I am tired of being the hero (aka the chosen one)

I can see what you mean, for me I'd be a casual farming person. Or just working in a shop - until something happens and I have to learn fast in order to adapt to the new harsh world thats just fallen upon us.
Not because I was born that way, but because I had to. That feels exciting.

Adventurers who dont want to be heroes, but through a series of events out of their control garner more and more fame and are called upon to defend their realm from greater and greater evils...

Sounds familiar ;)

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Originally Posted by Kragon

I just want to be a simple adventurer. Is that so hard to do that in mmorpgs nowadays? Why does game developers always need to stroke our egos by making us 'the chosen one' in every online rpg games. Back in the old days... during the era of Everquest, Dark age of camelot and Ultima online nobody was the chosen one. In those games each and every players were simple adventurers trying to survive in a harse and hostile world. Oh how I miss the good old days of gaming.

Sadly those golden days of gaming are never coming back. Every single mmorpg I play nowadays the game makes me the chosen one. And another worst thing is that thousands of other players around me are also the chosen ones.:mad:

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speak for urself I wish my charcter was even more important than they where and was callin the shoots with the scions and not just noding their head agreeing to everything someone ask them

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Originally Posted by KokonoeAiyoko

Play FFXI. They legit don't give a sheep about you in that game's storyline.

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lol, came here for this. I found it slightly amusing that each time you start a new expansion's MSQ, the NPCs had no idea who you were. Granted that may have been more due to each MSQ being fairly independent of the others as they could be done in any order.

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Originally Posted by Kragon

Its not just in FFXIV. Every other mmorpg I have played recently in the past 3-4 years the game always makes us players the chosen ones... like we are some kind of demigod or something.

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I can understand the want to not always be the big hero but this is probably not so easy in an ongoing story like an MMO. In an MMO a big part of it, is to progress your character. You do that by getting to higher levels, getting more skills and better armor. Also there is a certain pull to go through some big epic story and slay strong enemies. I mean I do believe that FF14 overdid it a bit by having us slay Thordan and his knights in only the second expansion thus one kinda question what will happen down the line. But how would you write the story? Would you be fine with lots more stories like those in the fetch quests? Why would we slay all those enemies if we are nothing more than common adventurers? How would we get to certain places if nobody is truly knowing us thus giving us their permission to do so?

In the end would a story be truly good if we always just stayed the same old adventurer? I mean we kinda were a nobody at the beginning of ARR so we did the same as vanilla WoW. But there is a point where we naturally kinda have to be more known in the world, because if we dont than that means that we are probably doing just unimportant small stuff that barely anyone remembers. That does not sound exiting to play through.

I am a little sick of it too, to the point that I would do anything get rid of the WoL moniker. It never really sat well with me. and It really does feel like too much rides on the fact that we exist and never fail.

It makes any opposition to us, even the summoned gods, seem trivial nowadays. The Empire hasn't had proper teeth and competence from its grunts since 1.0. The "WoDs" were done away with over a weekend. And If anything, being a god literally just means you are lasting 10 minutes before dying at our hands.

Who will save the world from us, I wonder?

Because gamers today are special snowflakes, so game developers have to make them feel like special snowflakes. Even though they are really just purple penguins.

Here's the thing though. You start as a regular adventurer. You don't get rewarded as special until later in the base game, and even then it takes a lot of work. If you weren't recognized as a hero after that, then there would have been something wrong with the story lol, it wouldn't make sense.

I'm pretty sure you are the hero in every FF game anyway, not sure why people are surprised at this.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

Who will save the world from us, I wonder?

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I get the feeling they honestly tried to touch upon that but have lost that direction somewhere along the way. Thordan basically calls you out as an impossible existence, and they constantly mention how we basically suck the life out of the Mothercrystal even when she doesn't actively invest power in shielding us from things like the Ultima weapon. I wish they'd go back to that, but there's little room for such things unless someone stops to realize it makes absolutely zero sense you beat Shinryu the way you did. I just hope they won't lock it behind side-quests.

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Originally Posted by Pancakes

It would be an interesting turn of events if we follow the path of the First. It seems to me like that's where we are going.

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I doubt it. The Ascians are a constant, actual threat. We constantly get visitors from the Void, a world which is the First's equivalent on the spectrum. We're incredible and we're amazing, yes, but it's not like we're running out of threats to balance us out any time soon.

