Wanna Glam it? Play it!

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Originally Posted by Bellsong

I'll always be an advocate for removing most glamour restrictions between race/job/gender. especially in the case of FF.

GW2 kinda showed me that there's really good way to introduce racially locked gear, and FF just doesn't compare in the slightest. The only armor sets that truly stand apart and hit almost the same level of visual nuance that I feel is required to make gear totally locked are the grand company and artifact sets. everything else should be fair game so long as you have the job to that level.

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And even in GW2 there are multiple instances of other races using the race locked gear, so the restrictions are well... Moot.

Save for Charr due to their different body shape.

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Originally Posted by Erinellza

Damn, that sounds totally awesome. :c Maybe one day we'll get something similar.

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Maybe after an engine upgrade where they don't have to deal with sphegetti QuQ

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Originally Posted by Skivvy

I don't quite get what you mean by 'if you die from bad stats, that's your problem". As it is in XIV, the glamour in XI is also just cosmetic. Your actual gear is still fully functional with all it's stats and bonuses.

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Yes, but if everything is equippable then people can equip gear with entirely the wrong stats for their job, regardless of what it looks like.

Even in FFXIV this is a problem below level 50 for tanks, who can equip everything and they system will "recommend" lightweight DPS gear or even mage gear if it's got more VIT than the tank armour they're carrying. And jewellery recommendations for all classes can be messy up to level 60.

The locking down of gear to each job fixes this issue but at the cost of not being able to share the gear for glamour any more either.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

Yes, but if everything is equippable then people can equip gear with entirely the wrong stats for their job, regardless of what it looks like.

Even in FFXIV this is a problem below level 50 for tanks, who can equip everything and they system will "recommend" lightweight DPS gear or even mage gear if it's got more VIT than the tank armour they're carrying. And jewellery recommendations for all classes can be messy up to level 60.

The locking down of gear to each job fixes this issue but at the cost of not being able to share the gear for glamour any more either.

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While the gear system in XI is vastly different than XIV, they still have limitations in place as to what job can equip what gear. You can't equip any gear you like on all jobs, it's just not how it works. So if they were to unlock glamour as they have in XI, it wouldn't impact the actual gear that people are running content with.

For a visual, this is my character in XI (the SS is many years old...be kind. lol):

https://i.imgur.com/Dbm2pNx.png

This is my thief (THF), equipped with THF gear, sporting a WHM glam for the appearance.

To break down the SS a bit more, the items shown in the box are the actual pieces of gear that I have equipped...all of them usable by my job (THF). The items I'm using as my glam are WHM-only pieces, and so I can only use the image of them and not the actual gear itself.

The list of items on the right are some random pieces of gear that I have in storage. I could equip the Pillager's Vest and Dinner Jacket on my thief, but that's it. The greyed-out pieces are non-THF items, and therefore can't be equipped, but I could still use them as a glam if I wanted (as I have their respective jobs leveled to meet that requirement).

It's a bit confusing to explain, but it's really quite simple once you actually see it in motion.

Also, I'm thinking the screenshot may set off some other concerns about being able to use AF gear on any job. I personally really enjoy having that option in XI, but I realize others feel strongly that AF gear should be locked to each job. I imagine that if SE did opt to go the XI route, they could lock the AF gear if that was what they felt was best. I would still take that option in a heartbeat if it meant everything else was allowable.

With glamour being the real endgame in XIV (I jest!..sorta..), having it opened up in this way would give many people a reason to get back into old dungeons and raids in order to farm up glam items that were previously unusable to them.

Didn't see this thread earlier (I hang out more on Reddit than the official forums for any game) but I just wanted to add my support, for what it's worth.

I am tired of staring longingly at a Fitting Room window where my SAM character has this perfect lightweight plate armor outfit on, knowing I can never actually wear it even though there's no logical reason why not.

https://i.imgur.com/60FFxND.jpg

The chest and boots here are Maiming gear, the legs and gloves are Striking gear. As long as I've got DRG leveled to 74 on this character, I should be able to wear this stuff.

