Congratulations on FF16 being a huge success

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Originally Posted by Avatre

There definitely are some resources that were shifted from FFXIV to FFXVI, maybe not as much as a lot of people seem to think, but the basic way of companies working on new projects is shift some personnel over to the new project, rather than spending more money on new hires to work on the new project. It might not be why we don't have the exploratory zone, or it might very well be the reason since the resources they would have had to cover everything with that zone added just weren't there when people were moved to the new project.

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Highly unlikely as in this expansion we've got a new Deep Dungeon just because Yoshida has stated how surprised he was to see many people asking for it. He never not added one last expansion due to money.

If you pay attention to the language Yoshida and the deva reply to some content question its almost always because of their own decisions at the time and never because "oh we just dont have the money or manpower".

Same is said with exploratory zones. You can see how much they nerfed the content in Shb with Bozja compared to the 4 zones in Eureka. The dev team had a lot of feedback with the content and most of it was negative to the general audience so come Shb they streamlined it to just be 2 zones and come EW they decided not to do one in order to make room for new content. A lot of the choices has always been because they saw the response with the playerbase and its telling how quickly people forget on their mentality they expressed 2 years ago.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

He never not added one last expansion due to money.

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Honestly, it has less to do with money and more to do with experience. At least within the company I work for, just bringing in new people, even people with experience in the same field, isn't going to help the current situation.

SE needed experienced SE employees working on ffxvi. Some of the selected staff were from Yoshida's xiv team (as confirmed in interviews). This did take resources away from xiv.

In the demo credits, Soken did all the music and Fox did the English translation while Yoshi-P produced - I can't image what Soken and Fox's workload would've been if they had to do a lot of FF14 work concurrently. That said the demo was awesome but totally dark for a FF game (first time I ever heard the F word in a Final Fantasy game
in the English version)!

It's dark, yes, though I'd say it's simply showing what was simply implied or censored in other titles. Type-0 is probably the closest in terms of blood and death being shown on screen whereas Final Fantasy Tactics and Final Fantasy XII showcase the more mature take on political intrigue. As for swearing, FFVII had quite a bit - some censored but implied but some outright swearing, particularly Aerith saying a certain word whilst stumbling on a ladder.

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Originally Posted by MirielleLavandre

That said the demo was awesome but totally dark for a FF game (first time I ever heard the F word in a Final Fantasy game
in the English version)!

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I take it you never played FF Type-0? Since you consider XVI "totally dark for a FF game". While there are games before it that are pretty dark themselves.

Final Fantasy VI has one of the protagonists attempt to commit suicide on screen if you fail a specific task that, without knowing the details of how it works, is very easy to fail.

While Type-0 and maybe FF7 remake had some, I was more referring to seeing peoples' throats cut, heads banged in and cut off, and blood spurting after getting crushed by a rock as being things that I wasn't aware was ever actually shown (not implied or guessed at) in a Final Fantasy game.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

Same is said with exploratory zones. You can see how much they nerfed the content in Shb with Bozja compared to the 4 zones in Eureka. The dev team had a lot of feedback with the content and most of it was negative to the general audience so come Shb they streamlined it to just be 2 zones and come EW they decided not to do one in order to make room for new content. A lot of the choices has always been because they saw the response with the playerbase and its telling how quickly people forget on their mentality they expressed 2 years ago.

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The sad thing is, instead of improving or making the zones like Eureka or bozja experience better, they simply scrap it and reinvent the whole damn wheel. Its always seems to be the extreme reaction to a negative experience with SE, Yoshi and the dev team which is scrap it lol. Thats my take.

