6.4: Dark throne review

I am a huge FF4 fan. It was my first FF game ever. I have been dying for the four fiends, Golbez, and Zeromus. Zeromus was expected and that filled my excitement really. I wanted Zeromus in this game for years as an old school fan. Their fan service was meant for people exactly like me. But even this patch left me feeling a bit unsatisfied. I don't normally like to engage with these negative threads cause they kind of spiral out of control in unproductive ways; but as someone who wanted this fan service, I felt kind of disappointed. It's not that things were predictable. Of course, they were going to be if you knew the original FF4. It's that the delivery was underwhelming. The pacing wasn't great, and threats feel cheap. I wanted this FF4 fan service but so far it feels like they made the void story more confusing by having things like Goblez be apart of the void for thousands of years but just now decided to make Zeromus happen. It just feels kind of random honestly. I was hoping to spend more time on the Red Moon. I wanted a dungeon on the Red Moon, not the Aetherfront. I think the Golbez trial it self is actually fine. It's just kind of everything else around it that feels bleh. At least the FF4 remixes were great. I give them that win. But at the moment it feels more like 6.5 story is going to be "Do more filler quests to strengthen the wards. Find a quick solution that's been in front of our faces the whole time since we have every smart person in the universe in one room now, which will lead to us making a ward that not even Zodiark could tamper with. Go back to the Red Moon then confront Zeromus. Go home, and probably meet this new client or whatever for 6.55."

PS: I'm also kind of broken at the thought that Zeromus was nothing at all like the one from FF4 but maybe this was done intentionally so it wouldn't be predictable.

I honestly think this entire story is being written as we go as a direct response to people who were mad that Zodiark barely played a role in EW's plot.

Also remember when Thancred showed up, said thancred things then left? that was the best part

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Originally Posted by Oizen

I honestly think this entire story is being written as we go as a direct response to people who were mad that Zodiark barely played a role in EW's plot.

Also remember when Thancred showed up, said thancred things then left? that was the best part

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I like how he was literally invited to show up just to say Thancred things then left. Though I think it was also to double having a tank for trusts. If you haven't noticed, every dungeon in EW so far has had a random number of scions show up right before the dungeon then disappear afterwards.

I had no issues with the patch. I thought the story was enjoyable, but also mostly expected. I'm not really sure what people expect when they've been doing this "1 dungeon 1 trial" per major patch for a few expansions now. It feels routine... because it is. They've used a formula that has worked (subscription-wise at least) for a decade. I don't really know what people were expecting. Remember when the playerbase complained about the post-ARR 2.X storyline. So they shortened it up as well as using that in future expansions... and players don't like that either.

They can't win.

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Originally Posted by dspguy

I had no issues with the patch. I thought the story was enjoyable, but also mostly expected. I'm not really sure what people expect when they've been doing this "1 dungeon 1 trial" per major patch for a few expansions now. It feels routine... because it is. They've used a formula that has worked (subscription-wise at least) for a decade. I don't really know what people were expecting. Remember when the playerbase complained about the post-ARR 2.X storyline. So they shortened it up as well as using that in future expansions... and players don't like that either.

They can't win.

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They can't win but it's also the pacing that's changed. EW is probably the first expansion where every patch trial has been apart of the MSQ since ARR. I never really thought about it until now but I think trying to force all these trials into the MSQ each patch has done something to make tensions and pacing not feel so good for story telling.

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Originally Posted by CNitsah

I have difficulties to believe the guy that wrote this are the same that wrote EW.

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It’s not the same team that did 6.0, the lead story writer said that she is stepping back from doing ShB and EW to let their junior writers each do a patch.

This was said when they gave the 6.x roadmap in the PLL.

My biggest issue is that they crammed two expansions worth of content into 6.0 and then had to spread a single patch worth of content out over 5 patches.

They should have had 6.0 end with Zodiark and then finish 6.3 with the Endsinger fight. Everything we have done since 6.1 could have been done in 2 patches.

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Originally Posted by Hyperia

It’s not the same team that did 6.0, the lead story writer said that she is stepping back from doing ShB and EW to let their junior writers each do a patch.

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That explains a lot. I'm not reassured for 7.0.