It's been said already, but the only way you can be "just" an adventurer is to literally avoid doing anything noteworthy, but that wouldn't make for a very exciting game at all. At least not from the player's perspective.

I think back to White Knight Chronicles, where your created character was largely just there, the main character's coworker that he started out with. You were literally just that guy/girl there, "Party Member A" until perhaps the very end of the second game. (Reason for this was your character was more for the online component, but you were at least given some acknowledgement of existing in the main story.) Still, from a critical standpoint, you literally had no reason or influence to anything happening at the time. That would've been a boring story if you were the main character.

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Originally Posted by Kragon

I just want to be a simple adventurer. Is that so hard to do that in mmorpgs nowadays? Why does game developers always need to stroke our egos by making us 'the chosen one' in every online rpg games. Back in the old days... during the era of Everquest, Dark age of camelot and Ultima online nobody was the chosen one. In those games each and every players were simple adventurers trying to survive in a harse and hostile world. Oh how I miss the good old days of gaming.

Sadly those golden days of gaming are never coming back. Every single mmorpg I play nowadays the game makes me the chosen one. And another worst thing is that thousands of other players around me are also the chosen ones.:mad:

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WoW did it. Noone likes it and it makes no sense beyond the beginning or so of an adventure. Over time the stakes have to get raised, and once you've slain a god, you're hardly 'just an adventurer' anymore.

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Originally Posted by Pancakes

I feel super awkward in this game ever since the beginning of ARR. They treat you like a celebrity. No wait. With the Echo, protection from Hydaelyn, never failing and constant recognition, I honestly feel like a small God. It's just too much.

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We didn't save Edda. We couldn't save Edda.
Midgardsormr took Hydaelyn's blessing from us (or perhaps sealed it for a time).
We were helpless when Teledji tried his little assassination plot and pinned it on us.
Haurchefant.
We didn't stop Illberd. Hell, we helped him set things in motion.
Zenos stomped us out twice. We were saved once (and almost lost another friend in the process), and he spared us the second time, out of simply enjoying fighting us.

We ARE powerful, but we're far from perfect or unstoppable.

MMO(RPG) thats why

One of my favorite quips though in the story was when Yda made you go fetch something and Rowena just bluntly says something along the lines of "the Scions can't make better use of your time?"

But consider this: WoL gets so much recognition and praise from people that they themselves essentially become a Primal, and the rest of the cast has to put them down in the end! But of course, let's not get too edgy here lol

Revelations from Coil and Ysayle show that that's entirely possible. But we have yet to develop a fanatical following, nor are we trying to build up to it. If anything, we're just the one who steps forward when something needs to be done. We're regarded as the WoL (if only for a means of being named/referred to for the sake of story), but we're not Eorzea's hero they know and rely upon. Most primal incidents have been quelled before they became a well known threat that could cause panic, thus we remain fairly unknown except to those we help.

Theres been a bit of a shift away from 'adventures' to 'heros' over the years in the genre. But I don't think that matters much for FF. The chosen crystal warriors has literally been FF's thing since FF1. You are the warrior(s) of light. The god crystal chose you to beat back the darkness. This is really a return to FFs roots in the franchise more than anything else.

Other games that did not have these roots have, unfortunately, jumped on the 'hero' bandwagon. Hell in Diablo 1/2 you were just adventurers that stumbled upon Tristram. Diablo 3 you are these godlike nephalem. Though to be fair it is entirely explained in the lore why that's so after the worldstone's destruction that had been limiting human powers. But still. It changes the feel when everyone is calling you the Nephalem. The story in 1/2 focused on the world around you and the path of the 'wanderer' whom you were tracking. The 3rd one plays out like an MCU film saving the world.

I blame the MCU. Everyone has to be a damn superhero now.

TLDR: Yes there is a trend of making players 'chosen superheros' lately, but FF series has been doing this since FF1's chosen crystal warriors. Its not out of character for this franchise in the slightest. This is just keeping to their roots.

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Originally Posted by ThirdChild_ZKI

But we have yet to develop a fanatical following, nor are we trying to build up to it.

