Fordola

If they gave her any actual redeeming qualities (or at least made them more apparent) then maybe I'd be all for a redemption arc, but as it stands I'd rather see her dead. Same for Yotsuyu.

I guess I'm in the minority, I don't agree with what she did but I like her character.

I want her and yotsuyu dead personally.

they said same about the person that killed Haurchent

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Originally Posted by 347SPECTRE

If they gave her any actual redeeming qualities

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See, I think this is my issue with Fordola, besides her sad excuse of a backstory. At least Yotsuyu had domestic abuse to back up her hatred for her people, and if you ignore that, she has her cattiness and willpower going for her. Fordola had nothing special, she was just Zenos's dog.

I feel fairly confident that SE is going to do one of two things with her-

Either she is going to see the light, be redeemed, and become an important and welcome member of the new Ala Mhigan state while almost everyone conveniently forgets the atrocities she committed in the name of the Empire and the few who don't are presented as bitter, piteous villains who can't let go of the past and who we have to fight and/or kill to protect her.

Or she is going to hold on to her Imperial loyalties until some bitter end where she sees the light at the last moment and sacrifices her life and dies in a shining blaze of glory to save something or someone important (Lyse/the WoL/Ala Mhigo as a whole/etc.)

Personally, I will like her so much, much more if SE uses neither of these tropes with her as they have been done to death in almost every form of media, and literally anything else they do would be more interesting and make her a better character.

I really don't know what they plan to do with either Fordola or Yotsuyu. Both are similar narratives of victims of circumstance that the empire played to it's advantage.

All I know is Ysayle's non-redemption was trash, with her story ended up far less than, "oh no I killed children and ruined the lives of thousands of the poorest people of Ishgard, I need to fix this!" and more "Wait... I'm not actually Shiva....? ....oh."

And then she jumped off a dragon from thousands of feet in the air and made Estinien sad.



So, honestly, SE doesn't have to do too much to be a step up from Ysayle's redemption.

It would be interesting what SE will do to both Fordola and Yotsuyu in the future MSQ.
Both were pretty horrible in their own ways, but Yotsuyu was worse because she made innocent people suffer because of her past which is selfish. Fordola at least thought she was doing something for her countrymen but it wasn't the best idea ever.

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Originally Posted by ErryK

See, I think this is my issue with Fordola, besides her sad excuse of a backstory. At least Yotsuyu had domestic abuse to back up her hatred for her people, and if you ignore that, she has her cattiness and willpower going for her. Fordola had nothing special, she was just Zenos's dog.

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Idk, being born and raised as a soldier slave seems like a pretty strong reason to do what she did, she also explained her intent, to get the empire to recognize her homeland as people, to give them better rights, which is wrong but you can't expect her to just follow the resistance when she had been trained as a garlean slave-soldier since birth, watching the ala mhigan resistance fail to the empire countless times.

She won't be redeemed because she has done too many bad things, but she won't die a villain, I'm fully expecting her to die protecting Ala Mhigo when the garleans launch their counterattack.

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Originally Posted by alimdia

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I don't expect much out of a flat character in the first place. She's such a predictable character. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

people keep saying that the empire could overpower the eorzea easy if they bring more legions. this may be true but don't forget that the empire is quite big and probably has a lot of enemies across the globe. we are only 1 country (or 2 now cause doma). in both ala mihgo and doma they treated the people badly and they both had underground resistance groups waiting for a chance to take it back.

its a risk vs reward thing. altho their pride and of course a show that they arent weak is probably needed on their part so who knows what they will do to fight back. if they do nothing than they will be seen as weak. but they cant just send their whole army

While I'm fully expecting Garlemald to sooner or later retaliate, if only to avoid seeming weak, I'd honestly be kinda surprised if we saw much of the total army being deployed, since as AngaratoSvartberg said, Garlemald in all likelyhood has quite a few enemies beyond just Eorzea, but from what I recall Hien also mentioned he'll be sending out shinobis to the other occupied nations, with the expressed purpose of spreading the news of Doma and Ala Mhigo's liberation. In effect, quite possibly spawning even more rebellions, since we dont really have a reason to believe the other nations are being treated much better, and they now have proof that it can be done. That the empire's army is not invincible.

So not only would the empire be leaving themselves open, if they comitt too many legions to retaliating for our move on Ala Mhigo and Doma. But they'd also risk loosing control over even more territory, as the people rise up against them

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Originally Posted by Rymm

I feel fairly confident that SE is going to do one of two things with her-

Either she is going to see the light, be redeemed, and become an important and welcome member of the new Ala Mhigan state while almost everyone conveniently forgets the atrocities she committed in the name of the Empire and the few who don't are presented as bitter, piteous villains who can't let go of the past and who we have to fight and/or kill to protect her.