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Originally Posted by dspguy

I had no issues with the patch. I thought the story was enjoyable, but also mostly expected. I'm not really sure what people expect when they've been doing this "1 dungeon 1 trial" per major patch for a few expansions now. It feels routine... because it is. They've used a formula that has worked (subscription-wise at least) for a decade. I don't really know what people were expecting. Remember when the playerbase complained about the post-ARR 2.X storyline. So they shortened it up as well as using that in future expansions... and players don't like that either.

They can't win.

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Well the issue is more of the fact they stick to the exact same formula to a T for each patch. Mixing it up would be nice.

Guess I'm in the minority. I quite enjoyed what we have going. People using the "were just standing around talking" excuse don't make sense. The majority of xiv since ARR has been that.
Next to call most of it "filler" is also off. Time spent for character development and establishing alliances isn't filler. Radz and Garl making that agreement is huge for Garl restoring itself down the road.
Next I find it interesting many say things are predictable yet everyone n their mom that I saw here said Zero would become Zeromus. That didn't happen, nor did I see anyone pinpoint that the remains of Zodi would be used to create it. Regardless of the Talismans being to hold on not it was clear we couldn't touch Zeromus so we had to leave. Beating and finishing this story would fall pretty flat with just Golbez narrative as I believe there's more to him to learn still (like him possibly being the WoL of the 13th, or rather the original being that).

Idk maybe I'm weird.

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Originally Posted by IkaraGreydancer

Guess I'm in the minority. I quite enjoyed what we have going. *Snipe for Post Length*

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+1 in the minority. I loved the Dark Throne MSQ, now that I finished it after work. Stayed up late too to finish as I was captivated.

The opening showing some downtime and relationship building with our colleagues is great to see, along with more world building for the Garlean people. I liked acknowledging that they aren't content living on charity nor do they want to do so forever, and how hard that would be for a proud people brought low.

FF4 is my favorite Final Fantasy of all time after 14, so more nods to that game always bring me incredible joy. The Octopus boss, Golbez, Baron, and the wonderful remixes to the Moon theme and Overland/Four Fiends, Golbez & the Dragon....all was fantastic. Those of us who know FF4 might have expected Zeromus would appear in some form, just how it happened was surprising. Also looks far more menacing a presence than the original. I know there was a complaint about a false victory with Golbez, but honestly...that was Golbez in FF4 too. In that game after defeating him our entire party watches as he slowly, tile by tile, crawled towards the crystal the party was protecting and snatched it away. Hilarious moment of "why are you all just standing there!?" But here it made more sense how it all played out. Our characters generally try to see the good that exists in other characters, even villains, and do not generally just brutally massacre their enemies once they have them down. It all happened relatively quickly as well so the characters didn't seem foolish like in early ARR where we watch Gaius slowly, slowly walk towards the Ultima Weapon, and we watch him give a speech rather than blasting him off as he spoke or simply not letting him slowly walk towards it to begin with. That was far worse to me than what happened here.

New dungeon was gorgeous and the dungeon and trial for the people I did it with as first timers was challenging (wipes on dungeon, no wipe but many deaths and needing to rez on the trial - I brought summoner for more rezzes but also needed rezzes myself) had a fun amount of challenge for the average player.

Zero is really growing on me and I love seeing her slowly open up with her trust issues. And my love, my Y'shtola - glad to see she is still on her own journey to return to the people she loves in the First, and her own interests having been forgotten. Personally my WoL would be very interested in helping her more with this but that's maybe a me thing.

Anyway, story was a decent length given there's only a few months of development. Not sure how people expect entire expansions in a patch. Didn't do the Raid yet or the Tartaru quest - but I work full time so I can't devour everything in a day. Looking forward to it though and predict I'll enjoy that content a lot as well.

I noticed how it felt like the story was taking too long, but it was also being heavily realistic with things. Of course we're not going to just go to the island, we're having to follow proper protocol. Of course the Garleans are understandably traumatized by the last time the tower went on and still don't trust others. Of course we're having to set thing up to actually reach Golbez and the 13th's moon. It felt boring, but it was being fairly realistic with things.

Also, keep in mind that they DO change writers for some of the patches. The new writer who'll be doing 7.0 worked on 4.2 (collaboration), 4.4, 5.1 (collaboration), and 5.5's story, while there were others working on other patches story.

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Originally Posted by Remish

I like how he was literally invited to show up just to say Thancred things then left. Though I think it was also to double having a tank for trusts. If you haven't noticed, every dungeon in EW so far has had a random number of scions show up right before the dungeon then disappear afterwards.