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Haven't we, though? Between the Scions, a LOT of Grand Company people we run into, unrelated people in all three City States, Ishgard, now in Ala Mhigo and Doma as well, we already have that sort of fanatical following. And that's the people who know we're the WoL, not even the people we've simply came in contact with and helped whose numbers are much greater. My favorite example is Alphinaud who went from viewing you as nothing more than a tool, a weapon, to being your greatest admirer. Was there tempering involved? Arguably not, and the way our relationship with him evolves adds up with the story only too well. But you don't have to be tempered to feed your Primal's existence. And if we do want to go there, we're so powerful, who's to say we didn't temper them unknowingly somewhere along the way?

I shared my theory on the "WoL Concept" between you and Alphinaud once. Basically he's the diplomat/mind of the WoL, you're the fighter/hero. Where he speaks and influences, you act and get things done.

That aside, we're celebrated for doing good deeds, and we've made many friends and companions as a result, but no one is gathering crystals to summon us, no one prays to us, most people STILL treat us like the average gopher adventurer. That'd be the biggest difference there. Outside of the circle of people that know us, we have absolutely no influence of our own. We're only invited to big heads of state meetings generally to be made aware of the situation, or out of arbitrary Scion presence. As it stands, we are an average adventurer. . . we just have the Echo, and one really big success record, some of which isn't even allowed to be public knowledge.

I don't know which MMOs the OP are talking about, because the ones I can think of, WoW in particular, never talk about you as you being anything special. This only started happening I think from Draenor onwards. Who in there doesn't remember seeing us doing all the work just so Green Jesus could destroy Deathwing?

OP rather than the direct opposite of being unrecognized all the time, would you be interested if our actions started resulting in negative repercussions? Or are you interested in a new protagonist climbing their way up, perhaps without being destined to the task by Hydaelyn?

Is it the character, or the actions, that make it untenable for you?

You do realize that this is a GAME right? It's not real life and if you don't want to be the hero simply don't play. Problem solved.

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Originally Posted by Zarabeth

You do realize that this is a GAME right? It's not real life and if you don't want to be the hero simply don't play. Problem solved.

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Well that's silly. Give up an entire game, where they (most likely) are enjoying themselves - all because they don't like being the hero in the MSQ. Another option would be that they could express their dislike in the general section of the forums to generate some conversation. Feedback is important for all businesses and products. Doesn't hurt to voice an opinion now and then.

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Originally Posted by Skivvy

Well that's silly. Give up an entire game, where they (most likely) are enjoying themselves - all because they don't like being the hero in the MSQ. Another option would be that they could express their dislike in the general section of the forums to generate some conversation. Feedback is important for all businesses and products. Doesn't hurt to voice an opinion now and then.

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Also, as much as the msq feel important, a player usually spends, what, a week or two at most doing it?

I'm ok being a Hero.
I just think they should put other NPCs in better use, because the importants one are not SOOO
far from your fight skill.

A good example is that, even they dont say nothing, its easy to understand that the only reason
why Raubanh cant slay a primal is because he dont have echo to protect him from mind control.

We are Warrior of Light but we are not SUPER strong, its not like "Goku >> Everyone" on first Frieza phase.
Anyone with a really good fight skill can put us down (hi Zenos!)

So it would be really possible and interesting to make better use of other NPCs in big fights on future (lore wise),
and start to give credits not only for us, but for other npcs too.

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Originally Posted by Kragon

I just want to be a simple adventurer. Is that so hard to do that in mmorpgs nowadays? Why does game developers always need to stroke our egos by making us 'the chosen one' in every online rpg games. Back in the old days... during the era of Everquest, Dark age of camelot and Ultima online nobody was the chosen one. In those games each and every players were simple adventurers trying to survive in a harse and hostile world. Oh how I miss the good old days of gaming.

Sadly those golden days of gaming are never coming back. Every single mmorpg I play nowadays the game makes me the chosen one. And another worst thing is that thousands of other players around me are also the chosen ones.:mad:

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I have to say, i do not understand this at all. Should you want to just be a simple adventurer just grind fates all day and skip MSQ cut scenes.

It may sound crass but i have become a bit fed up with people playing this game, paying to play this game, and complaining they... don't want to play this game... You do realize this is the equivalent of walking into a steakhouse and being dissapointed with the salad/ vegan selections, right?