I can buy Ward Knight armor from the Mog Station, but I can't glamour the Ishgardian Banneret's set. They're almost identical sets. Why? All pretense of "visual identity" for jobs has gone out the window long ago.

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Originally Posted by Tsiron

The more I've thought about it, I think making it so we can use (almost) any gear on any class *for Glamour purposes* by getting its appropriate class to the requisite level first would be an elegant way to loosen restrictions the way Glamour currently works, and provide incentive for some folks (like me!) to play classes/roles they might not touch otherwise!

Want to use a level 70 Tank chestpiece as a DPS or Healer? Level a Tank to 70 and it's yours! This isn't even going into how the IN-UNIVERSE CANON EXPLANATION for Glamour is it's an illusion cast on top of your actual gear, so what it is super shouldn't matter! That said, Artifact gear should stay class-specific, and basically every one of these threads I've seen everyone has agreed that should be the case. It's all the in-between sets people wish they could use.

Can it be done, in terms of the game's code? We can only speculate, but... look, the way I see it if the devs decide something's worth doing they'll figure it out. And the only way we'll get them to that point is if enough of us voice our support so don't forget to like, comment, and hit that sub button~!

I'd be curious to hear what you all think of this as sort of a solution to the "we can't remove class restrictions it would ruin immersion!" excuse (conveniently ignoring all the bikini tanks, people dressed like Sims™, stupid mascot costumes etc.), since it would require people's characters actually being a class for however long it takes to be able to use, and therefore Glam, whatever gear it is they're after..!

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There are absolutely jobs I'd level so I could use their generic gear (as in non artifact) in glamours even if I never played them in actual content. Although who knows leveling jobs for glams could expose people to new favorites.

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Originally Posted by Tsiron

Can it be done, in terms of the game's code? We can only speculate

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But we can speculate in an informed manner. The limitation on glamour is at time of application, where it checks if your current job is in the list of jobs that can use that gear; the game will let you make a glamour plate with a mishmash of different job gear, it just won't let you apply it. And NPCs, who aren't subject to that restriction, often wear gear from several different jobs to make a distinctive outfit. (Either that, or M'naago is using third party tools to mod her outfit.)

We also know that they can check the level of other inactive jobs at runtime, because the cross-class skill system needed that back in the day to know that a given skill you'd cross-classed could be used. (Yes, it's easy to assume that "of course they could get the level of another job at any point in the code", but that's not actually always a given in any large software project. Sometimes you're in a particular run state -- a worker thread, or some separated-out module -- that doesn't have any handle to an API which can get the data you would want. In this case, though, such access demonstrably exists due to having been used in a previous system.)

Moreover, we know that the cross-class system code hasn't been ripped out, because you can still use it for gatherers. (Which is useful to have both miner and botanist rare node notifications up.)

Given that, while we can't be certain, we can make an informed speculation that it should be possible that instead of checking "is the current job in the set of valid jobs for this gear, and of an appropriate level" when applying a glamour plate, it would run through and check against the level the player has each valid job at from the list of jobs that could wear the gear, and return 'true' if any match. It would make applying a glamour plate a slightly more computationally expensive operation, annoyingly, but one hopes not prohibitively so.

Where that falls apart is artifact gear; I don't think right now it's actually flagged as anything different than any other blue-quality gear, so ironically the "except artifact gear" bit might be the harder part to implement.

Ooh, sounds promising then!

I mostly made the point about AF gear since I figure the devs would want it that way (probably)... though if it worked like XI you will have "earned" it first anyway, so wouldn't it be okay at that point?

Aside from the housing debacle this is my most consistent complaint about the game. I just started a month ago, and I can't tell you how many times while getting my first class to 80 I thought "man, that looks really cool where can I get it for my character" only to have it locked to a job I don't even play. Most of the outfits I've been putting together have been "all classes" gear for this very reason.

Tbh if we make a Fuss with what we want clearly stated I feel like we could get them to change it. Just gotta all agree what we want at minimum first and get ppl to comment

I am not sure what the best way would be to bring this issue to the forefront and get the attention of the devs, but I would enthusiastically support any effort that was made.