Im not entirely sure what to think at the moment because there are so many factors here that could be true or false unless we had insider knowledge. So first off we know the 16 team went into full production probably before shadowbringers and like pre-production around stormblood. We didn't get any decline in quality to my knowledge from then till now and what is..is all subjective really (like getting variant and island and deep but no explore zone etc) It makes sense a company will take some money off of their money makers to fund new projects its just outside of the 'supposed' mog station purchases we don't know how much goes to dev and elsewhere. On top of that we have seen them constantly putting out posts for recruitment for their division and even recently finding out platinum games and Business Unit 1 helped in certain areas alongside sony devs helping them too. This is without knowing what other outsourcing they done too. The funny thing is if you haven't played 14 before you'll not notice it but there are a lot of enemies albeit redone but plenty of original so far that are asset ripped from 14 (Heres hoping they get put back in for 7.0 wishful thinking)


The other end is resources being spent with what they have...they have an allocation of what they can do in a patch window...it just seems with Endwalker they have put more spent on QoL, PVP Rework and new mode, New content types and new player experience/tweaks then dedicating to the endgame longevity. Which this has been a benefit and negative in many ways and I am not going to defend some of its decisions but just looking at it from a birds eye view. Also money spent on upgrading servers and adding new DC and Worlds which is a money investment alongside the graphics update which we know even during the 7.X series they want to update everything like its a big undertaking..sure some of us are like we could of done without we want more content. A lot of new players or demographics wouldn't of picked it up for instance cause some players do like to have some nice visuals (as fickle as it is, art direction is key)

I think with 14 and 16 they are both doing things the long term or long beloved franchise players don't like but at the same time they are appealing to a bigger net so it feels like for the 1 person saying they wont play 16 cause it ain't turn based they've gotten 10 people who loved the demo combat and with 14 loads showing critique to relics or longevity yet new players feeling more invited then before thanks to the duty support or people wanting to now play or try the PVP. Like I said these are possible factors and I could be completely wrong but it is too soon to say on either end...we don't know how 16 will be received and its still just over a month till fanfest. I would like to keep my fingers crossed but only time will tell.

Theyre was for sure some shortening of FFXIV development but wouldnt blame completely blame CBU3, they just got blindsided. Last I heard FFXVI development started around the end of HW, 3.4.~3.5, so im sure it work load wasnt too hard on devs team then. But we got hit with the big bug and that definitely nuked a few months of flowing work to down dribble especially in Japan. Push comes to shove, FFXVI crunch time, they had to do the bare minimum here so they can get a decent product out there.

FFXVI looks like Forspoken without the hot chick.......Clive aint enough to get me through that $hit......
https://64.media.tumblr.com/e2e28ae0...b0c87ec7e6.jpg

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

Highly unlikely as in this expansion we've got a new Deep Dungeon just because Yoshida has stated how surprised he was to see many people asking for it. He never not added one last expansion due to money.

If you pay attention to the language Yoshida and the deva reply to some content question its almost always because of their own decisions at the time and never because "oh we just dont have the money or manpower".

Same is said with exploratory zones. You can see how much they nerfed the content in Shb with Bozja compared to the 4 zones in Eureka. The dev team had a lot of feedback with the content and most of it was negative to the general audience so come Shb they streamlined it to just be 2 zones and come EW they decided not to do one in order to make room for new content. A lot of the choices has always been because they saw the response with the playerbase and its telling how quickly people forget on their mentality they expressed 2 years ago.

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So a few things here, no company publicly states they dont have the money or man power - actually Yoshida has stated they lacked man power esp for PVE content, however man power is remedied by investment of experienced hiring which includes other studios, something a lot of devs actually do by the way.

So theres a deep dungeon after how long, wheres the other content? wheres the other dungeons they took away, wheres the other ex trials they can release a few per patch at a time, why is there no content for the relic - theres your answer, they took away from other bits of content into the other as they lack the resources because they dont have funds.

Actually having all of the money will work, pay people lots of money, have lots of those people, and you are fine.

Yoshida does indeed uses clever language, but not the way you think, he has people like you hooked and lined.

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Originally Posted by MirielleLavandre

While Type-0 and maybe FF7 remake had some, I was more referring to seeing peoples' throats cut, heads banged in and cut off, and blood spurting after getting crushed by a rock as being things that I wasn't aware was ever actually shown (not implied or guessed at) in a Final Fantasy game.

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No blood since it was NES but II did have someone get squashed by a rock.