The FF series as a whole has ever been about individuals who undertake world spanning quest to fight world ending evils, fighting all manner of gods, demons, dragons, time anomalies, Demon Dragon Time Gods, ect... What did you expect when you bought the game? Why did you buy a fantasy mmo if not to be a fantasy hero? Did you research, (at all) what it was you were purchasing? What exactly do you feel is a proper quest for an average, not the chosen one adventurer? I just don't get how this can happen. You can't complain about all the dungeons and dragons if your playing Dungeons and Dragons... well you can... however if that is your complaint you may have other issues that need to be addressed.

As for those that want to play as Garleans and Ascians... they are not the same thing... One is a nation comprised of many (not all) individuals that can't use magic... giving them the ability to use magic would make them like everyone else... so what would be the point? Ascians are the basically the pawns of a dark god... They zealously attempt to interpret it's design and fail often... What is the point then? Is the draw some kinda darkness edge lord thing where evil is cooler?

The WoL only earned the title cause they were a simply adventurer and managed to beat up enemies, many, MANY people got the crystals power, its nothing special. Here and there are some with special subpowers but overall:
You ARE just an adventurer but due the great things you have done, you became a hero, the Warrior of Light. That is unavoidable.

Also, what do we acually do? Beat up everyones ass who gets in our way! We dont do the talks XD

FFXI and WoW (sometimes) would do that. Your character is a huge part, if not the sole reason, for why victory was achieved, but the focus was on another character or story element. Glory was never truly recognized except by a select few important NPCs, if even that. You're simply part of an army, albeit a recognized force within that army. In XI's case, that was practically every story arc lol. I liked it, but I can see the appeal of all around glory... no matter how silly it gets in this game.

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Originally Posted by uvuvwevwevweonyetenyevweugwemu

I'm confused. Why are you the chosen one? Minfillia was the one taken by Hydaelin. Eorzea have been killing primals before we exists. With or without WoL, the story is the same. I don't think gratitude stroke my ego but I appreciate the common courtesy in the story, for little things like carrying a heavy sack. There are more times when people don't recognize who we are. The echo and aether bound to us is a story tool, not a merit badge. It's nothing special really, or as special as the weapon we use.

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Interesting take, and similar to my own. I often refer to WoL as the "Weapon of Light". I'm only up to 3.1 right now, but the impression I get thus far we are seen as a weapon that's deployed when something or someone really nasty needs to be taken down. It takes a while to get to this point though. It's easy to forget that we come into the game as a washed up nobody with strange visions of an unknown origin. But yeah, I find it difficult to refer to myself as the chosen one when Hyaedelyn has chosen several.

Minfillia seemed to be a messenger for the mother crystal, and Ysayle served well as a soldier; we however, are the power that is welded. It can give an impression that we are more of a tool, or an Achilles of some sort.

I've played 1 game that didn't pigonhole me into the "Uber-hero" slot & that was an old PS3 game White Knight Chronicles 1/2. I mean in that U start as just the newbiee at a wine delivery company who got asigned to help the MC dubble check on some imporant delivery (wine for the royal palace ball... which got ransacked by an army of fanatics shorty after u make said delivery) after that u avi is sidelined to Chronicler & only become important in the last fight of game 2 cause u got an "replication" of the 5 MC's cast ppl's power & in that fight their power was taken (thus u win & end the game)

granted that was a Solo-RPG with a Muntiplayer hub server system for side/after endgame stuff but it felt funny being the ignored side toon (which was usually better geared then the whole main cast combined cause well... its ur avi why not right?)

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Originally Posted by Gemina

Minfillia seemed to be a messenger for the mother crystal, and Ysayle served well as a soldier; we however, are the power that is welded. It can give an impression that we are more of a tool, or an Achilles of some sort.

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And that's a point the game itself acknowledges, to boot. Midgardsormr himself questions your actions, whether or not you act of your own free will or just tag along with what other people want, for example.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

And that's a point the game itself acknowledges, to boot. Midgardsormr himself questions your actions, whether or not you act of your own free will or just tag along with what other people want, for example.

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Ilberd also questions this too, or at least warns you against doing it.

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Originally Posted by The_NPC

I've played 1 game that didn't pigonhole me into the "Uber-hero" slot & that was an old PS3 game White Knight Chronicles 1/2. I mean in that U start as just the newbiee at a wine delivery company who got asigned to help the MC dubble check on some imporant delivery (wine for the royal palace ball... which got ransacked by an army of fanatics shorty after u make said delivery) after that u avi is sidelined to Chronicler & only become important in the last fight of game 2 cause u got an "replication" of the 5 MC's cast ppl's power & in that fight their power was taken (thus u win & end the game)

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try Final Fantasy 12 - at one point Vaan actually was asked what he was even doing in the party >.>

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Originally Posted by Tint

try Final Fantasy 12 - at one point Vaan actually was asked what he was even doing in the party >.>

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And I asked that question again when he showed up in Dissidia 012.