I'm glad I'm not the only one clamouring for more freedom when it comes to Glamour! I really hope they'll actually acknowledge this at some point rather than just handwaving it as "immersion breaking" and so on, like they seem to have thus far...

Also (I swear I'm not actually that dead set on AF gear being excluded but) something occurred to me just now... AF gear is marked as able to go into the Armoire where most other equipment isn't, so couldn't whatever bit of code dictates that also ensure it couldn't be used with anything but its intended class?

Could offer many possibilities!

https://s.staticneo.com/mg/2021/08/f...5t_display.gif

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Originally Posted by Tsiron

I'm glad I'm not the only one clamouring for more freedom when it comes to Glamour! I really hope they'll actually acknowledge this at some point rather than just handwaving it as "immersion breaking" and so on, like they seem to have thus far...

Also (I swear I'm not actually that dead set on AF gear being excluded but) something occurred to me just now... AF gear is marked as able to go into the Armoire where most other equipment isn't, so couldn't whatever bit of code dictates that also ensure it couldn't be used with anything but its intended class?

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Wanted to say on the whole "immersion breaking" thing is nonsense due to some npcs wearing whatever they want with no restriction.

I wanted to do a Lyon cosplay character but his whole gear is just a mess

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Originally Posted by Tsiron

I'm glad I'm not the only one clamouring for more freedom when it comes to Glamour! I really hope they'll actually acknowledge this at some point rather than just handwaving it as "immersion breaking" and so on, like they seem to have thus far...

Also (I swear I'm not actually that dead set on AF gear being excluded but) something occurred to me just now... AF gear is marked as able to go into the Armoire where most other equipment isn't, so couldn't whatever bit of code dictates that also ensure it couldn't be used with anything but its intended class?

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I think if we want to get the devs to listen and not dismiss it like Yoshi-P did previously (where he complained about how a DRK would look using a CUL frying pan as a weapon, or something to that effect) we need to pre-empt the arguments about immersion by making it explicitly clear that we don’t want to switch weapon types or wear AF gear on the wrong class.

I think that compromise is more than fair. A lot of the AF gear looks kind of samey anyway. The real draw of unrestricted glamour options would be to mix and match everything else in the game.

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Originally Posted by Theodric_Thorne

Didn't see this thread earlier (I hang out more on Reddit than the official forums for any game) but I just wanted to add my support, for what it's worth.

I am tired of staring longingly at a Fitting Room window where my SAM character has this perfect lightweight plate armor outfit on, knowing I can never actually wear it even though there's no logical reason why not.

https://i.imgur.com/60FFxND.jpg

The chest and boots here are Maiming gear, the legs and gloves are Striking gear. As long as I've got DRG leveled to 74 on this character, I should be able to wear this stuff.

I can buy Ward Knight armor from the Mog Station, but I can't glamour the Ishgardian Banneret's set. They're almost identical sets. Why? All pretense of "visual identity" for jobs has gone out the window long ago.

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You can create this style look on samurai without needing those exact pieces. I saw one in game just last week dressed near identically to that, and the only reason it stuck in my mind was because I was surprised to see the person was a samurai and not a tank. I can't recall exactly which pieces, but I would try starting with the Replica Allagan Cuirass of Striking for the top

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Originally Posted by wereotter

I can't recall exactly which pieces, but I would try starting with the Replica Allagan Cuirass of Striking for the top

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The Allagan cuirass would work well, and there's also the all-classes Legacy armour from Mog Station – cheap in any case and currently (until tomorrow) on sale.

I know you need thigh-length boots to work with that leg piece, since it's shorts under the skirty bit, but I'm sure we've got some kind of armoured boots somewhere.

I've done a fully armoured look with my healer before.