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It makes me sad at how awkwardly obvious this was and that this is going to be the norm from now on.

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Originally Posted by Rokke

It makes me sad at how awkwardly obvious this was and that this is going to be the norm from now on.

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Probably won't need to be like this for next expansion, since it already confirmed that both Thancred and Krile will be there. That's the Tank/Healer slots right there.

6.4 MSQ is Anabaseios.
Raid writing is better in EW since p1.

People here pretending the story not going forward is anything new.

Just look back at SHB.

5.1... exists...? and barely moves the plot forward.
5.2 you get cockblocked at the end
5.3 you finally kill elidibus and go back to the source - okay plot has moved forward....
5.4 is litterally a bunch of fetch quests
5.5 again more fetch quests

Like, okay, you help gaabu and tiamat and idk some other beast tribe - but is it really worth it?
It barely moves the plot into endwalker territory, you're just tying up loose ends from ARR.
And yet for some reason, going into a dungeon to get a big pork so that it can squeal some sense in some people who got high on primals was peak story telling,
Meanwhile developing Garlemald further - the place everyone wanted to see more and that apparently "got gutted" by the msq - that's the lowest point the story has gone

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Probably won't need to be like this for next expansion, since it already confirmed that both Thancred and Krile will be there. That's the Tank/Healer slots right there.

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My issue is more that we've become chained to the scions. In past expansions we sometimes split off from them and canonically it was treated as if we acted alone.

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Originally Posted by Rokke

My issue is more that we've become chained to the scions. In past expansions we sometimes split off from them and canonically it was treated as if we acted alone.

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Hopefully 8.0 will be the New World with new characters...or at least let us use the B Scions more. I wouldn't mind an adventure with Hoary Boulder, Clemence (she's studying AST and SCH magic), Bluomwyda, etc etc. Give the B team some limelight Yoshi-P, it'd be such a breath of fresh air!

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Originally Posted by Rokke

It makes me sad at how awkwardly obvious this was and that this is going to be the norm from now on.

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Yeah, even though I haven't progressed much in the post-End Walker MSQ and side quests, I have noticed this same repeating pattern.

Urianger: It is as I feareth. The stars speaketh of a great danger to thy yonder realms.

Alphinaud: "We are going to need to travel to such and such and need an expert on [insert topic.]"

Y'shtola and/or G'raha Tia walks into the room.

Y'shtola and/or G'raha Tia : "I'm studying this [related topic]. I believe it's the result of [insert topic] and I have memorized a dozen books on the subject."

Alaise: "Well, we are organizing an expedition and happen to have a spot open. Would you like to join us?"

Y'shtola and/or G'raha Tia: "It would be a pleasure."

Rinse and repeat X20...

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Originally Posted by Kacho_Nacho

Rinse and repeat X20...

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Repeated so many times that even Yoshi P decided to give them some brief holidays

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Originally Posted by EliaStormblade

At the start of the MSQ, some voices seem a little off. Had the same with Estinien too.

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For me it was Nidhana who sounded off. Maybe the team got new equipment for the VAs?

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Originally Posted by Knot_D

Can't handle the reality huh? Because it's true that his sweats are the plots all along. :)

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I feel like between this and the curry scene the devs wanted to show off their particle effects engine, or something.

Felt like they were letting the Hildebrand urges out a bit.

I haven't read the whole thread, but Thancred meeting Zero was very ..odd. He sort of half flirts with her, she ignores him, and then Urianger says this weird bit about Thancred being able to help Zero because of his experience. It was super stilted and felt really awkward. Not sure what they were going for there.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

I haven't read the whole thread, but Thancred meeting Zero was very ..odd. He sort of half flirts with her, she ignores him, and then Urianger says this weird bit about Thancred being able to help Zero because of his experience. It was super stilted and felt really awkward. Not sure what they were going for there.

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I had no idea either. It was a strange encounter for sure. If anything I thought they were trying to hook Zero up with Julius.

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Originally Posted by Iedarus

For me it was Nidhana who sounded off. Maybe the team got new equipment for the VAs?

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A lot of the original dialogue was recorded at home or a limited facility during the pandemic, now they get to use the professional sound recording studios.

one thing i do like that i think they need to start doing more is that the raid storyline being referenced as actually happening more and more in the msq

i think it would be nice if they all tied together. I have a hunch that unanswered questions from the raid line will be answered in the final alliance raid tier

Still working through it but...

