Lodestone census march 2017

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Originally Posted by Elim

I think the average NA players simply can't handle the pressure. Too much tippy toeing around facts to avoid hurting someones feelings. Trying to help a NA player get better usually ends with them having an epic meltdown, no matter how much you sugar coat it. That's why, at least from my experience, those of us that are successful raiders tend to stick together, and are wary about bringing in new blood.

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lots of raiders tend to be impatient and toxic when something goes wrong. they seem to forget that they still do mess things up and messed them up when they were learning. combine that with raiders not really wanting to teach and limited opportunities to learn the fights(if you aren't doing the content within the first month I'd say your SOL).

I don't think it's that Japanese players are 'better'. It's that the Japanese community is much, much friendlier and more willing to help their fellow players out. There's a different mindset and culture at play whilst for many on the NA and EU servers it's more about instant gratification and little to no tolerance of mistakes.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

lots of raiders tend to be impatient and toxic when something goes wrong. they seem to forget that they still do mess things up and messed them up when they were learning. combine that with raiders not really wanting to teach and limited opportunities to learn the fights(if you aren't doing the content within the first month I'd say your SOL).

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Different mentalities and patience. Raiding requires you to have full knowledge of your class (and others, in order to interact with them), fast reaction and awareness. If you take someone who isn't familiar with those, no matter how patient you are, it's most likely not gonna work out. They won't change the playstyle over night, and this is why people who want to clear raids can't really bother with it. Combined with the weekly system this game has that punishes players for playing outside of the static...

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

lots of raiders tend to be impatient and toxic when something goes wrong. they seem to forget that they still do mess things up and messed them up when they were learning. combine that with raiders not really wanting to teach and limited opportunities to learn the fights(if you aren't doing the content within the first month I'd say your SOL).

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Sure, that can be the case. I consider myself a huge asshole, but that's because I've given up trying to be helpful after getting my face ripped off by newbies one too many times.

Let's not forget that the way raid rewards are handled can discourage players helping out others with raiding. bring in a person who's cleared into your clear party and your potential rewards get slashed in half for the same amount of work...with no way of rolling again for the week.

Note that characters level 35 and under are not counted for this, so those over 500k active players don't include new players or low level alts, so for Balmung any level 1 RP alt will not count, the number is high because people stack there like sardines.

I'm calling it, Balmung will have a 2-3 hours long login queue when SB launches.

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Originally Posted by ShinMetsu

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Yeah, sure, spend more time raiding here for less content than WoW. Why aren't people making lines for that, y'all dirty gaijins are so unskilled :rolleyes:

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So it wouldn't make sense for WoW to have more raiders than casuals, as they have like 3-4 times the sub numbers!

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They don't.

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Originally Posted by Kit-Kat

Different mentalities and patience. Raiding requires you to have full knowledge of your class (and others, in order to interact with them), fast reaction and awareness. If you take someone who isn't familiar with those, no matter how patient you are, it's most likely not gonna work out. They won't change the playstyle over night, and this is why people who want to clear raids can't really bother with it. Combined with the weekly system this game has that punishes players for playing outside of the static...

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Your greatly over estimating what it takes to raid in this game its not much You need to have your rotation on muscle memory and then time to go into the fights and memorize mechanics which are just the basic mechanics you see in any dungeon remixed. its a catch 22 you need to be able to get into the raids to learn them but no one is willing to take them into raids for legit reasons and the loot system isn't helping either.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Your greatly over estimating what it takes to raid in this game its not much You need to have your rotation on muscle memory and then time to go into the fights and memorize mechanics which are just the basic mechanics you see in any dungeon remixed. its a catch 22 you need to be able to get into the raids to learn them but no one is willing to take them into raids for legit reasons and the loot system isn't helping either.

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You just basically said what I said, with different words. Except for the mechanics part, which aren't as forgiving as dungeon ones.

Wait lol, 26,000 active users on Balmung? (A number that can easily explode at expansion, I assume all numbers will temporarily increase).

And lets see, 30 plots per ward, subdivisions, 12 districts, 3 soon to be 4 housing areas.. 2,880 Houses available. (2160 currently, all full)

So maybe 10% of the active users can partake in the content, and that's not even including FCs as entities which share this content too LOL. (With weird fluctuation due to some accounts (not a user ofc) being able to own many houses and others not caring to, and others doing it purely for the money)

Oh, and the apartments which are tiny half featured houses are full too :3, which if anyone wanted to know the max number of apartments it's 49,152 (36,864 currently, all full - usually). Useless for FC, and anyone who actually wanted a /house/.

