As Current Info Stands Who Will Be Lamer in SB, MNK or WHM?

Monk main here! Just wanted to get out there that I really can't find any complaints for the changes that are coming! Seems to me that we'd be able to hit harder and faster than before, and I welcome that. Monk is and always will be a physical damage dealing class, and I wouldn't want it turning into something it isn't. Sure it doesn't look as fancy as all the other classes, but it looks like it'll hold up just as well as them. Also, for those complaining about shoulder tackle, I guess you don't play monk much. Any monk who actually takes their job seriously, finds even that skill entirely useful. Its a great gap closer, it stuns, and it even does damage! Best part of it is, its ogcd, so its really easy to weave into the rotation. And the new changes that alter it with the forms make it even more useful as it gives it more utility, and I approve of that too. As for riddle of earth- the way I see it, it looks to be a thing you pop just before a phase change, so you're ready and waiting to beat up that boss at full power, while mitigating a bit more damage to make it easier on the healers. Which, if it does work like that, will be really handy in tougher content, especially for people who are new to the job (Though I can't say I approve of a skill that is solely focused for raiding purposes...) Just my two cents!

Riddle of Earth could have been awesome were it something more along the lines of an effect to make 'immovable and stoic as a mountain' maybe binding you in place while giving you a DMG- and preserving your stack timer; best thing in the world for a phase change in any fight. But this one is hyper-situational that the encounter would require you to take damage mid phase change or during super move, and that's not harmful... but not really helping either. Riddle of Fire lets you hit harder but drops what makes MNK fun to play which is speed.Every Monk wants to go fast as they can while hitting as hard as they can, but if you wanted to just be a slow heavy hitter there were other DPS to play; this seriously is deja vu with Bard and the Wanderer's BS albeit on a smaller scale at least. Then the shoulder mastery is great... for maybe pvp. The knockback from earth or the double-dash from wind would have been great there, but pvp is getting a rework so no use there. In PvE both of those would be so situational that again, it doesn't hurt but how useful it'll be is questionable. This is also reminding me of Warden's Paeon from BRD too, when it first released it was such a niche, situational tool that you would have to have fights designed with it in mind to have any use.

The irony in these mindings is that BRD's initial changes for HW made me so unhappy to play it that I shifted to another DPS to play and that's where I settled and really enjoyed MNK, and now I feel I'm going to really enjoy BRD's development so much more than MNK's.

At least WHM don't have to buy any flowers for the rest of their life.
They've got their own lilies now.
Beautiful,isn't it ?

Honestly, as a MNK main the biggest disappointment to me is actually the loss of off-combo GCDs (ToD and Fracture) together with the Demolish change to 18s. It's easily going to give us the most bland rotation in the game. No ToD timer to consider, no Fracture spacers to get the extra Demolish tick before reapplying it... It's just alternate the first two WS's every other cycle and use Demolish at the end every 3rd cycle. That's it. That's MNK now.

I see where the Monk issue is, you aren't getting much in terms of new abilities. Your rotations are being simplified and you are just getting these riddles which combo with other skills based on how they are used.

You get this situation Earth ability which is very situational, may be useful as an HP sponge in a tricky situation or reducing damage you take but overall it doesn't do much. While the knockback to the shoulder tackle sounds nice it's still situational as you don't know what can be pushed back but odds are only trash mobs will be pushed back.

Fire Riddle is a dmg boost but at the cost of speed, which makes the gains less grand then they appear, unless there was a way to keep the fire burning longer which there isn't, it's not a very engaging mechanic. Even if it was something like, burns 1 Chakra every 5 seconds, so you aim to keep your Chakra up in order to keep the Fire Riddle active, where maybe when it hits 30 seconds it starts to take 2 chakra per 5 seconds.

don't cares about monk when there's Sam.
still gonna play whm and jsut cast Medica II and regen. too lazy to play sch and ast.

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Originally Posted by Airget

You get this situation Earth ability which is very situational, may be useful as an HP sponge in a tricky situation or reducing damage you take but overall it doesn't do much. While the knockback to the shoulder tackle sounds nice it's still situational as you don't know what can be pushed back but odds are only trash mobs will be pushed back.

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that worst than this, the knockback for a melee dps that have simply 0 ranged attack... the charge is used for get close, not push enemy. that totally against the goal of the skill or the goal of the monk.

the trouble of SB monk is we don't get anything in reality. brotherhood (group buff) and deep meditation (trait) are mostly here for make viable the chakra system added in HW. the riddle of fire and earth are bad joke... we are not tank, we don't need a cd that is a cd of tank not of dps. Riddle of fire is going against everything that make the monk, means fast paced attacking dps.

and the tackle mastery is a total garbage only added for give a reason to keep relic of the V1... the elemental fist. most of the monk will only use fire,... earth is used for absorb one aoe of boss that can't be avoided and fist of wind is.... seriously why we still have this junk when they have take out usefull skill of our tool like touch of death. fist of wind is a total junk skill that have no real utility right now and will have far less utility with SB since sprint don't cost tp anymore.

yes whm have get the lili (that was changed since the media tour, cure 2 give one at all case, and the reduction of CD based on the pvp skill info are insane, 3 lili => -50% cd) but in the end you try to get new capacity, not amazing that true, and not adressing the core trouble inside the whm, but for the monk is kinda the situation where if i level to 70 i will not feel any difference, exept i will be able to toss more often forbidden chakra... nice... *sighs*

A better buff to monks would've been a balance that we ALWAYS have on. Cause I'm sorry.. when you're the TOP DPS in any dungeon and the astro gives the BALANCE to someone ELSE.. fuck that shit. Take away both earth and wind and give fire the balance buff that's always on. Give us more damage and give us back our speed. The raid things we got feel like a joke cause really? Brotherhood looks like it'll ONLY be useful if you have the correct party members for it. What if you're the ONLY melee? Well brohood isn't going to work for you now. And really? I love shoulder tackle.. it's my spin dash. But WHY did it have to have effects that make me turn OFF fist of fire?

Kill the other fist, buff fire and put the shoulder tackle buff with fire also. And that one move is still there? One llm punch? WHY? Tornardo kick could've been awesome if you just oh I dunno... took the taking my GL stacks away and buffed it's damage. Make us WANT to use the skill more. Not LESS. SE it's not hard to give monk some love... but nevermind.. gotta baby Samurai. T.T
- Yes I'm salty. - But at least I'm trying to give SE some feedback on how to not mess up such an easy job to fix.

Neither will be lame. Your making assumptions before having a chance to test it out.