And isn't the latest word that they started working on XVI in post-HW? But some things that people praise the most when these threads come up happened in Stormblood and Shadowbringers.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

No blood since it was NES but II did have someone get squashed by a rock.

And isn't the latest word that they started working on XVI in post-HW? But some things that people praise the most when these threads come up happened in Stormblood and Shadowbringers.

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Most likely very early pre-production with a small team then as time goes on development ramps up, it would have been in the Endwalker dev cycle that the manpower need was at its highest.

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Originally Posted by MonsutaMan

FFXVI looks like Forspoken without the hot chick.......Clive aint enough to get me through that $hit......
https://64.media.tumblr.com/e2e28ae0...b0c87ec7e6.jpg

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If the game is fun, I really dont care how the characters look.
Sometimes even ugly characters can be awesome.

I haven't pre-ordered yet; still on the fence about buying FF XVI full price. People are going crazy about the demo and prematurely calling it GOTY.

I found the demo very interesting, not necessarily good. The story and voice acting is very good. Cinematics are not the most important part of a videogame, not even when it's FF. If the gameplay part of a game brings me no joy then it's not a great game.

The action gameplay can be hard to follow due to the close camera, flashy effects and the need to track cooldown timers. There's a rush to target move but only in Ifrit mode, so you might have to press the toggle button twice to cycle back into Ifrit before you can press the gap closer. There's a block in Titan mode. You have to keep glancing at the HUD. This system is clunky to me. You can equip assist rings that do the moves for you, making it stay unfun but for a different reason.

They brought in a Devil May Cry guy. I've always preferred Ninja Gaiden. To this day I still hold up NG II as the best example of action gameplay. I don't remember ever meeting someone who agrees with me but the rest of the world is wrong, everyone is a moron and that's why we have so many shitty games.

NG II has a moves list like a fighting game and you just dial up combos; has no cooldown timers; has a higher camera to show enemies around you; doesn't have flashy attack effects that obscure parry windows; lets you jump and run up things during its kinetic battles for you to find the best positioning; is very fast. Then Team Ninja botched NG3 and switched to slow Souls clone games instead...

TL;DR Square still haven't made one great action game and I wish they stuck to the ATB system they had on SNES and PS1. It's like turn-based but time advances and each character can move when their bar is filled. They were better at strategic command-based game. Yoshida has great respect for that era but he still made something completely different.

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Originally Posted by MonsutaMan

FFXVI looks like Forspoken without the hot chick.......Clive aint enough to get me through that $hit......
https://64.media.tumblr.com/e2e28ae0...b0c87ec7e6.jpg

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She is beautiful, no doubts there, but counterpoint:

https://media.tenor.com/v_i2K_i_EVYAAAAC/torgal.gif

SO CUTE

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Originally Posted by MsMisato

The sad thing is, instead of improving or making the zones like Eureka or bozja experience better, they simply scrap it and reinvent the whole damn wheel. Its always seems to be the extreme reaction to a negative experience with SE, Yoshi and the dev team which is scrap it lol. Thats my take.

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They kinda have to. The 'exploratory' content for each expansion has to be something new, so that players who didn't devote 2 years of their life to the last one aren't gated from it. You need to be able to jump right into Bozja at level 80, instead of making your way through all of Eureka first. And when it's something you don't need to have beaten the 'last one' in order to enter, that content has to be shiny and different to the last one so that those who did beat it, aren't just repeating the same thing all over again.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

If the game is fun, I really dont care how the characters look.
Sometimes even ugly characters can be awesome.

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You're underestimating value of this, r34 is what amplified Overwatch's and other games' popularity. If you make characters hot enough, your fans will help you promote your game, even now when you look at certain sites, you will frequently get some good shit with Tifa or 2B for example - this is just free marketing. Having hot characters is all around positive thing, if I wanted to see something ugly, I would just look in the mirror.

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Originally Posted by Deo14

You're underestimating value of this, r34 is what amplified Overwatch's and other games' popularity. If you make characters hot enough, your fans will help you promote your game, even now when you look at certain sites, you will frequently get some good shit with Tifa or 2B for example - this is just free marketing. Having hot characters is all around positive thing, if I wanted to see something ugly, I would just look in the mirror.