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I have this bad feeling that the above might happen, but I really don't want it to go down like that. Mostly because it makes no sense within the world (an exception to the rule for the sake of "story"). If they can forgive her to the point where she becomes welcome, then that should be a common occurrence. Not something that happens just because she has a name/story relevance and isn't NPC #1003.

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Originally Posted by alimdia

Idk, being born and raised as a soldier slave seems like a pretty strong reason to do what she did, she also explained her intent, to get the empire to recognize her homeland as people, to give them better rights, which is wrong but you can't expect her to just follow the resistance when she had been trained as a garlean slave-soldier since birth, watching the ala mhigan resistance fail to the empire countless times.

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I just felt that she was selfish. She disliked Ala Mhigans because they made her look bad (at least, that's what I took from it).

She apparently believed that her actions were for the good of her people, but her way of thinking was completely backwards. She knew the Garleans looked down on Ala Mhigans, but instead of wanting to be free of their rule, she wanted their acceptance. It's hard to say just how much her views were warped (probably a lot), but joining the oppressor is far easier and less frightening than standing up for yourself. When given the choice to follow Zenos' orders and kill her men or not, she ultimately chose to sacrifice them. Her failure or their life. Everything seemed to be about her deep down.

Perhaps we can't blame Fordola for doing what was necessary to survive, but she had choices to make and she arguably chose selfishly.

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Originally Posted by Rymm

I feel fairly confident that SE is going to do one of two things with her-

Either she is going to see the light, be redeemed, and become an important and welcome member of the new Ala Mhigan state while almost everyone conveniently forgets the atrocities she committed in the name of the Empire and the few who don't are presented as bitter, piteous villains who can't let go of the past and who we have to fight and/or kill to protect her.

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I don't see us needing to protect her when her Resonance let her fight Lyse and Alisaie at the same time, without getting hit once, and nearly kill the latter. The WoL was only able to beat her into submission with what was effectively an aetheric flashbang.

She's an evul cow

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Originally Posted by Ametrine

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Yes and no. Basically, Hraesvelgr told Ysayle that she was no different than Thordan, spinning lies for others to follow blindly.

With Fordola, we can kind of see the same thing happening here. Telling Lyse they will never free Ala Mhgio, only to witness it happen while a prisoner to the Alliance. For all intents and purposes, we accomplished something thought impossible (not too dissimilar to ending a 1,000 year war with dragon-kind).

Also, I think that people are gravely underestimating how much of a difference having the WoL around is. Without the WoL, pretty sure the Alliance would not have the strength to actually take back Ala Mhigo. Pretty sure Zenos would have slaughtered them all. Afterall, his whole gimmick was having you as a play toy simply because you showed promise, unlike everyone else. We already know our characters are pretty untouchable at this point (and I hope SE does something to make this perceived power come into check).

Right now, be it Fordola or Yotsuyu, I can't really care about them. They didn't leave a strong impression, thanks to Zenos overshadowing them. They're just underlings following orders. We know their motives for why they took orders to begin with. Their life, or death, have no actual bearing on the story that we can really feel since they were made rather.................. sterile from the events happening (Yotsuyu washed away with Gotetsu; Fordola arrested and removed in Alliance prison).

I don't expect a redemption arc for Fordola because, in her mind, after all her efforts to save Ala Mhigo and earn them (and herself) the respect of their Garlean superiors, the Alliance marched in and doomed the nation to destruction. As far as she's concerned, we haven't liberated Ala Mhigo, but instead removed any possibility that they will ever be allowed to be part of the Empire. The Garleans are still a threat and when (NOT "if") they return in force, they will NOT give Ala Mhigo a second chance. They will burn it to the ground.

Our defeat of Zenos hasn't "opened her eyes", but instead proven to her that the entire Allied nations are full of the blind; idiots who can't see how futile it is to stand against Garlemand. Effectively, we've destroyed her, we've destroyed her homeland, and we've destroyed everything she's been working to accomplish her entire life. No, she won't want redemption. She'll be wanting revenge.

Plus that eye thing. Who knows if it'll still play some odd role that will render her "beyond redemption" as well as the reasons stated by LineageRazor above.

Once again, no villain is truly evil. They'll fire the shot, they'll kill the man, but unless they're truly a sociopath, there's some kind of love or care behind it.

