stuff in this game or least if my brain is just in off mode not paying attention but still even so we get our addergall back makes mp recovery though far easier than the other 3 healers and simply hitting kera/physis/ixo during then still is nice hp recovery for me and party as well, I barely feel any suffer effects off weaken tbh or brink of death on sage to be honest.

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Originally Posted by NobleWinter

I was under the impression that pets had stats based on the summoner at the time of creation so a SCH with brink of death would summon a fairy that reflects the lowered stats. Was there a change at some point to how the fairy and pets in general interact with the caster's stats? It's definitely a back end thing that the tooltips don't cover. I also don't know if I would call Eos avoiding Brink of Death an advantage. It takes 2 seconds to cast and that's if you can safely throw away transcendance and waste the MP on a pet that has no massive upfront heals for quick recovery. You have to use Dissipation to get Aetherflow for real recovery potential in a bind and that removes the fairy you just summoned. Eos avoiding Brink of Death just seems fair really.

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Much as I like this about sage it is quite funny yes we get our stuff back on death yeah while the other 3 lose their stuff. Ast is not so bad imo cause of draw which they get as early as lvl 30 and astrodyn if time well. WHM now I certainly see an issue with this as their mp recovery tools atm of all EW is just not the greatest. ast/sage is very mp spoiled.

Kera is probably the biggest button I hit as much as dosis even when I do not need it which yes its over healing but its still 10% migitation which helps anytime with free mp and hot and am not losing dps for it honestly. This makes tarochole become trash once you gain regen trait. I only ever use taro in dungeons below 76 or if I have our favorite darknight that I may end up using all my kit on.

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Originally Posted by IceBlueNinja

Much as I like this about sage it is quite funny yes we get our stuff back on death yeah while the other 3 lose their stuff. Ast is not so bad imo cause of draw which they get as early as lvl 30 and astrodyn if time well. WHM now I certainly see an issue with this as their mp recovery tools atm of all EW is just not the greatest. ast/sage is very mp spoiled.

Kera is probably the biggest button I hit as much as dosis even when I do not need it which yes its over healing but its still 10% migitation which helps anytime with free mp and hot and am not losing dps for it honestly. This makes tarochole become trash once you gain regen trait. I only ever use taro in dungeons below 76 or if I have our favorite darknight that I may end up using all my kit on.

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WHM’s mana economy is far stronger than SGE’s so I think that not getting lilys back as you sit on the floor is a fair trade, it’s just AST that’s cracked

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

WHM’s mana economy is far stronger than SGE’s so I think that not getting lilys back as you sit on the floor is a fair trade, it’s just AST that’s cracked

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Can you tell me how cause idk the last time I try whm mp recovery seems awful with assize mere 5% recovery (if lucid on cd they are screwed) and thin air nerf on top of it I really cant vison how whm mp recovery is stronger than sages when like sch most of our stuff is mp cost free via addergall, even sch I feel has it better than whm. I probably just do not mess with whm enough cause its so snooze fest since forever and lack any thing fun compared to sch/sge and ast even though they are my favorite co healer xD.

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Originally Posted by IceBlueNinja

Can you tell me how cause idk the last time I try whm mp recovery seems awful with assize mere 5% recovery (if lucid on cd they are screwed) and thin air nerf on top of it I really cant vison how whm mp recovery is stronger than sages when like sch most of our stuff is mp cost free via addergall, even sch I feel has it better than whm. I probably just do not mess with whm enough cause its so snooze fest since forever and lack any thing fun compared to sch/sge and ast even though they are my favorite co healer xD.

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It’s because of lilys, you use 4 lilys per minute (3 blue 1 red), each lily is worth 400mp (the cost of a glare), you also get 1 charge of thin air per minute; another 400 mp, and you get assize (500mp), so ignoring lucid you get 2500mp per minute of mp. WHM can also cancel rezz costs with thin air which is a massive MP advantage the other healers don’t get (not that AST needs it)

SGE meanwhile only gets its three addersgall and rhizomata which is weaker in MP (70”*3+0.66*700) and lacks thin air’s unique rezz cancelation and also lacks lilys flexibility to push more lilys into mp intensive windows by “storing” blue lilys inside the red lily (ie spend 3 lilys, immediately get red lily, spend it, then in the same minute you get 3 more blue lilys)

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

It’s because of lilys, you use 4 lilys per minute (3 blue 1 red), each lily is worth 400mp (the cost of a glare), you also get 1 charge of thin air per minute; another 400 mp, and you get assize (500mp), so ignoring lucid you get 2500mp per minute of mp. WHM can also cancel rezz costs with thin air which is a massive MP advantage the other healers don’t get (not that AST needs it)

SGE meanwhile only gets its three addersgall and rhizomata which is weaker in MP (300*3+0.66*300) because you need to account for the MP spent on the dosis cast you weaved the addersgall ability into and lacks thin air’s unique rezz cancelation and also lacks lilys flexibility to push more lilys into mp intensive windows by “storing” blue lilys inside the red lily (ie spend 3 lilys, immediately get red lily, spend it, then in the same minute you get 3 more blue lilys)

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An addergall restores 700 mp not 300 via ixo/druo/taro/kera thats +rhizo would be = 3500 mp am getting back easily without lucid and remember there is never a reason to ever not be using kero when its up heck even ixo if the fight is very easy that needs almost no heals, even with using dosis between Im almost always full on mp.

Ixo is 30 seconds cool down and kera is 30 seconds = thin air 60 seconds, taro is 45 seconds (only 5 seconds longer than assize but still gives 700 mp vs assize 500. But yes you are indeed correct when it comes to res ast/whm can really counter that easily with thin air/draw/astrodyne which actually makes em abit better than sch/sge on that part.

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Originally Posted by Bole

You're counting the total amount of MP per GCD for Addersgall (Dosis + Kerachole) but for Lily you're not (instead of 0, you're counting it as +400 MP). If you're treating Lilie's as a free Glare, ie a Glare that costs 400 MP but 400 MP is refunded, then you have to ignore the MP cost of Dosis. You're also ignoring Phlegma.

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Ah you are correct, my bad, sorry iceblueninja, yes so then WHM’s total MP becomes 2500 and SGE’s becomes 2400 with the difference being the ability of thin air to cancel rezz, so actually decently close

Phlegma is irrelevant because it has the same MP cost as dosis

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Originally Posted by Bole

I swear I thought Phlegma was free, I guess that's just Toxicon.

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If I remember correctly phlegma actually used to cost more than dosis so it basically cancelled out the extra MP from rhizomata, but of course this was back when lilys were a loss so WHM’s MP was in the trash

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Originally Posted by IceBlueNinja

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Erm physis and kera cole ,pani/hami is not affected I believe or tbh not sure since I barely if anything die to 95% of stuff in this game or least if my brain is just in off mode not paying attention but still even so we get our addergall back makes mp recovery though far easier than the other 3 healers and simply hitting kera/physis/ixo during then still is nice hp recovery for me and party as well, I barely feel any suffer effects off weaken tbh or brink of death on sage to be honest.

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Hard mitigative% aren't affected, that's true.

They were discussing how it affects the cure potencies however. Physis HoT, Kerakeia HoT, (Pan)Haima potencies, they're all affected by Weakness/Brink of Death. But any heals from fairies aren't affected by them which seems bizarre.

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Originally Posted by Bole

I swear I thought Phlegma was free, I guess that's just Toxicon.

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https://i.gyazo.com/43ed0181aa63cbfa...349cf4044a.png

If you're remembering some GCD that costs more than 400 MP within SGE, that's Pneuma:

https://i.gyazo.com/70b30458094a9191...67515ee518.png