SE: Housing System is great, keep the paid server transfers up on Balmung too~!!! lol /sigh XD

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Originally Posted by ShinMetsu

Do you even realize how little sense you make?
Obviously those are just excuses to cover up that the average JP player is way better than the average NA/EU player.

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Actually reading the data you can't make that comparison, just that Japanese have progressed farther as a % vs characters - it doesn't say how many "can't" pass it just that more Japanese characters have (keeping in mind not everyone has to be actually where the server designates too). It could be an entirely on average different desire of content, for example more NA/EU interested in glamour, chatting, RP, or other non-heavy progression content. You're not comparing skill in the data, it can't consistently and with enough accuracy reveal that info - just that they've progressed farther as % vs characters.

You started to allude the NA/EU is interested in different content already, but I'm just saying you can't use the data as a proof of any skill on average. RP joe shmo that doesn't care to progress could actually be good, the data wouldn't tell you that. Considering that Balmung probably has a greatly reduced clear rate as well due to the /massive/ amount of RP characters, in general RP may be a more western thing who knows but Balmung absolutely would experience a shift in data because of that.

There maybe a larger number of players that realizes they can get BiS, or pretty damn close, with just A9S and A10S that they (I) don't care about 11 or 12.

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Originally Posted by Shougun

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Here's a little test for you. Try to DF with complete randoms any savage turn, specially on the current tier.

As somebody that plays in a JP world, albeit the least successful one, this kinda confirms my theories that the scene here in JP is doing much better.
I talk from a PUG perspective, I usually hear from podcasts and such that people have problems doing PUG content and wipe on stuff, that has never really been the case for me.

As someone from the top raiding server for JP, i can confirm we can pug in raid finder and still clear :D

I know these are the highest numbers we've had so far. But generally speaking, raiding is not popular in NA/EU compared to JP.
Many players don't even wan't to attempt it. It makes me wonder why?

I dragged a friend of mine who have never done Savage or Extreme before into Sephirot EX learning party. Surprisingly he was top DPs and he learned the fight very fast compared to the rest with him.

I told him that he has skills to go for Savage. He playes on PS4 so didn't have a way of knowing how good he was. He always thought that he was underperforming.
Now he is jumping into every Extreme learning party (Has cleared them) and is going for Savage (Cleared some of it).

I think it is because raiding scene has a bad image in NA/EU.

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Originally Posted by Dalmacus

As someone from the top raiding server for JP, i can confirm we can pug in raid finder and still clear :D

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I think it is because JP have very different mentality than NA/EU where people here rarely/if ever admit to their mistakes and just point fingers at each other.
Also, the average skill level on JP is way higher compared to NA/EU :)

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Originally Posted by Kit-Kat

Here's a little test for you. Try to DF with complete randoms any savage turn, specially on the current tier.

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Data sample minimal*, use of OPs data inappropriate. Anecdotal evidence. Broad assumptions. Not impressive way to prove a point.. How people use the tools can also differ as well, talking to my friend at least it appears statics is more often a thing here (which would leave our DF more bare than people who don't - needs further examination).

With so many variables to make anything worth anything you'll need a lot, of a lot - you'll get neither with OP or anecdotal. (To prove skill of the entire population, or even capable skill since you'll have trouble with people who don't even care to try).

*Big numbers with OP, but it doesn't examine data in a way that'd prove the point - just what interests people (important to add is the per user - is per character).

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Originally Posted by Yeol

I know these are the highest numbers we've had so far. But generally speaking, raiding is not popular in NA/EU compared to JP.
Many players don't even wan't to attempt it. It makes me wonder why?

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'Cause EU/NA has WoW, JP doesn't.

Really it boils down to the special snowflake mentality. EU/NA have a bizarre mindset of "it's my sub I play how I want" and don't take criticism. People white-knighting those unwilling to learn are equally as bad.

You know, maybe it's time people disperse from Balmung. The number is way too unreasonably high.

Oh great, It's that thread were raiders shame the NA/EU players because they're doing other things.

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Originally Posted by ToasterMan

Oh great, It's that thread were raiders shame the NA/EU players because they're doing other things.

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Originally Posted by Enyalios

Really it boils down to the special snowflake mentality. EU/NA have a bizarre mindset of "it's my sub I play how I want" and don't take criticism. People white-knighting those unwilling to learn are equally as bad.

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Perhaps its the fact that neither side is working well with each other, compared to the jp, due to how they were taught to use the duty finder in game. It's a deeply ingrained problem because it's a lesson taught real early simply for the sake of clearing. No one is going to feasibly demand a player read guides of satasha and titan normal before they do them, but that is the regular demand for content at endgame. players simply are not taught the slightest part of what life is like at lvl60 or raiding until the worst point, the climax of ARR.