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https://i.imgur.com/bPR5gPF.gif

Personally like playing good looking characters, I don't mind if there are ugly options but I do not personally get the whole 'ugly like me' concept that some game companies have gone with. Not all games have to be made for me though, so /shrug, games for everyone.

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Originally Posted by Deo14

if I wanted to see something ugly, I would just look in the mirror.

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mood /10char

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Originally Posted by MirielleLavandre

In the demo credits, Soken did all the music and Fox did the English translation while Yoshi-P produced - I can't image what Soken and Fox's workload would've been if they had to do a lot of FF14 work concurrently. That said the demo was awesome but totally dark for a FF game (first time I ever heard the F word in a Final Fantasy game
in the English version)!

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And C word for a manhood yep. :D First time ever heard a FF character call someone that.

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Originally Posted by Deo14

You're underestimating value of this, r34 is what amplified Overwatch's and other games' popularity. If you make characters hot enough, your fans will help you promote your game, even now when you look at certain sites, you will frequently get some good shit with Tifa or 2B for example - this is just free marketing. Having hot characters is all around positive thing, if I wanted to see something ugly, I would just look in the mirror.

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The inverse of this is being Randy Pitchford and attempting to will Battleborn R34 into existence.

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Originally Posted by Reap00

They obviously didn't do to much damage to XIV. You are still here playing the game. Also the latest unofficial census doesn't make your assessment reasonable.

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People can play the game but still be unhappy with content delivered you know.

Eh I'm more excited for Dragon's Dogma 2 than I am for 16. How 14 was handled kind of left a bad taste and now I'm not so sure I even want to buy 16.

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Originally Posted by Kyrj

Eh I'm more excited for Dragon's Dogma 2 than I am for 16. How 14 was handled kind of left a bad taste and now I'm not so sure I even want to buy 16.

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Based Dragon's Dogma enjoyer.

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Originally Posted by MonsutaMan

FFXVI looks like Forspoken without the hot chick.......Clive aint enough to get me through that $hit......

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Who cares, the men are eye candy after all :)

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Originally Posted by Deo14

You're underestimating value of this, r34 is what amplified Overwatch's and other games' popularity. If you make characters hot enough, your fans will help you promote your game, even now when you look at certain sites, you will frequently get some good shit with Tifa or 2B for example - this is just free marketing. Having hot characters is all around positive thing, if I wanted to see something ugly, I would just look in the mirror.

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Im not, this is just my mindset and how I feel with characters in Videogames and Movies after a few Decades.
Of course, attractive looking actors or Designs...attract people lol, But that doesn't make them good characters in some cases. r34 and other levels of Fanart boost popularity...but all the same, its not something that matters to me THAT much.

This is just personal opinion.
I dont care IF they are hot, or IF they are Ugly. I just want a good character.
Clive Looks Hot in FFXVI......cool...now is he a Good Character?
All that matters to me.

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Originally Posted by Rufalus

They brought in a Devil May Cry guy. I've always preferred Ninja Gaiden. To this day I still hold up NG II as the best example of action gameplay. I don't remember ever meeting someone who agrees with me but the rest of the world is wrong, everyone is a moron and that's why we have so many shitty games.

NG II has a moves list like a fighting game and you just dial up combos; has no cooldown timers; has a higher camera to show enemies around you; doesn't have flashy attack effects that obscure parry windows; lets you jump and run up things during its kinetic battles for you to find the best positioning; is very fast. Then Team Ninja botched NG3 and switched to slow Souls clone games instead...

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Team Ninjas propensity to design their games to curb stomp the player might be to blame for going souls clone since people playing them seem to be into eating dirt.

I'll just say i never found the camera in NG2 any better than any other game since those black spider clowns move so fast and love leap attacking and throwing bombs from outside your FoV.