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Originally Posted by wereotter

You can create this style look on samurai without needing those exact pieces. I saw one in game just last week dressed near identically to that, and the only reason it stuck in my mind was because I was surprised to see the person was a samurai and not a tank. I can't recall exactly which pieces, but I would try starting with the Replica Allagan Cuirass of Striking for the top

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You probably saw me. I am already using the Replica Allagan Striking gear in my leg and chest slots, and I can tell you that while they are in the same "weight class" as the Maiming pieces pictured above, they are flatly inferior. The trim on them is more of a brass/bronze color, not gold. There's no neck protection and the boots are inexplicably open-toed with black leather underneath.

EDIT: Here's a comparison of what the Replica Allagan Striking gear in question looks like compared to the two crafted Maiming pieces I'd like to use.

https://i.imgur.com/0Z5kmwY.png

Note how they have a vaguely similar silhouette but are very much not conveying the same look, stylistically.

I feel like the only restrictions on glamour should be:

A. You have to have at least one job capable of equipping the piece you want to glam onto another.
B. No glams between jobs of course, even if this wouldn't be a potential animation nightmare with job weaponskills/abilities.
C. No glaming artifact sets for other jobs. The once per expansion sets that actually are iconic toward specific jobs.

The role based gear, while there are a couple of trends like 'fending has a bit more armor' most of the time etc, don't really have anything to do with the specific roles, and many like the shisui and sky pirate sets really follow more of a general set theme than role themes anyway. Not to mention level 1 glam items.

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Originally Posted by Bright-Flower

I feel like the only restrictions on glamour should be:

A. You have to have at least one job capable of equipping the piece you want to glam onto another.
B. No glams between jobs of course, even if this wouldn't be a potential animation nightmare with job weaponskills/abilities.
C. No glaming artifact sets for other jobs. The once per expansion sets that actually are iconic toward specific jobs.

The role based gear, while there are a couple of trends like 'fending has a bit more armor' most of the time etc, don't really have anything to do with the specific roles, and many like the shisui and sky pirate sets really follow more of a general set theme than role themes anyway. Not to mention level 1 glam items.

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This could just be because I've had a long day, but I'm struggling to understand B. Can you elaborate on this one? X:

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Originally Posted by Skivvy

This could just be because I've had a long day, but I'm struggling to understand B. Can you elaborate on this one? X:

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Not the person you replied to, but I'm guessing they meant to put "no weapon glams between jobs" because otherwise yeah, it makes no sense to me either.

This would be nice, not to mention encourage playing your off classes.

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Originally Posted by Skivvy

This could just be because I've had a long day, but I'm struggling to understand B. Can you elaborate on this one? X:

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1. Self Explanatory.
2. Referring to weapons and is a defense against Yoshi-P's common dismissal of the ideas proposed in this thread. "Axe on a white mage" bullshit he goes on about whenever this gets brought up.
3. No putting job-specific gear on other jobs.

I'd heard conflicting opinions in regards to whether the FFXI system was intentional or not, so this post over in the Glamour Request thread was nice to see. Good to have confirmation that, yes, it was intentional!

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Originally Posted by 11Furyspawn_14Sigrid

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/t...l=1#post545505

Patch notes for FFXI from March 26, 2015, listing the revamp of /lockstyle and the addition of the /lockstyleset command, allowing players to glamour any piece of gear as long as they can equip it on at least one job.



This was not an exploit but an intended feature introduced by the devs. The only thing that doesn't make this "free-form" is the requirement that the player has to be at least able to equip any piece of gear on one job.

It's also worth noting that the final expansion, Rhapsodies of Vana'diel, had not released at this point and that it would've been very difficult for FFXI's dev staff to have been reduced to a bare minimum at that point.

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Originally Posted by Tsiron

The more I've thought about it, I think making it so we can use (almost) any gear on any class *for Glamour purposes* by getting its appropriate class to the requisite level first would be an elegant way to loosen restrictions the way Glamour currently works, and provide incentive for some folks (like me!) to play classes/roles they might not touch otherwise!