With an overreliance on dps to detriment of using other abilities, ffxiv is in this wierd place where it is trying to be simple, yet complex, and has problems at both.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

Perhaps its the fact that neither side is working well with each other, compared to the jp, due to how they were taught to use the duty finder in game.

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Or people just don't care as much as they thought they did. Between crafting, playing other games, roleplaying, real life obligations, I really don't put that much time towards Savage. I really don't care if I finish it or not.

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Originally Posted by ToasterMan

Or people just don't care as much as they thought they did. Between crafting, playing other games, roleplaying, real life obligations, I really don't put that much time towards Savage. I really don't care if I finish it or not.

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That's true. I ran myself ragged trying to finish coil before heavensward, thinking "no one will run it, and I'll never get it done! ; ; " , now, Yoshi P could stick a mount, a furniture, and three dancing Au Ra at the end of a12s, and I couldn't care less. xD

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

Judging from what I've seen from what the jp servers post compared to us is the have more of a community approach. Where as people use their raid clears here as a symbol of elitism. And I'm pretty sure everyone of there party finders don't have no bonus on them

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I came from JP center, now I m in EU center
I dont do raid much back in JP center, but I have to agree back in JP center the PF is slightly more newbie friendly, alot of practice groups and they are usually very patience
I try making practice in EU, but it usually took 30min+ to fill all role, and it usually disband after 2-3 wipe despite I clearly say it is practice group
I could not represent the whole EU/JP data center, but I would not disagree my experience in EU data center is abit discouraging in doing more raid

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Originally Posted by DamianFatale

You know, maybe it's time people disperse from Balmung. The number is way too unreasonably high.

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Agreed. SE should do what they did on ffxi. Offer free transfers off the server.

I always dislike the "Japanese players are just better people" kinda thing. Its kinda funny since there are rumors that exactly those Japanese players do have their websites to name shame players and on top of that its said that they want to kick people after the newest patch if they are wearing a certain weapon. I dont say that all Japanese players are like that and there is probably a difference in culture but I find it kinda sad that its often written like NA/EU is just bad. Maybe we have more people that just simply dont care about raids?

But I agree: Balmung is really big O_o.

I would love to know if jp players post up in idelshire to show off their mounts and raid gear like NA players. That would be a perfect tell all to see the differences in the two communities

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

I would love to know if jp players post up in idelshire to show off their mounts and raid gear like NA players. That would be a perfect tell all to see the differences in the two communities

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Do you think it's normal for people to be embarrassed and try to hide their accomplishments instead? It's just pixels sticking out, you can go to another town hub to chill if you think it's obnoxious. I'm casual to the max now but I don't get bothered by people showing off the stuff they've worked for or are proud of, whether it's mounts or raid weapons or exclusive glamour.

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Originally Posted by loreleidiangelo

Do you think it's normal for people to be embarrassed and try to hide their accomplishments instead? It's just pixels sticking out, you can go to another town hub to chill if you think it's obnoxious. I'm casual to the max now but I don't get bothered by people showing off the stuff they've worked for or are proud of, whether it's mounts or raid weapons or exclusive glamour.

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It doesnt bother me in the slightest why should anyone be embarrassed about it I love mounts etc, I was just saying I was curious as to whether or not they did the same exact thing

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Originally Posted by loreleidiangelo

Do you think it's normal for people to be embarrassed and try to hide their accomplishments instead?

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Neither - the normal thing would be to pat yourself on the shoulder, feel proud, maybe tell your closer friends and relatives about it to share the joy and leave it at that.
Showing off in Idyllshire seems more like making a giant copy of your college degree and posting it in the middle of the most populated mall you can find for everyone to see. I can see why it bewilders people. It's weird. But I treat it like Jehova's witnesses: Smile and politely close the door/walk past.

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Originally Posted by Enyalios

Really it boils down to the special snowflake mentality. EU/NA have a bizarre mindset of "it's my sub I play how I want" and don't take criticism. People white-knighting those unwilling to learn are equally as bad.

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This, pretty much. JP players generally think of the community and how their playing will impact other players around them; they communicate and work together to achieve their goal. Over here, it's mainly the mindset of "me me me I get /mine/ first I play how /I/ want and if we wipe after one try and no communicaton you're all noobs gtfo."

Woooo!! Famfrit in the bottom let's goooo. My server may be small but the problem I have with Alex savage is that people don't like playing with a pally, my main, and they don't like playing with 'Famfrit scrubs'. Alexander Savage content I found to be a toxic environment so I have chosen to do other things like level crafting and fishing.