Has anyone been banned for using Perform yet?

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

For me, third party doesn't mean "not FFXIV" but "not Square Enix". So, I think any Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Kingdom Hearts, etc...songs would be fair game.

But it would be nice to have an official confirmation on that

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I already posted the Live Letter that stated FFXIV only. Read the section titled system updates. It is very clearly stated what is acceptable and what is not.

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Originally Posted by Alleo

What if someone is just playing it for themselves but another person records it? Or if someone reports another gamer for playing certain songs? As far as I understood it you are not allowed to play them at all, so its a reportable issue..

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As far as I know video material which shows someone doing something against the rules won't be used by the GM's as an evidence, since you can alter said videos quiete easily - especially when it comes to music/sounds.

http://support.na.square-enix.com/ru...la=1&tag=authc

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In relation to any functions within the game which allow you to perform virtual musical instruments (“performance actions”), you are strictly prohibited from performing the music of any third parties. You hereby warrant that your performance using the performance actions will not infringe the rights of any third parties and you shall indemnify us in respect of any breach of such warranty. You may record and share your performance of the FINAL FANTASY XIV original score excluding the songs entitled “Answers”, “Dragonsong” and “Revolutions” or original songs and/or melodiesusing the performance actions in accordance with this Agreement. Furthermore, by using the performance actions, you acknowledge and consent to any third party recording and sharing of your performance online. You also hereby agree that we may block or otherwise restrict your access to FFXIV if you do not comply with the terms of the licence contained herein.

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YouTube has a track record of not verifying who's filing claims, so I'm not ready to believe that Square is taking down any of these videos. The usage license explicitly states "no third parties". The user is a first party, and SE is a first party. This would mean they're allowing the usage of any of their music with the perform feature. I consider the actual license (November) to be more accurate than Bayohne's translation (September). It's not like we're forming an agreement with a product or service. We formed this agreement with Square Enix themselves.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

From what I understand and have read, SE has already filed copyright complaints against some uploaded videos of other Final Fantasy franschise songs, and had them blocked and/or removed. So, I think that says they don’t sanction playing any other Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, or Kingdom Hearts songs.

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So wait, SE is going to sue themselves? Guess that's one way for the Music Department to get more budget funds.

Bottom line I guess is you can't record or upload any music created with "perform".

The feature is neat and has a lot of potential but it's hampered by SE's over-zealous legal restrictions on it. They're more interested in covering their asses than allowing player expression. What's even sadder is that they're justified in taking that stance, considering how lawsuit-happy media rights owners can be. Those entities frequently take scorched-earth approaches to their claims, catching up everyone they think they can nail for damages. Even if SE was found to be not liable in court they'd spend thousands of dollars to get that verdict. And it would be appealed at every level, bleeding millions unless they just threw in the towel and agreed to settle with no admission of wrong-doing.

It's a problem part of a larger issue surrounding copyright ownership and enforcement. SE seems to take the same dim view of acceptable fair-use cases that other media rights owners do. And we're the ones who suffer most for it.

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Originally Posted by Hestzhyen

And we're the ones who suffer most for it.

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haha suffering? Just don't post online, why is that ruining the whole thing?
You can still play whatever you like IN GAME.
Is it only good if you can upload it to the internet so you can get moar thumbs up?

I like using it in game to play for myself. I play guitar IRL, I just play for me not to upload to Utube.

Just have fun.
I know this is a hard concept but, You don't need to post everything you do.

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Originally Posted by KingMeteo

Just have fun.
I know this is a hard concept but, You don't need to post everything you do.

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What works for you is fine, but the majority of people who perform and play want to be heard. For them it's essential that they share the cool things they're able to do to their friends and the world at large. It's a form of self-expression that's been around for far, far longer than we've even had civilization as we know it.

For what it's worth I don't upload or share things myself. But I like seeing what other people do and how creative they can be. SE's in the right here, but it still sucks for us.

SE's stance does seem odd. If it was applied elsewhere you'd see all the musical instrument manufacturers sued out of business simply because people played an unoriginal piece using their equipment they supplied. I dare say the music teachers would all be in jail too for teaching people to play another persons copyrighted work.

Makes me wonder what a bleak place the land of the rising sun must be. I suppose it's no wonder I hear about them facing a population crash in the future.

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Originally Posted by Freyt

http://support.na.square-enix.com/ru...la=1&tag=authc

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Go back to my image in page 3. You have

A) Yoshida's explicitly mentioning XIV only.

B) Your quote already says, and I bold: " You may record and share your performance of the FINAL FANTASY XIV original score excluding the songs entitled “Answers”, “Dragonsong” and “Revolutions” or original songs and/or melodiesusing the performance actions in accordance with this Agreement."

C) Screenshots of takedowns issued by Square Enix Co.,Ltd.

And you still want to believe there's some sort of misunderstanding?

There's none, that's their stance, they don't want you uploading anything that is not FFXIV.

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Originally Posted by Hestzhyen

What works for you is fine, but the majority of people who perform and play want to be heard. For them it's essential that they share the cool things they're able to do to their friends and the world at large. It's a form of self-expression that's been around for far, far longer than we've even had civilization as we know it.

For what it's worth I don't upload or share things myself. But I like seeing what other people do and how creative they can be. SE's in the right here, but it still sucks for us.

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Majority, huh? You, uh...you have the evidence for that claim, dear Miqo'te?

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Originally Posted by alimdia

Go back to my image in page 3. You have

A) Yoshida's explicitly mentioning XIV only.

B) Your quote already says, and I bold: " You may record and share your performance of the FINAL FANTASY XIV original score excluding the songs entitled “Answers”, “Dragonsong” and “Revolutions” or original songs and/or melodiesusing the performance actions in accordance with this Agreement."

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Gotta admit when I've missed something. Doesn't happen often, but the truth is the truth. I DO believe there is a misunderstanding, but what you pointed to in the agreement does limit that possibility. I haven't seen/heard Yoshida saying that. Maybe he did, but unless he said "not any other Final Fantasy titles" or something like that, I don't think I would be convinced. The agreement states both "you may not"s and "you may"s, and other Final Fantasy or Square Enix titles aren't listed in either, but it again is implied when the "may not" describes third parties, of which Square is not a third party.

I'm sure you believe whole heartedly that you're right, and I don't yet believe that I am/was wrong, but if it's any consolation I'm not as confident as I was before.

Copyright laws are based on individual countries so for example a copyright for Japan is only enforceable in Japan and a copyright in the US is only enforceable in the US. In the US the "Fair use" sections of copyright law will frequently result in the legal use of copyrighted material without the owners permission and against their desire. What really appears to be going on in this case is the licensing agreement which comes under contract law. The Material Usage License is what governs the how an entity may use SE copyrighted material when it is for other than those that come under the "Fair use" provisions of copyright law. I think SE is somewhat skirting the legal process usually used to decide these types of matters (i.e. the court system) by claiming copyright infringement to YouTube even when it is clear there is no infringement nor violation of the license. I also feel their ability to get away with it is due somewhat to the DCMA making hosting companies reluctant to fight back and making it hard for individuals to push back as well. The only way I see for the users having their videos removed to handle this is to appeal to YouTube and request the specific information as to what SE is claiming to be infringed and where that is stated in the license agreement. With that a person should be able to prove that SE is wrong or modify their video to conform.