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Originally Posted by Tint

try Final Fantasy 12 - at one point Vaan actually was asked what he was even doing in the party >.>

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I've played several, they at the least didn't feel like I had already won against my antagonists by virtue of what the main character is.

Dragon Age 2 (Hawke is more or less an adventurer)
Grand Kingdom(you are the commander, not the fighters.)
God Eater 1(2 walks the line with the blood power thing, but it's clear even if you solo aragami well enough, you are the captain of a team and not the only one who can.)
Freedom Wars (let's contribute! You are a part of the ever watching panopticon as a "sinner")
Starbound (you are a graduate, the matter manipulator being not rare until the protectorate fell, with pieces of them all over the place.)
Minecraft

DFO seemed to not go that route, but haven't played through all the story.

To be fair, you start the game as a simple adventurer who happens to have the echo. WoL is more or less an earned title that the player grows into, not a default designation. We are technically one of Hydaelyns chosen, but so is Arenvald, Krile, Minfillia, and others. There are many people with the echo but they aren't referred to as The WoL. It would be weird if we went around destroying giant, powerful primals like Ifrit and Bahamut for years, yet didn't gain any world renown for it.

Ordinary adventurers don't defeat the likes of Ifrit, Shiva, Ultima Weapon, Shinryu, etc. They'd have to really tone down the scope of boss fights and encounters in the MSQ for the simple adventurer route to be immersive. An average adventurer shouldn't be killing legendary Final Fantasy creatures and if he/she did, how would they still be an average adventurer after those accomplishments?

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Originally Posted by Levy9

if he/she did, how would they still be an average adventurer after those accomplishments?

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That's a fair question to the devs, "How can WoL retire". I'm thinking along dynamics between Nero and Cid. Both of them have similar talents and origin, but with different view of how to use their talents. Nero lost his standing yet he still use his talent (whatever his personal goals are). I don't think we've reached there yet though. As the other pointed out, we've only beginning to have impact on lives of the story. From freeing nation to Scions/Nanamo asking our advice. Before HW/SB, we pretty much just reacting to threats than changing lives as a real hero.

I always prefer the beginning of any RPG to the end. I would much rather be the unknown simple adventure struggling to survive than be the OP God that kills everything with 1 hit. Infact I usually get bored with RPGs before I finish because of that.

I feel like this game doesn't make me great enough. I want to see my character in the plot DO something. Yeah yeah I'm the WOL big deal... when all I do is stand around and let other have the cool fights in the cutscenes it's hard to believe I'm this OP force really. Honestly other then the game telling me I'm op. I wouldn't know I'm OP cause in cutscenes it seems like the animatiors forgot how to animate my character and gave all the work to any and all NPCs :c.

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Originally Posted by Tint

try Final Fantasy 12 - at one point Vaan actually was asked what he was even doing in the party >.>

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To be entirely fair though, Vaan was pigeon holed into the leading role via consumer testing and it half way ruined the beginning of the story for many people when the supposed 'main character' essentially became useless once they got passed a certain point early on. Basch was meant to be the lead for a good majority of the game's development and they never quite filed down the serial numbers enough to hide it.
That said I will say I do miss ARR's take on the Warrior of Light. You weren't some predestined hero that rose above the masses, you were simply one of many. Every other person who Lousouix saved at Carteneau was also considered a Warrior of Light and you all had equal importance within the realm. It's just that /you/ happened to be the one to meet with the Scions and be the character we followed behind... Dropping that plotline really hurt the story for me as it took away the potential to see what the other Warriors of Light might be doing when the story wasn't focused upon on and how they might eventually come to oppose us. Instead by HW, SE essentially made you the only one of importance and seems to have honestly forgotten that others existed in the first place.

WoW did this for years and almost every time we (the schmucks) did anything awesome Thrall (or another NPC) got credit. It became something of a joke when Thrall actually KS'd Deathwing from raiders in Cataclysm. After that the player became more important to the game's story.

Also in every Final Fantasy game the main hero and his party are the "Warriors of Light".