Want to use a level 70 Tank chestpiece as a DPS or Healer? Level a Tank to 70 and it's yours! This isn't even going into how the IN-UNIVERSE CANON EXPLANATION for Glamour is it's an illusion cast on top of your actual gear, so what it is super shouldn't matter! That said, Artifact gear should stay class-specific, and basically every one of these threads I've seen everyone has agreed that should be the case. It's all the in-between sets people wish they could use.

Can it be done, in terms of the game's code? We can only speculate, but... look, the way I see it if the devs decide something's worth doing they'll figure it out. And the only way we'll get them to that point is if enough of us voice our support so don't forget to like, comment, and hit that sub button~!

I'd be curious to hear what you all think of this as sort of a solution to the "we can't remove class restrictions it would ruin immersion!" excuse (conveniently ignoring all the bikini tanks, people dressed like Sims™, stupid mascot costumes etc.), since it would require people's characters actually being a class for however long it takes to be able to use, and therefore Glam, whatever gear it is they're after..!

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This is sooo long overdue.

I'm replying without reading all the responses, but I can figure that the naysayers will probably bring the tired argument of "it's important to recognize the role by what they wear" or somehting like that... Which of course, it is an argument that might hold value in any other title, but not in XIV, here's why:

1) Biggest reason, I think, it is because the whole armor silhouette is very diluted within the art direction of the stuff that is made. We have countless examples where "heavy" (Fending/Maiming) items won't look like heavy armor at all, and the opposite for "mage" items too. Looking for example at the 1st tier of YoHRa items... if I would show the armor sets to someone that is a XIV player but is returning to the game and is new to that raid, I highly doubt they would be able to tell which set belongs to which armor group.

2) The Glamour system already lets us bypass the whole armor = role idea with a lot of examples. There are "All Classes" items for every style of wear. It's already possible to be a tank wearing wizard robes or a White Mage that could wear something suited for a Ninja. And these are not just a handful of exceptions, these are on the hundreds.

3) For practical reasons, I can't see anywhere that what a character is wearing could impact someone's actual gameplay. Pvp cannot be because for starters is already pretty hard to pay attention to whatever people are wearing amidst of the chaos of combat and SFX, and there is literally the tag with the job's name right on the nameplate.

4) It would be great addition for player creativity regarding mix and matching. It's frustrating how, for example, sometimes as a tank you have that exact SAME pants model but with a more interesting dye pattern in the Maiming group but you can't add to your set. Or as a Dancer, feels really bad because most of the aiming items (even the post ShB ones) cater towards either MCH or BRDs while we literally have items in the Scouting group that would fit like a glove.

Even in universe characters mix sets. Yda and Papalymo arent tanks but have tank gear, Moenbryda isnt ranged but has ranged gear, but i cant glamour a different colour shisui set because.....?

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Originally Posted by Lihtleita

Even in universe characters mix sets. Yda and Papalymo arent tanks but have tank gear, Moenbryda isnt ranged but has ranged gear, but i cant glamour a different colour shisui set because.....?

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The Ala Mhigan resistance use healer pvp helmet...

The other big reason I want unrestricted armor glamour is because it wouldn't just encourage me to level other jobs to access their gear appearances. It would encourage me to play every combat job in the game, because I'd be able to wear the same set of armor on all of them. I could keep my perfect blend of Striking/Maiming gear on every single job. No more worrying about how to create glams for Casting, Healing, Aiming or Scouting jobs that still fit my character's aesthetic, I'd just be on the lookout for matching weapons.

Even if they didn't implement this they should still implement a way to let us have two separate mogs on different Jobs.
It's really annoying how if I play MNK and SAM and switch between the two and I have MNK artifact pieces for example it ruins my mog on SAM.

I really want to glam DoH/DoL sets to my DoW/DoM jobs.

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

Even if they didn't implement this they should still implement a way to let us have two separate mogs on different Jobs.
It's really annoying how if I play MNK and SAM and switch between the two and I have MNK artifact pieces for example it ruins my mog on SAM.