Can't recall where I heard it, but there's an old saying similar to "You can either die on your feet, or live on your knees". Growing up in occupied Ala Mihgo, she and others were taught service to the empire could - one day - earn you citizenship, and thus, a better life. We all saw the alternatives. While older, prideful Ala Mihgans and some of the younger hot-blooded ones chose to rebel and fight, she chose what she felt was the "on your feet" option, though it was actually quite the opposite. Service for freedom, in hopes she could be an example to her people, and to the Garleans that Ala Mihgans weren't just "savages". Perhaps if the right time or opportunity struck, she too could've fanned flames of rebellion, but fear and not knowing there was possibly anything better is what drove her actions.

Now, in a free Ala Mihgo, she's going to have to deal with the karma of those actions. She's a war criminal. A traitor, even if she meant well (again, "not truly evil"). All she ever knew was "service for freedom" but now she's free. Literally, "what now?" Not likely they'd even trust her with a fork in hand now, let alone a sword, so she's going to have to find another way. My writer's blood is surging to see what becomes of her. Will she run back to the empire because it's all she knows? Would they even take her? Will Ala Mihgo accept a prodigal daughter who killed her own? ("Find out next time in. . ." lol)

I think she and Raubahn are the two characters I'm most interested in seeing develop at this moment in the story.

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Originally Posted by JunseiKei

Plus that eye thing. Who knows if it'll still play some odd role that will render her "beyond redemption" as well as the reasons stated by LineageRazor above.

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Maybe Fordola's unique perspective, followed by seeing how the WoL all but carries the nations, might see them as a god that needs slaying.


or that she, along with other loyalists, are finding themselves freer "in oppression with the hope of belonging" than they are "in a free country as a pariah". Having her own lament about how "citizenship gaurantees naught" she might see that story played out over a lot of different people by the "liberators".

I really hope we will see a lot more of Fordola!

http://karamail.nerim.net/elys/SS/FF14/LoveFordola.jpg

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people keep saying that the empire could overpower the eorzea easy if they bring more legions.

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People also forgot that the last time the Empire tried an near full scale invasion of Eorzea, Midgardsomr woke up and destroyed the Agrius and wiped out the Empire's fleet. There's also the issue of the primals, which in Eorzea are a lot more powerful for reasons. I don't remember the full Company of Heroes story, but they suffered significant losses against a singple primal. You can bet a full scale invasion would result in the tribes all summoning extremely powerful primals that would either temper of eradicate the Empire's forces. That's why the Empire's agents in Eorzea are always snooping around the ruins of the Allagan empire, hoping to find something that will either neutralize or control the primals.

The Empire is strong, no doubt, but it doesn't have infinite resources. The whole reason we were able to topple the provincial government in Doma was because the Zenos deemed Doma conquered and reduced the standing troop presence to a minimal. Same situation with Ala Mihgo, 25 years of occupation means a reduced presence and coupled with the sudden fall of Doma means little time to react. It's possible the Empire could try to reclaim those areas, but then they'd be facing the combined forces of the Eorzea alliance, Doma, and Ala Migho. This is in addition to maintaining control over existing areas and maintaining an watch and small prescence in Eorzea itself.

As for Fordola, hell no, we don't need a redemption story. She's burned far too many bridges to go back. I'd rather see her become even more hate and spite filled against us. Let her become an enemy with a deep seeded, personal vengeance against us.

To be honest I'd only hope to see her have a trial and either be put in jail for however long rather than going "Oh looks she a good guy now". Her actions had severe consequences and well especially being willing towards the empire rather than forced. Heck even if the long term I'd much prefer it if she id become 'good' but it all being a ruse so she goes back to the empire.

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Originally Posted by LineageRazor

....No, she won't want redemption. She'll be wanting revenge.

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I'd be much happier if this was her story in the future patches.

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Originally Posted by JunseiKei

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I didn't get this since Ysayle was just a child when she had the echo vision that showed the true past of Shiva and Hreasvelgr, when she stumbled into the dragon fleeing from the growing snowdrifts. If Hreasvelgr intended this with his setting her straight, then she's cast in an EVEN WORSE light, since she knew she was destroying a city full of innocent people for TWO lies, verses just being a kid trying to make sense of what she saw.

If anything, Hreasvelgr seemed personally offended by Ysayle's take on the woman that was basically his wife. Primal Shiva was just Ysayle's power fantasy.

Ysayle's whole thing was she was just a child that deluded herself with flights of fantasy, and rather than redeeming herself for the awful things she did to service it, she was just slapped down to earth and performed a Heroic Suicide instead of facing it in the long term.