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Originally Posted by Misplaced_Marbles

Team Ninjas propensity to design their games to curb stomp the player might be to blame for going souls clone since people playing them seem to be into eating dirt.

I'll just say i never found the camera in NG2 any better than any other game since those black spider clowns move so fast and love leap attacking and throwing bombs from outside your FoV.

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Nioh 1/2 are damn good games tho. And legit harder than Soulsgames, altho you can cheese pretty hard as well.

OK, actually bothering to see if the thread had any merit on the OP.

Yeah, I was right to skip it long ago.

It isn't a Hollowing out of XIV..,
If you were at all someone who was paying attention.<or gave a damn>

You'd know what XVI did in Relation to XIV.

or the fact it didn't hollow out..,

Questions that you should be asking to make an undeniably terrible joke, didn't even achieve its main objective.


But yeah, if XVI reaches its huge success I imagine it'll be a good change for XIV.

As it'll feed into the idea that the Community has matured beyond the simple topics, and can handle more complexity or simplicity.
<Deeper topics, with less wording but obvious storytelling cues outside of dialog>
Which most who've seen the Demo, first hand or watching know.

Did very damn well, if you were paying attention.

Here's to a successful XVI launch.

And it's potential Positive Feedbacks into what FF will be in the future.
[More So, since they didn't pretend to know best, and Sought out help from their larger umbrella.]

Why do the troll(s) seemingly get so many likes/upvotes? I figure a fraction of them are his own alts, but it's still high enough that plenty of real people are clicking it too and it just mind boggles me every time.

I'm personally not getting 16 and I have zero interest in it. I'm happy for the people that have sought refuge in it after almost 3 decades of nothing but Nomura titles, but when it comes to my own tastes with fantasy/aesthetic/story elements 16 shifted way into the opposite direction for me. The Game of Thrones-esque "people talking about medieval politics in a dimly lit room" story doesn't appeal to me at all, but I can see why people would prefer it in a market that is saturated with goofy Marvel-ish nonsense.

Hope those that are planning to get it enjoy it tho. As much as SE frustrates me to no end with their awful decisions, they need a win after all of their recent failures.

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Originally Posted by SilversLyu

Nioh 1/2 are damn good games tho. And legit harder than Soulsgames, altho you can cheese pretty hard as well.

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Nioh is Fun...but for me it was Super Easy, until the DLC. Because I think they Really Jumped the Lv for the 1st mission: as if everybody beat the game early and have been grinding to max ever since
Nioh 2 put in a Bunch of Mechanics and...to me tried to be abit more like Darksouls with the amount of Nonsense they put in the game. I hated it. But I will beat it.

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Originally Posted by Nav_Fae

Why do the troll(s) seemingly get so many likes/upvotes? I figure a fraction of them are his own alts, but it's still high enough that plenty of real people are clicking it too and it just mind boggles me every time.

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It’s easy to upvote yourself when you have 10+ accounts.

That and some weird troll union where they all agree under the light of the moon to like each other’s posts.

I boycot FF16 for stealing dev time and ressources from FF14. It would have been okay, if they lowered the subscription prices during this time, but they didn't. Just longer and longer patch cycles, less content to play, but same price, while Yoshi P is busy with another game. I don't feel good with that. And I won't support that.

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Originally Posted by Heavenchild

I boycot FF16 for stealing dev time and ressources from FF14. It would have been okay, if they lowered the subscription prices during this time, but they didn't. Just longer and longer patch cycles, less content to play, but same price, while Yoshi P is busy with another game. I don't feel good with that. And I won't support that.

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Go right ahead and boycott the game. I'm sure it'll live on without you.

It will, but we all vote with our wallet. : )

The development timeline of 16 can be pretty easily mapped with a brief 5 minutes on google. It covered roughly the past 3 expansions. If Stormblood, Shadowbringers and Endwalker are considered the "hollowing out" of 14, then hell, hollow us out more I've been having loads of fun.

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Originally Posted by Reimmi

People can play the game but still be unhappy with content delivered you know.

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Oh don't I know it. People LOVE to complain on this forum. I love to read it too. It makes me giggle.