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You can assign a specific glam plate to apply when you switch jobs. Click on the "Gear Set List" from the character menu, then right click the job you want to use, and click "Link to Glamour Plate". This will work for jobs that share the same gear. Just be prepared for glams to break when you switch jobs outside of towns....which many of us do. :/

Shameless bump, along with a tangent:
I think they should remove level and class restriction from the Wolf Mark gear altogether! The Feast rewards (which look really nice...) have all been All Classes, despite being quite heavily armoured more often than not!

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Originally Posted by Tsiron

The more I've thought about it, I think making it so we can use (almost) any gear on any class *for Glamour purposes* by getting its appropriate class to the requisite level first would be an elegant way to loosen restrictions the way Glamour currently works, and provide incentive for some folks (like me!) to play classes/roles they might not touch otherwise!

Want to use a level 70 Tank chestpiece as a DPS or Healer? Level a Tank to 70 and it's yours! This isn't even going into how the IN-UNIVERSE CANON EXPLANATION for Glamour is it's an illusion cast on top of your actual gear, so what it is super shouldn't matter! That said, Artifact gear should stay class-specific, and basically every one of these threads I've seen everyone has agreed that should be the case. It's all the in-between sets people wish they could use.

Can it be done, in terms of the game's code? We can only speculate, but... look, the way I see it if the devs decide something's worth doing they'll figure it out. And the only way we'll get them to that point is if enough of us voice our support so don't forget to like, comment, and hit that sub button~!

I'd be curious to hear what you all think of this as sort of a solution to the "we can't remove class restrictions it would ruin immersion!" excuse (conveniently ignoring all the bikini tanks, people dressed like Sims™, stupid mascot costumes etc.), since it would require people's characters actually being a class for however long it takes to be able to use, and therefore Glam, whatever gear it is they're after..!

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Their excuse for not allowing this has always rang hollow considering you regularly see tanks in bikinis and casters in heavy armor.

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Originally Posted by Tsiron

Shameless bump, along with a tangent:
I think they should remove level and class restriction from the Wolf Mark gear altogether! The Feast rewards (which look really nice...) have all been All Classes, despite being quite heavily armoured more often than not!

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I'd support this just for the ability to wear my Althyk's Cuisses of Striking on every job. It's a really cool leg-cape piece with pants underneath, unlike many of the skirt armors that have you randomly flashing the camera if your character is knocked over, flung through the air, or sits on the floor in a cutscene. It also dyes fairly well and has some nice metallic gold detailing. It'd be nice to have because so many leg-capes in the game are tied to your choice of upper body armor, so if you really like the look of a particular chestpiece but are frustrated that it doesn't have a leg-cape, you can solve that problem without leaving your character's legs uncovered.

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Originally Posted by Yeol

I really want to glam DoH/DoL sets to my DoW/DoM jobs.

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So many nice looking outfits completely restricted to city wear because reasons...

We have the tags DoW/DoM, why can't they be used on these outfits, along with the profession tag so we can glamour it?

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

I still want that Copied Factory caster dress for dancer.

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legit that caster dress should be endgame for everyone, its the best set of the raid

Honestly I could see all the Nier sets eventually going the way of the Replica Sky Pirate/Rat stuff considering... they're literally just clothes (which was an argument people brought up to explain why those, but not others, could be worn by All Classes).

smh @ no one in the replies asking for fewer Glamour restrictions

I want both the ability to wear any gear (short of artifact) for any class I've leveled enough AND the transmog system for WoW.

I swear if I could just keep a collection of appearances without holding on to gear I would spend ridiculous amounts of time leveling alt jobs and farming old content.

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Originally Posted by Tsiron

Honestly I could see all the Nier sets eventually going the way of the Replica Sky Pirate/Rat stuff considering... they're literally just clothes (which was an argument people brought up to explain why those, but not others, could be worn by All Classes).

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The nier sets are a good example of that but there are tons of sets like that. The shisui sets, sky rat/pirate ( I think those already got replicas?), the Zandor sets, etc. Heck there are a LOT of sets in the game in general where they individual models don't really feel specific to a role outside of say, the tank one maybe having a bit more armor than some of the others.