The dungeon was amazing, aesthetically it was beautiful. The story thus far feels woefully filler-y to the degree that it's actually demotivating to pay attention to.

[Edit(s)]

- The whole, trials are now integrated into the MSQ for post-expansion has done a lot of detriment to the story telling.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

I had no idea either. It was a strange encounter for sure. If anything I thought they were trying to hook Zero up with Julius.

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Whilst I also got that impression, I also know that they won't go anywhere with that. SE are great at writing implied romantic interests between characters but have demonstrated an unwillingness to allow any of these implied romantic interests to develop beyond that point.

It was better than 6.3, which was the worst patch I've seen.......

Every speaking role zero has is like nails against a chalkboard, she's a boring anime archetype, can't wait for her 6.5 arc where she learns to look both ways before crossing the road.

Also it kind of grates me that the overarching theme of this patch was trust and compromise. Yet when faced with Golbez no attempt was made to discuss or come to an understanding despite the party having the means and the knowledge to improve the 13th using the light aether from the 1st.

The only hope I have is that they shift gears and spend the expansion in the 1st so we can finally get these "newfound adventures" with a new crew that we were promised.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

I haven't read the whole thread, but Thancred meeting Zero was very ..odd. He sort of half flirts with her, she ignores him, and then Urianger says this weird bit about Thancred being able to help Zero because of his experience. It was super stilted and felt really awkward. Not sure what they were going for there.

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It's because thancred has experienced loss so that makes him somehow an expert guru on life. Urianger is more than qualified to speak himself but he's too busy in his role of "wacky funny speaky man"

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Originally Posted by undull1

It was better than 6.3, which was the worst patch I've seen.......

Every speaking role zero has is like nails against a chalkboard, she's a boring anime archetype, can't wait for her 6.5 arc where she learns to look both ways before crossing the road.

Also it kind of grates me that the overarching theme of this patch was trust and compromise. Yet when faced with Golbez no attempt was made to discuss or come to an understanding despite the party having the means and the knowledge to improve the 13th using the light aether from the 1st.

The only hope I have is that they shift gears and spend the expansion in the 1st so we can finally get these "newfound adventures" with a new crew that we were promised.

It's because thancred has experienced loss so that makes him somehow an expert guru on life. Urianger is more than qualified to speak himself but he's too busy in his role of "wacky funny speaky man"

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Im sure they wouldve been able to discuss peace and understanding in the middle of him trying to consume Azdaja while all hell was breaking loose. Im sure that wouldve been a sounder idea .

Also nobody promised anything, you just assumed somehow that the game magically told you those specifics. Dont make the smad mistake I did when the story took a 180 during post-Stormblood expecting we would be dealing with Garlemald only for me to wind up with a pie in the face with the whacky isekai adventures in Shadowbringers. Believe me I know how that feels. Its best to not let the game give you expectations.

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The dungeon was amazing, aesthetically it was beautiful.

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Yellow AOE's

Pure white floor

https://media.tenor.com/qVyaT-G0WkcAAAAC/steam-ears.gif

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Originally Posted by VelKallor

Yellow AOE's

Pure white floor

https://media.tenor.com/qVyaT-G0WkcAAAAC/steam-ears.gif

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Yea… it’s beyond time they let us have custom AOE marker colors.

Or change them on a dungeon basis. We have red AoEs, orange AoEs, blue AoEs, black AoEs, purple AoEs...WE HAVE OTHER COLORS.

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Originally Posted by Hyperia

Yea… it’s beyond time they let us have custom AOE marker colors.

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My word didnt even think about this but yes please!

I think the only other MMO that lets you custom color aoe markers is ESO

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Originally Posted by VelKallor

Yellow AOE's

Pure white floor

https://media.tenor.com/qVyaT-G0WkcAAAAC/steam-ears.gif

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I can concede on this point, yes, but I am not really going to let that cloud my overall judgment. Otherwise, if I were to do so I don't think there has been a single trial or instance in the past 5 years of the game that has met a good accessibility standard [I am not talking about literal ease of difficulty for anyone conflating accessibility with this - More-so just the overall design]

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I can concede on this point, yes, but I am not really going to let that cloud my overall judgment.

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Its fine....just a pet peeve :) The dungeon itself was hella fun.